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Split Thread Trump-Kennedy center sues artist for cancelling because of name change

Um... do you know the history of Volkswagen? If your principles require you to have absolutely nothing to do with evil people, then you definitely should make sure you avoid Volkswagens like they're made of poisonous lava.
Why?

Volkswagen as they are today are down to the British Army Of Occupation.
The Royal Engineers put the production line back in to operation to provide small staff cars for the British and American forces in Germany. It also provided some work the locals.

So Volkswagen, if anything are rhe reverse of what you are trying to say.
 
A prayer for relief in an American civil complaint will typically ask for compensatory damages, punitive damages, attorney's costs, and a catch-all award for any other amount the court deems proper. A plaintiff may also pray for equitable relief such as release from a contractual obligation.

The amount of compensatory damages—actual loss incurred—must be supported in court by evidence and thus bear some resemblance to reality. The trier of fact will determine whether that evidence is credible and award an amount consistent with the strength of the evidence and the particulars of the claim.
Would the Kennedy Center's statement that the concert had "dismal ticket sales and lack of donor support" be admissible in the assessment of damages?
 
Would the Kennedy Center's statement that the concert had "dismal ticket sales and lack of donor support" be admissible in the assessment of damages?
That's one of the things various legal commentators make about Trump and his numerous legal cases. He does everything he can to undermine them with the public statements and records he and his administration make.
 
Why don't they just get someone else like Kid Rock to do the gig.

I think the loss of revenue is required to be there as evidence of material damage.
Do we have the actual suit yet?

It is a legally valid defence to bring up that the injured party would have been able to with reasonable effort remedy whatever they are claiming they have lost but chose not to. The word "reasonable" does a lot of work in contracts and contract disputes.
 
Do we have the actual suit yet?

It is a legally valid defence to bring up that the injured party would have been able to with reasonable effort remedy whatever they are claiming they have lost but chose not to. The word "reasonable" does a lot of work in contracts and contract disputes.
I think this would come up as "mitigation of loss" in assessment of damages rather than a defence - a claimant has a duty to take action to reduce any losses.

ETA: I'm not a lawyer.
 
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Do we have the actual suit yet?

It is a legally valid defence to bring up that the injured party would have been able to with reasonable effort remedy whatever they are claiming they have lost but chose not to. The word "reasonable" does a lot of work in contracts and contract disputes.
Again, Redd cancelled the day before he was scheduled to perform. It is not reasonable to expect a replacement act that fast.
 
Do we have the actual suit yet?
Nothing yet filed in the D.C. district court as of this writing.

Would the Kennedy Center's statement that the concert had "dismal ticket sales and lack of donor support" be admissible in the assessment of damages?
The actual financial position of the concert would be probative to that end. But mere statements made in public wouldn't necessarily be that evidence. The evidence in court would be financial records and statements attested to by the center's accountants regardless of any derogatory statements the center may have made in public.

Based on what the Kennedy Center posted on its Facebook page, I would think that performers would now have a solid case for being able to cancel performances based on the Kennedy Center driving away potential ticket buyers:
Any statement to the effect that the center is intentionally changing its image would help an argument founded on its reputation among performers and patrons.

If Redd argues that the change of name had the effect of changing the institution's reputation, and the center counters by saying the name change enhanced the center's reputation, then factual evidence concerning the change's reputational effect would become fair game for discovery, would it not?
Yes, to the effect that the change of reputation was intended.

Reputation is not really the right concept, though. As I said, what's Charlie Kirk's reputation? Was he a bigot or a saint? A better way to think about it is in terms of value to the other party.

It may not ultimately matter if the center's stated intent was to improve their reputation, but discovery reveals internal documents asserting that the real purpose was to flatter some fat orange slob. The intent to make a material change at all is more important than a disinterested party's opinion of the value of the change. What matters is the change in value to the other party, who does have an interest.

I have an antique parlour organ that belonged to my great grandmother. If I enter into a contract of sale for it to an antiques collector, and before I deliver it I strip its finish and give it a nice shiny new coat of polyurethane, the buyer might have cause to withdraw from the sale because I have altered the value of the artifact to the buyer. One could argue that I increased the organ's value by giving it a better, more protective finish. But that's not what the buyer considers valuable about an antique organ.

Similarly if I arrange to sell a batch of Sigmund the Sea Monster collectible action figures and I remove them from the packaging in order to fit them into the shipping box, the buyer may have cause to withdraw. Anyone who knows collectibles knows that their collectible value is destroyed by removing the object from its packaging. There is negligible loss of inherent value in doing so, but there is a tremendous loss of value to the buyer.

On the other side of the coin, have a look at my avatar. The contract by which I appeared in that stage production included clauses that forbade me from materially changing my appearance during the run of the show. This is common for actors. They may not cut or color their hair, or get new tattoos etc. This is because the other party to the contract—the theater—has contracted for my likeness as it stands. I have a duty of care to preserve that likeness in the form that has the contracted-for value to the theater. The point is not whether I would look good in a mustache or not. The point is whether that mustache alters my value to the other party as the contract regards it.

But of course we circle back to the initial breach. The performer may have a defense in saying that performing at the venue no longer has the original value when the contract was made, and that the change in value to the performer was the result of the venue's intentional actions and thereby releases him. But assuming standard contract terms, the clear breach is Redd's. Unilaterally withdrawing from a contract is legally risky. Redd's value to the center is in his actually performing as promised to the center's ticket holders, no matter how few of them there may have been. His failure to perform was clearly intentional and caused a clear injury. That's where a court will look first.
 
Nothing yet filed in the D.C. district court as of this writing.


The actual financial position of the concert would be probative to that end. But mere statements made in public wouldn't necessarily be that evidence. The evidence in court would be financial records and statements attested to by the center's accountants regardless of any derogatory statements the center may have made in public.


Any statement to the effect that the center is intentionally changing its image would help an argument founded on its reputation among performers and patrons.


Yes, to the effect that the change of reputation was intended.

Reputation is not really the right concept, though. As I said, what's Charlie Kirk's reputation? Was he a bigot or a saint? A better way to think about it is in terms of value to the other party.

It may not ultimately matter if the center's stated intent was to improve their reputation, but discovery reveals internal documents asserting that the real purpose was to flatter some fat orange slob. The intent to make a material change at all is more important than a disinterested party's opinion of the value of the change. What matters is the change in value to the other party, who does have an interest.

I have an antique parlour organ that belonged to my great grandmother. If I enter into a contract of sale for it to an antiques collector, and before I deliver it I strip its finish and give it a nice shiny new coat of polyurethane, the buyer might have cause to withdraw from the sale because I have altered the value of the artifact to the buyer. One could argue that I increased the organ's value by giving it a better, more protective finish. But that's not what the buyer considers valuable about an antique organ.

Similarly if I arrange to sell a batch of Sigmund the Sea Monster collectible action figures and I remove them from the packaging in order to fit them into the shipping box, the buyer may have cause to withdraw. Anyone who knows collectibles knows that their collectible value is destroyed by removing the object from its packaging. There is negligible loss of inherent value in doing so, but there is a tremendous loss of value to the buyer.

On the other side of the coin, have a look at my avatar. The contract by which I appeared in that stage production included clauses that forbade me from materially changing my appearance during the run of the show. This is common for actors. They may not cut or color their hair, or get new tattoos etc. This is because the other party to the contract—the theater—has contracted for my likeness as it stands. I have a duty of care to preserve that likeness in the form that has the contracted-for value to the theater. The point is not whether I would look good in a mustache or not. The point is whether that mustache alters my value to the other party as the contract regards it.

But of course we circle back to the initial breach. The performer may have a defense in saying that performing at the venue no longer has the original value when the contract was made, and that the change in value to the performer was the result of the venue's intentional actions and thereby releases him. But assuming standard contract terms, the clear breach is Redd's. Unilaterally withdrawing from a contract is legally risky. Redd's value to the center is in his actually performing as promised to the center's ticket holders, no matter how few of them there may have been. His failure to perform was clearly intentional and caused a clear injury. That's where a court will look first.

I'm wondering if the argument could be made that the name change makes appearing there, or not, a political act. Political speech effectively and that therefore he has a 1A right not to be forced to make a political statement against his will.
 
Nothing yet filed in the D.C. district court as of this writing.
If they go through with the lawsuit, and I'm not convinced that they will, it will be interesting to see what they list as the plaintiff's name. If they use the new name, the first thing that I would do if I were Redd's attorney would be to file for a dismissal on the grounds that there legally is no such entity.
 
Trump Shared Clip Calling to Remove Kennedy Name From Kennedy Center

The segment Trump posted claimed Kennedy had been “elevated to obscene levels”
That would almost certainly be in violation of the law that named the center after Kennedy. It specifically states that the center is to be a memorial for Kennedy and the only such memorial in the District of Columbia. If the effect of removing Kennedy's name from it is to deny the namesake of the memorial (as opposed merely to polluting it) as mandated by law, then the legal case against Pres. Trump's attempt to rename the center for himself becomes so much more airtight.

If they go through with the lawsuit, and I'm not convinced that they will, it will be interesting to see what they list as the plaintiff's name. If they use the new name, the first thing that I would do if I were Redd's attorney would be to file for a dismissal on the grounds that there legally is no such entity.
That would almost certainly not matter. They could sue as The Kennedy Center d.b.a. the Trump-Kennedy Center.

I'm wondering if the argument could be made that the name change makes appearing there, or not, a political act. Political speech effectively and that therefore he has a 1A right not to be forced to make a political statement against his will.
I alluded to something like that when I offered the opinion that the prestige of the center was not so much in its having been named after Kennedy as in its value as a national performance venue regardless of its namesake. You could indeed argue that the renaming was intended as a political statement, and there is ample record to support this. And yes it could be argued that performing there would be considered an endorsement of such a political statement and that compulsory performance amounts to compulsory endorsement of a political message.

But again it comes down to trying to defend against the obvious, straightforward breach. You'd have to argue that the newly insinuated political endorsement actually exists and changes the value of the contract from the performer's perspective enough to warrant release from the obligation.
 
I'm wondering if the argument could be made that the name change makes appearing there, or not, a political act. Political speech effectively and that therefore he has a 1A right not to be forced to make a political statement against his will.
He isn't being forced to make a political statement against his will. You might note that they are not demanding that he actually perform there, nor is that even possible anymore since the performance date is already passed. The threatened lawsuit is to recover damages for failure to fulfill contractual obligations. The 1st amendment doesn't immunize you from contractual obligations.
 
He isn't being forced to make a political statement against his will. You might note that they are not demanding that he actually perform there, nor is that even possible anymore since the performance date is already passed. The threatened lawsuit is to recover damages for failure to fulfill contractual obligations. The 1st amendment doesn't immunize you from contractual obligations.

An unconstitutional contract can be enforced? Okay.
 
He isn't being forced to make a political statement against his will. You might note that they are not demanding that he actually perform there, nor is that even possible anymore since the performance date is already passed. The threatened lawsuit is to recover damages for failure to fulfill contractual obligations. The 1st amendment doesn't immunize you from contractual obligations.
Do you understand how a defense works in a lawsuit?
 
An unconstitutional contract can be enforced? Okay.
Why would you think the contract is unconstitutional? If you sign a contract to perform a speech act, and you do not perform that speech act, you are in breech of the contract. That doesn't mean that the speech is compelled. It's not, because the contract was voluntarily entered into. Keep in mind, the 1st amendment is about what the government can prohibit or compel, it does not limit what you can agree to. Furthermore, the 1st amendment doesn't actually distinguish between political and non-political speech, it's all protected. There's no first amendment implication in contracts for speech acts. If there were, you could never even have contracts for artistic performances.
 
If you sign a contract to perform a speech act, and you do not perform that speech act, you are in breech of the contract.
If you sign a contract to perform one kind of speech, but the other party changes the circumstances so that your contractually-obligated speech becomes a different kind of speech, you may not be in breach if you refuse to perform.
 
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If you sign a contract to perform one kind of speech, but the other party changes the circumstances so that your contractually-obligated speech becomes a different kind of speech, you may not be in breach.
That seems pretty dubious to me. I don't think the nature of his performance itself really gets affected by the venue name, even if the association offends him. But juries are fickle beasts, and it would not shock me if a DC jury essentially took a jury nullification route to try to stick it to Trump.

Also wouldn't shock me to see the matter settled out of court. Redd has probably never had so much publicity in his career, and the million dollar claim may be inflated from what they could actually recover from him even with a favorable decision. So some much smaller number covering the actual direct costs of preparing for the performance may not seem unreasonable for either side.
 
An unconstitutional contract can be enforced? Okay.
Yes, you can contract away your constitutional rights, and people routinely contract away their free speech rights such as for employment contexts. Many contracts contain boilerplate non-disparagement clauses. The question becomes whether restrictions on speech were expressed, intended, or reliably implied in the terms of the offer and acceptance.

The issue of political versus apolitical speech really is kind of a red herring. If you contract to provide a service to another party under no specific color, and the other party willfully changes the conditions of the service such that your service then acquires the color of endorsement for speech with which you disagree, you can argue that this is a material breach that releases you from the obligation, since the new color of endorsement wasn't part of the contract. Rather than say it is a compulsory endorsement of a political message, you can say it is compulsory endorsement of a message the contractor disagrees with and did not agree to when forming the contract.
 
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Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".

He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.

 
That seems pretty dubious to me. I don't think the nature of his performance itself really gets affected by the venue name, even if the association offends him.
Asked and answered. His assessment of the changed value to him to be associated with the organization under its new mission carries legal weight under contract law. It doesn't matter what someone else thinks of the name change. The letter to Redd and the public statements from the center make it plain that this was a change of mission, not just a benign label.
 
Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".
Haha, and of course there's nothing deranged about putting your own controversial name on something that you had nothing to do with creating. It's hilarious when the Trump regime tries to label as some kind of mental illness a perfectly reasonable reaction to their own provocative acts. "Let's jab the tiger with a pointed stick and then blame the tiger when it snarls."

He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.
That sounds like something from the Donald J. Trump Center for Circular Reasoning. "Their reaction to our politicization of a previously apolitical organization proves they were being political all along, even when it seemed like they weren't."
 
Are you talking WW2 Germany? Seems to me the country forgave and even rebuilt Germany. The Berlin Airlift was a mistake? We even made them an important ally and created airbases there. Should I also not have purchased a Krups Espresso machine? Or use T-Mobile wireless?
Or buy drugs from Bayer or Pfizer.

Benefit from actual literal nazis on a daily basis, no problem! Benefit from figurative "nazis" because it's trendy to hate on whoever has been defined as "the bad guy" this year, well that's just a no-go...
 
So you're saying that a performer would not have the right to cancel a performance even if the venue took an action (e.g., changed its name to something controversial) that decreased the performer's ability to sell tickets?
Again, IANAL. Nothing prevents them from cancelling their performance - they can do that no matter what. But the situation you describe is probably not sufficient to void the contract... thus they would be in breach and may be liable for the lost income of the venue.

On the other hand, if they did perform and had a measurable decrease in ticket sales, they could feasibly make a case for suing the venue for lost revenue and reputational damage. But they have to actually experience that loss first. And they have to not break the contract themselves.
 
This has ◊◊◊◊ all to do with the topic of this thread. It's off topic. Kindly keep your attempts to derail contained to one of the many, many, many threads that are already dedicated to letting a bunch of forumites vent their spleens about how Trump is the literal antichrist, the most evil genius ever who is orchestrating the downfall of civilization while simultaneously having the intellect of your average garden snail. Not even a high-achieving garden snail.

Genuinely, I'm just sick of every single damned thread ending up being a circle-jerk about how Trump is the worstest thing ever.
Triggered much? And it's right on topic. Which is how Trump is such a thin-skinned psychopath that he has to add his name to a national monument that is nothing to do with him in order to glorify himself. And should someone push back on that, pricks his ego, he resorts to baseless legal threats as his go-to response.
 
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Would the Kennedy Center's statement that the concert had "dismal ticket sales and lack of donor support" be admissible in the assessment of damages?
It just now clicked that the letter is attempting to hold Redd responsible for poor ticket sales and poor donor support in connection with the concert. Ticket sales, promotions, and business development are the responsibility of the venue, not the contractor artists. Absolutely Kennedy Center can sue Redd alleging breach of contract by Redd's not performing as promised and recover for the revenue lost in consequence of the breach. However under no fantasy of liability does a venue get to sue an artist for poor ticket sales that the venue was responsible for. It's the venue's responsibility to schedule performances that attract its desired business and to promote those performances accordingly.
 
Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".

He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.
Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
 
Or buy drugs from Bayer or Pfizer.

Benefit from actual literal nazis on a daily basis, no problem! Benefit from figurative "nazis" because it's trendy to hate on whoever has been defined as "the bad guy" this year, well that's just a no-go...
Do you think any German company that existed in the 30s is staffed and owned by "literal nazis"?
 
Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
Sumboddy called me?
ted-nugent-rock-roll-snub-crosby-diss.png
 
Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
Ticket sales are down across the board. I wouldn't be surprised if Donald Trump simply wants to put the Kennedy Center out of business for what he perceived as personal snubs against him during his first term.
 

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