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Cont: The Sinking of MS Estonia: Case Re-opened Part IV

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Vixen said:
It wasn't my citation. Ask Reformed Offlian.
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What are you talking about? Have you forgotten this thread of the conversation?

You claimed the following. I'll hilite the relevant part:

Vixen said:
My source? I have been following this story ever since the day I heard the news, so the sources are myriad (no not that one).

Sometimes, when an expert in his field or an investigative journalist is trashed, it can be because they are too close to the truth (cf David Kelly and the Weapons of Mass Destruction) so their reputations are smeared in the press, or alternatively, disinformation agents do the opposite, in order to depict them as extremists and lunatics, whilst pretending to promulgate the same views and aligning them with unsavoury types.
This is why it is important for people to think for themselves instead of mindlessly accepting what they are told.
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YOU claimed that disinformation agents exist to smear people/organisations by associating their names with extremist positions. I asked you for an example of this happening in the real world and you gave me Mr Bollyn.

So again, as you have claimed that disinformation agents exist in the world and work to disgrace people and groups by pretending to agree with them while also spouting extremist views, give examples from the real world please.
 
Vixen said:
I love Sweden* with my heart and soul. The first time I ever stepped foot in Sweden, getting off the ferry, I felt a powerful sense of dejà vu. I thought, 'Wait! this is a continuation of Finland: same-style houses, countryside, forests, lakes, boulders'.

So you are wrong to claim I hate Sweden. I will call out perceived injustice anywhere.

*Except in ice hockey, football, slalom. cross country skiing.
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I totally 100% believe you.
 
Vixen said:
Christopher Bollyn, for example, claiming the world is being taken over by Zionists, so he is trying to link anyone not convinced by the JAIC as some kind if disgusting extremist who believes the same garbage as himself, although I am sceptical he believes his own garbage.
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And yet, (as Stamuel pointed out) your content seems to ape his talking points when it comes to Piht and the other supposedly missing crew.
 
Vixen said:
OK OK I guess for a Swede falling from a winch and having to treadwater until someone rescued him, would command the highest medal for bravery.






[NB that was a joke before anybody gets upset.]
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Once you are finished laughing at your joke (I know I am) why don't you tell me what the JAIC report says Svensson did after he was rescued by Y 74. It's detailed in the sub-section on Y 74 in 7.5.5.
 
Vixen said:
And what about the DC-3 pilots shot down by the Soviets in Swedish waters near Gotland? For over forty years, Sweden nonchalantly whistled and pretended it had no idea of the whereabouts or fate of the missing airmen.
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What about it?

What was the world like in 1952? What could Sweden do to the Soviet Union in 1952? What can they do to Russia now?

Strawman after strawman with you.
 
Vixen said:
Not necessarily. Terry Waite disappeared as a hostage for several years. The fact he reappeared and was alive does not cancel out the fact he was disappeared by his captors.
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No, he was kidnapped. Everyone knew where he was from day one because the clowns holding him made public demands.

You are really bad at this.
 
Vixen said:
OK OK I guess for a Swede falling from a winch and having to treadwater until someone rescued him, would command the highest medal for bravery.






[NB that was a joke before anybody gets upset.]
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Then why make the joke.

Have you seen the footage of the rescues? No. If you had you'd know the same rough seas that HAD JUST SANK THE MS ESTONIA were beating up everyone in the water.
 
Reformed Offlian said:
Once you are finished laughing at your joke (I know I am) why don't you tell me what the JAIC report says Svensson did after he was rescued by Y 74. It's detailed in the sub-section on Y 74 in 7.5.5.
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She can’t because she has admitted she doesn’t understand what the JAIC says about Svensson. She says it’s word salad and obfuscation.

Even though everyone else can easily understand it and come to the same understanding of what.it clearly says.

Vixen interprets her own inability to understand English as evidence as an attempt by the JAIC to obfuscate the truth.

Pathetic.
 
MarkCorrigan said:
What are you talking about? Have you forgotten this thread of the conversation?

You claimed the following. I'll hilite the relevant part:



YOU claimed that disinformation agents exist to smear people/organisations by associating their names with extremist positions. I asked you for an example of this happening in the real world and you gave me Mr Bollyn.

So again, as you have claimed that disinformation agents exist in the world and work to disgrace people and groups by pretending to agree with them while also spouting extremist views, give examples from the real world please.
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The Russian bots that bombard Twitter with fake extreme views and attribute them to ordinary people. For example, when there was a terrorist attack in London, a tweet went viral seeming to show a woman dressed as a Muslim callously walking past a victim lying on the pavement staring at her phone. The tweet came from a Russian bot and had been deliberately misrepresented.

Likewise, a lot of negative depictions of events in the UK turned out to come from abroad. People have an agenda and once you are aware, you can spot it.

Were you not aware of this?
 
Axxman300 said:
Please explain the the process for Sweden's medal awards from start to finish, please.
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Here you go:

The Swedish Armed Forces Medal of Merit is a Swedish military award and medal established by the Swedish Armed Forces in 1995. The award is a combat award but is not included in the war decorations . It was distributed on the recommendation of the Commander-in-Chief .

Gold medal can be awarded either for:

extraordinarily personal courage which saved human lives
repeated dangerous efforts to save lives or for
extraordinary effort that in a decisive way benefited the Armed Forces
outstanding efforts that have benefited the Armed Forces.
Silver medal can be awarded for:

dangerous action for saving human lives or for
outstanding effort that has benefited the Armed Forces.
An upright sword of gold and silver, respectively, is placed on the medal ribbon if the medal has been awarded for personal courage. The medal and a diploma were awarded to individuals as a reward for commendable service in the Armed Forces. The medal was awarded to the Armed Forces employed or serving personnel.
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Wiki
 
Axxman300 said:
What about it?

What was the world like in 1952? What could Sweden do to the Soviet Union in 1952? What can they do to Russia now?

Strawman after strawman with you.
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It doesn't stop them telling the families of the dead airmen that they died in action. Why string them along for forty years, just to maintain an image that nobody was much looking at anyway.
 
Vixen said:
As is the case with any world news, any Tom, Dick and Harry can talk about it.
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Whether you can talk about it is not the issue. The point is that you seem to be cribbing Bollyn's talking points (without citation) while at the same time trying to publically disown him as a loon, just as you've done with Bjorkman.
 
Reformed Offlian said:
Whether you can talk about it is not the issue. The point is that you seem to be cribbing Bollyn's talking points (without citation) while at the same time trying to publically disown him as a loon, just as you've done with Bjorkman.
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As I said, I had not read that particular article.

It is not as if he is saying anything original. Repeating what is in the public domain does not give you copyright.

It rather like a reporter getting very pally with a benefit claimant, making a series of how common they all are, whilst pretending to be sympathetic to their plight, when the true aim is to depict them as entertainment fodder for a tv show. For example Benefits Street.

Not everybody has a true aim.

But then you knew that.
 
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