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Split Thread Trump-Kennedy center sues artist for cancelling because of name change

Ziggurat said:
He isn't being forced to make a political statement against his will. You might note that they are not demanding that he actually perform there, nor is that even possible anymore since the performance date is already passed. The threatened lawsuit is to recover damages for failure to fulfill contractual obligations. The 1st amendment doesn't immunize you from contractual obligations.
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Do you understand how a defense works in a lawsuit?
 
P.J. Denyer said:
An unconstitutional contract can be enforced? Okay.
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Why would you think the contract is unconstitutional? If you sign a contract to perform a speech act, and you do not perform that speech act, you are in breech of the contract. That doesn't mean that the speech is compelled. It's not, because the contract was voluntarily entered into. Keep in mind, the 1st amendment is about what the government can prohibit or compel, it does not limit what you can agree to. Furthermore, the 1st amendment doesn't actually distinguish between political and non-political speech, it's all protected. There's no first amendment implication in contracts for speech acts. If there were, you could never even have contracts for artistic performances.
 
Ziggurat said:
If you sign a contract to perform a speech act, and you do not perform that speech act, you are in breech of the contract.
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If you sign a contract to perform one kind of speech, but the other party changes the circumstances so that your contractually-obligated speech becomes a different kind of speech, you may not be in breach if you refuse to perform.
 
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JayUtah said:
If you sign a contract to perform one kind of speech, but the other party changes the circumstances so that your contractually-obligated speech becomes a different kind of speech, you may not be in breach.
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That seems pretty dubious to me. I don't think the nature of his performance itself really gets affected by the venue name, even if the association offends him. But juries are fickle beasts, and it would not shock me if a DC jury essentially took a jury nullification route to try to stick it to Trump.

Also wouldn't shock me to see the matter settled out of court. Redd has probably never had so much publicity in his career, and the million dollar claim may be inflated from what they could actually recover from him even with a favorable decision. So some much smaller number covering the actual direct costs of preparing for the performance may not seem unreasonable for either side.
 
P.J. Denyer said:
An unconstitutional contract can be enforced? Okay.
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Yes, you can contract away your constitutional rights, and people routinely contract away their free speech rights such as for employment contexts. Many contracts contain boilerplate non-disparagement clauses. The question becomes whether restrictions on speech were expressed, intended, or reliably implied in the terms of the offer and acceptance.

The issue of political versus apolitical speech really is kind of a red herring. If you contract to provide a service to another party under no specific color, and the other party willfully changes the conditions of the service such that your service then acquires the color of endorsement for speech with which you disagree, you can argue that this is a material breach that releases you from the obligation, since the new color of endorsement wasn't part of the contract. Rather than say it is a compulsory endorsement of a political message, you can say it is compulsory endorsement of a message the contractor disagrees with and did not agree to when forming the contract.
 
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Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".

He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.

www.bbc.co.uk

Artists cancel Kennedy Center shows after Trump name change - BBC News

A jazz group cancels their New Year’s Eve shows at the Washington arts institution, days after a Christmas Eve concert was called off.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
 
Ziggurat said:
That seems pretty dubious to me. I don't think the nature of his performance itself really gets affected by the venue name, even if the association offends him.
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Asked and answered. His assessment of the changed value to him to be associated with the organization under its new mission carries legal weight under contract law. It doesn't matter what someone else thinks of the name change. The letter to Redd and the public statements from the center make it plain that this was a change of mission, not just a benign label.
 
Andy_Ross said:
Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".
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Haha, and of course there's nothing deranged about putting your own controversial name on something that you had nothing to do with creating. It's hilarious when the Trump regime tries to label as some kind of mental illness a perfectly reasonable reaction to their own provocative acts. "Let's jab the tiger with a pointed stick and then blame the tiger when it snarls."

Andy_Ross said:
He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.
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That sounds like something from the Donald J. Trump Center for Circular Reasoning. "Their reaction to our politicization of a previously apolitical organization proves they were being political all along, even when it seemed like they weren't."
 
acbytesla said:
Are you talking WW2 Germany? Seems to me the country forgave and even rebuilt Germany. The Berlin Airlift was a mistake? We even made them an important ally and created airbases there. Should I also not have purchased a Krups Espresso machine? Or use T-Mobile wireless?
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Or buy drugs from Bayer or Pfizer.

Benefit from actual literal nazis on a daily basis, no problem! Benefit from figurative "nazis" because it's trendy to hate on whoever has been defined as "the bad guy" this year, well that's just a no-go...
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
So you're saying that a performer would not have the right to cancel a performance even if the venue took an action (e.g., changed its name to something controversial) that decreased the performer's ability to sell tickets?
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Again, IANAL. Nothing prevents them from cancelling their performance - they can do that no matter what. But the situation you describe is probably not sufficient to void the contract... thus they would be in breach and may be liable for the lost income of the venue.

On the other hand, if they did perform and had a measurable decrease in ticket sales, they could feasibly make a case for suing the venue for lost revenue and reputational damage. But they have to actually experience that loss first. And they have to not break the contract themselves.
 
Emily's Cat said:
This has ◊◊◊◊ all to do with the topic of this thread. It's off topic. Kindly keep your attempts to derail contained to one of the many, many, many threads that are already dedicated to letting a bunch of forumites vent their spleens about how Trump is the literal antichrist, the most evil genius ever who is orchestrating the downfall of civilization while simultaneously having the intellect of your average garden snail. Not even a high-achieving garden snail.

Genuinely, I'm just sick of every single damned thread ending up being a circle-jerk about how Trump is the worstest thing ever.
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Triggered much? And it's right on topic. Which is how Trump is such a thin-skinned psychopath that he has to add his name to a national monument that is nothing to do with him in order to glorify himself. And should someone push back on that, pricks his ego, he resorts to baseless legal threats as his go-to response.
 
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Mojo said:
Would the Kennedy Center's statement that the concert had "dismal ticket sales and lack of donor support" be admissible in the assessment of damages?
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It just now clicked that the letter is attempting to hold Redd responsible for poor ticket sales and poor donor support in connection with the concert. Ticket sales, promotions, and business development are the responsibility of the venue, not the contractor artists. Absolutely Kennedy Center can sue Redd alleging breach of contract by Redd's not performing as promised and recover for the revenue lost in consequence of the breach. However under no fantasy of liability does a venue get to sue an artist for poor ticket sales that the venue was responsible for. It's the venue's responsibility to schedule performances that attract its desired business and to promote those performances accordingly.
 
Andy_Ross said:
Richard Grenell, the Kennedy Center's president, called the cancellations "a form of derangement syndrome".

He said that the artists cancelling shows "were booked by the previous far left leadership".

"Their actions prove that the previous team was more concerned about booking far left political activists rather than artists willing to perform for everyone regardless of their political beliefs," he added.
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Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
 
Emily's Cat said:
Or buy drugs from Bayer or Pfizer.

Benefit from actual literal nazis on a daily basis, no problem! Benefit from figurative "nazis" because it's trendy to hate on whoever has been defined as "the bad guy" this year, well that's just a no-go...
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Do you think any German company that existed in the 30s is staffed and owned by "literal nazis"?
 
steenkh said:
Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
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Sumboddy called me?
ted-nugent-rock-roll-snub-crosby-diss.png
 
steenkh said:
Fortunately for Grenell he can now stop booking "far left" artists, and concentrate on booking actual fascist artists.
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Ticket sales are down across the board. I wouldn't be surprised if Donald Trump simply wants to put the Kennedy Center out of business for what he perceived as personal snubs against him during his first term.
 
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