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Trump's US Threat to Greenland (which belongs to Denmark)

Jack by the hedge said:
What's the 4D chess endgame? Europe spends lots more on its defence, so the US can disengage from any concerns of having to defend Europe from Russia? So now Trump has created a new peer adversary in a well-armed and distinctly less-beholden Europe. Does that help? And what of Canada? Assuming 4D chess Trump doesn't really think they want to be absorbed, and doesn't intend that, he's definitely pushing Canada away with his creepy chat-up lines, toward the rest of NATO I suppose. How does that help either?

While it's tempting to imagine there are smart-but-evil people scheming behind Trump's throne and directing his moves, it's far from clear they're playing a coherent game or guiding him in useful directions.
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Once again, the parrellel between many American conservatives and the conservatives in Germany when Hitler came to power are striking.
 
theprestige said:
I think it's pretty ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ clear that Greenland has no standing to negotiate. But don't let that stop you from being wrong.
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Define standard to negotatite. Greenland has abut the same standard to negotite the the 13 colonies did at the start of the American revolution.
Unless you are going full imperalist and want might make right to rule.
 
dudalb said:
Zig and a lot of his Fellow Republicans remind me of the Conseratives in Nazi Germany when Hitler came to power; deep down they did not really like him, though of him as a crude upstart, but nevertheless supported him under the delusion they could somehow come to manage and contorl him. Did not work out well for them.
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Every Republican president is Hitler. Every single one, without exception. There is no persuasive power in the accusation.

"The dark night of fascism is always descending in the United States and yet lands only in Europe."
 
Jack by the hedge said:
What's the 4D chess endgame? Europe spends lots more on its defence, so the US can disengage from any concerns of having to defend Europe from Russia? So now Trump has created a new peer adversary in a well-armed and distinctly less-beholden Europe.
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Europe being able to defend itself won't turn it into any more of an adversary than it already is. And the point of getting them capable of defending themselves is so that we can pivot to focus on confronting China, which is far more of a threat to US interests than Russia is.

This isn't a secret, it's not a mystery, and it's not even complicated.
 
dudalb said:
Define standard to negotatite. Greenland has abut the same standard to negotite the the 13 colonies did at the start of the American revolution.
Unless you are going full imperalist and want might make right to rule.
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Standing, not standard. And the 13 colonies had zero standing to negotiate at the start of the revolution, which is why England didn't negotiate with them. It was only at the end of the revolution, when the colonies had demonstrated their might, that they earned standing to negotiate.

If you want to argue for a standard for standing other than might, you picked the wrong example.
 
Ziggurat said:
Standing, not standard. And the 13 colonies had zero standing to negotiate at the start of the revolution, which is why England didn't negotiate with them. It was only at the end of the revolution, when the colonies had demonstrated their might, that they earned standing to negotiate.

If you want to argue for a standard for standing other than might, you picked the wrong example.
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Taking Greenland would mean there end of NATO and a massive win for Putin without firing a shot. The Russian disinformation warriors will be high fiving for years.
 
So nobody is probably goint to want to talk with Trump's envoy. I guess that amount to ":Unemployed in Greenland".
 
a_unique_person said:
Taking Greenland would mean there end of NATO and a massive win for Putin without firing a shot. The Russian disinformation warriors will be high fiving for years.
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Taking Greenland by force would. That's not going to happen, though.
 
steenkh said:
Maybe it is a uniquely American view, because I have never heard of a U.S. president being accused of being a Hitler, not even during the Vietnam War where opposition to the U.S. was strongest in my youth.
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I mean some people may have accused past presidents of being fascist, only has turned out to be an actual fascist.
 
I remember GW Bush getting called Hitler a bit. Obama got it a LOT. Just think of Glenn Beck, then on FOX, with his weird connections of socialism, communism and nazism to portray Obama as Hitler.
 
Ziggurat said:
There's a thread on this forum specifically talking about such a comparison between Hitler and GW Bush. And you were in it. Did you forget?

B

Thread 'Moveon.org apologizes for Bush/Hitler comparison..'

They oughta move on, alright, after this gaffe. I'd swear they have some members posting here...

moveon apologizes
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I'm get this close to comparing him to Hitler. Not because he want's to kill all the Jews but because he thinks he can take whatever he wants for any reason that crosses his mind.
 
a_unique_person said:
I'm get this close to comparing him to Hitler. Not because he want's to kill all the Jews but because he thinks he can take whatever he wants for any reason that crosses his mind.
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And what do you think that comparison will accomplish? Again, every Republican presidential candidate is Hitler.
Syndrome.jpg
 
Greenland has about 20 Days left according to Donald.

Claims that Russian and Chinese ships are all over Greenland are false. Moreover, a 1951 agreement between the Kingdom of Denmark and the United States already grants the United States broad access to Greenland if it determines that there is a security threat.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2008024064783519812
 
UK Foreign Secretary Yvette Cooper, moments ago, just condemned Trump on Greenland:

“Let me be very clear on the UK position. Greenland is part of the Kingdom of Denmark, our close European partners and longstanding NATO allies. And all our countries work closely together on security issues and will always do so. The future of Greenland is a matter for the Greenlanders and Danes and no one else.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/2008246292363825617
 
a_unique_person said:
No wonder Putin is never going to give in on Ukraine. He can see the end of NATO is in sight.
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Could it be that the hold he has on Trump is just that he's sold him the idea of a legacy - of being a Great Man, ruling a Great Power, controlling its Sphere of Influence?

It's certainly what Putin wants for himself and Russia. Sounds like something from the 19th century to me, but maybe it genuinely appeals to Trump.
 
Ziggurat said:
And what do you think that comparison will accomplish? Again, every Republican presidential candidate is Hitler.
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They were, in their day. The problem is that the Hitlers are getting worse and worse every time. Every new Republican president is a bigger Hitler than the last.
 
Greenland should be part of the US because nobody is gonna fight the US over Greenland.

TAPPER: Can you rule out that the US is going to take Greenland by force?

STEPHEN MILLER: Greenland should be part of the US. By what right does Denmark assert control over Greenland? The US is the power of NATO.

TAPPER: So you can't take military force off the table?

MILLER: Nobody is gonna fight the US militarily over the future of Greenland.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2008318519142686860
 
Ziggurat said:
Are you unable to understand context? Every republican presidential candidate is accused of being Hitler. None of them are actually Hitler. But you actually think some of them are. It's not the same at all.
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Le sigh.

Ziggurat said:
And what do you think that comparison will accomplish? Again, every Republican presidential candidate is Hitler.
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arthwollipot said:
They were indeed compared to Hitler, in their day.
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I didn't think I'd have to say that so explicitly since it was a direct response to your post which did say it explicitly, but there you go. I guess I'm not the one who is unable to understand context.
 
I don't really get the Greenland thing. For all practical purposes, Greenland is already available to the US for defense or whatever. No need to actually rule over it. Me wonders if Greenland is just one massive ridiculous distraction from something else.
 
Trausti said:
I don't really get the Greenland thing. For all practical purposes, Greenland is already available to the US for defense or whatever. No need to actually rule over it. Me wonders if Greenland is just one massive ridiculous distraction from something else.
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I think someone once told him that Russian ICBMs will approach America over Greenland and that factoid stuck in his head like a piece of old chewing gum.
 
He just wants it because he wants it and it should be his.

That's how he sees everything.

What's mine is mine and what's yours is mine as well.
 
Jack by the hedge said:
Could it be that the hold he has on Trump is just that he's sold him the idea of a legacy - of being a Great Man, ruling a Great Power, controlling its Sphere of Influence?

It's certainly what Putin wants for himself and Russia. Sounds like something from the 19th century to me, but maybe it genuinely appeals to Trump.
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It's not just Putin. The Millers, Voughts and Tech Bros are all in on the new "old deal' of American exceptionalism, Manifest Destiny and an American "Empire" otherwise known as a sphere of influence.
 
Trausti said:
I don't really get the Greenland thing. For all practical purposes, Greenland is already available to the US for defense or whatever. No need to actually rule over it. Me wonders if Greenland is just one massive ridiculous distraction from something else.
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The U.S. has wanted to acquire Greenland from Denmark since the 19th Century. The administrations of A. Johnson, Taft, Truman, and Eisenhower all approached Denmark with offers to acquire the island, so it is nothing new. The U.S. has a space base in Greenland, but that's it, as far as I know. Acquiring the island would allow for expansion of strategic defense operations there as well as access the island's mineral resources.
 
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