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Cont: Transwomen are not women - part XI

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The most worrying thing about this report (as well as the lying) is the motivating factor for transitioning.

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/r...s/news-story/987828d3e5bb15a7da419c836ec33e80

Adea Danielle, 22, always felt like there was something “missing” when she was growing up and at aged 16, after stumbling across a YouTube video, realised she was transgender.
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I mean, everything on YouTube is absolute truth. :rolleyes:

I trust she took other advice, but it isn't mentioned.

I wonder how much of the explosion of those seeking transition is influenced by YouTube, Instagram, Reddit etc etc.
 
Samson said:
Ok, you realise she is a malicious transphobe in current NZ political law.
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I don't know about NZ law but I do know she is a transphobe who is happy to help white supremacists recruit from among her followers and who probably doesn't give a good damn about the status of women.

But she should still be allowed to speak.
 
Robin said:
Maybe the first time I have agreed with an article in the Spectator.
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Robin said:
I don't know about NZ law but I do know she is a transphobe who is happy to help white supremacists recruit from among her followers and who probably doesn't give a good damn about the status of women.

But she should still be allowed to speak.
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Ah I see.
The article is limited to rights to speak, and her factual research on the irreversible damage to youth is incidental to your appraisal?
 
But besides the free speech aspects, it is really counter productive to have counter demonstrations like that. If she had been let to herself most people wouldn't even know she was in Australia and NZ.There might have been a few pictures on the news of an event looking like speakers corner on a rainy morning with some Nazis joining them and seig heiling - an image best left to speak for itself

As it was they brought her attention beyond her wildest dreams and bizarrely gave up the moral high ground.
 
Samson said:
Ah I see.
The article is limited to rights to speak, and her factual research on the irreversible damage to youth is incidental to your appraisal?
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I'm not sure what that is even supposed to mean. The main thrust of the letter was the behaviour of the press and police in the face of a crowd getting out of control. Unless I read the wrong thing.

I mean she is free to allege irreversible damage to youth. And certainly there has been irreversible damage to some young people as well as valuable treatment for a difficult condition for others.

Whether it is worse than the usual irreversible damage to young people which is an inevitable consequence of treating young people for anything serious remains to be seen.
 
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Robin said:
I'm not sure what that is even supposed to mean. The main thrust of the letter was the behaviour of the press and police in the face of a crowd getting out of control. Unless I read the wrong thing.

I mean she is free to allege irreversible damage to youth. And certainly there has been irreversible damage to some young people as well as valuable treatment for a difficult condition for others.

Whether it is worse than the usual irreversible damage to young people which is an inevitable consequence of treating young people for anything serious remains to be seen.
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First do no harm.
We are deep in the morass of sins of omission vs sins of commission.
How would a reset to a world without medication and elective mutilation look to you?
It would be early 20th century I guess, which had concomitant issues.
 
Samson said:
First do no harm.
We are deep in the morass of sins of omission vs sins of commission.
How would a reset to a world without medication and elective mutilation look to you?
It would be early 20th century I guess, which had concomitant issues.
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Early twentieth century. My grandfather had fourteen siblings. Ten died in infancy. Apparently that was not unusual.

Medicine has progressed but it will never be perfect. There will always be harm caused either by new treatments in their Initial phase or by administrative failures, under financing, heavy case loads, empire building by managers and so on

It would also be a sin of omission to ignore the children with real issues and who have been helped by these treatments.
 
Robin said:
Early twentieth century. My grandfather had fourteen siblings. Ten died in infancy. Apparently that was not unusual.

Medicine has progressed but it will never be perfect. There will always be harm caused either by new treatments in their Initial phase or by administrative failures, under financing, heavy case loads, empire building by managers and so on

It would also be a sin of omission to ignore the children with real issues and who have been helped by these treatments.
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On the last sentence, the concensus on this thread demurs.
So
Better 100 guilty punters go free than one innocent punter be convicted.
Better 100 troubled kids go unmutilated than one....
 
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lionking said:
I wonder how much of the explosion of those seeking transition is influenced by YouTube, Instagram, Reddit etc etc.
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There's no doubt it's seen as a choice that can be made and therefore attracts the insecure.

No question we've put the cart before the horse to at least some degree, but I don't have an easy answer.

Samson said:
I am specifically interested in what Atheist and smartcooky have to say about this experienced NZ journalist.
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Nothing new - it's pretty low-hanging fruit, but she's also generalising rather badly. Stuff swings one way, Herald another, and ZB far the other way. I said a few days ago that NZ's position on kids and transitioning is behind reality, so I agree with her there.

At a time when cancer patients are being selected for treatment on who's going to die the soonest without treatment, there are bigger fish to fry, and that may be part of the problem.

We're in a time where EDs are chronically understaffed, psychiatric services are almost non-existent, and help for kids is being provided by charities with their own agendas. It's no surprise the squeakiest wheel is getting oiled.
 
I would be interested in seeing what is being done to stop homophobic bullying in schools. This has been mentioned many times that homophobic bullying figures strongly in the background of kids being referred to gender clinics and get of all the outrage being expressed, no-one appears to have been outraged at the homophobic bullying that is still permitted to happen.
 
The online trans communities I have seen have been friendly supportive and low pressure.

But then again for young people who feel despised and unwanted, friendly, supportive and low pressure must feel like coming home.
 
Robin said:
It would also be a sin of omission to ignore the children with real issues and who have been helped by these treatments.
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There is no evidence that any of them have been helped any more by medical transition than they could have been by nonmedical help. Ignoring that inconvenient fact is a sin of omission too.
 
Robin said:
. . . no-one appears to have been outraged at the homophobic bullying that is still permitted to happen.
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Isn't that a different discussion? If not, why aren't we also talking about young grade school heteros being teased about liking members of the opposite sex who obviously have cooties? ��
 
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Dr Patrik Vankrunkelsven, Director of the Belgian Society for Evidence-Based Medicine, has criticised current approaches to medical transitions for minors in an interview in the Belgian media a couple of days ago.


'"What you're doing is a pure experiment on children, without scientific evidence." CEBAM Director Patrik Vankrunkelsven is scathing of the international WPATH guidelines for hormonal treatments of children and young people, which serve as a guide for gender teams worldwide. Vankrunkelsven refers to the fact that studies with puberty inhibitors are not set up as a classic scientific experiment, with a control group. "One has never, as we traditionally do in medicine, strictly compared these children to a group that did not receive this treatment." Many children also disappeared from the follow-up studies, and according to Vankrunkelsven you cannot draw solid conclusions about the long-term effects of puberty inhibitors."'

This echoes what Prof Carl Heneghan from the Centre of Evidence Based Medicine at Oxford said a few years ago.
 
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Samson said:
Ok, you realise she is a malicious transphobe in current NZ political law.
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What exactly is that supposed to mean? The "current NZ political law" that you mention? Can you direct me this law?

Are you suggesting that she's not really transphobic, that said designation is merely a "political" one rather than factual despite the fact that she proudly marches with neo-Nazis and has dedicated her life towards hating transsexual people?

Besides New Zealand is "******" according to her expert opinion. I wonder whether she blames the Jews, Ancient Atlanteans, Reptilians or someone else for this.
 
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