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Wow, UK has lost freedom of speech

Planigale said:
.....Yes the UK believes the balance between absolute freedom of speech and necessary constraints differs from where the US places the balance, as we have also done for issues like the right to have a gun. Perhaps you might consider the US is the one with the balance in the wrong place?
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When it comes to Free Speech, we er on the side of more speech, not less. You guys seem to er on the side of protecting peoples' feelings.
 
Hercules56 said:
Ive been given ZERO legitimate reason to doubt the info provided in the source or think they omitted anything of value.
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Lack of reputable media covering the story is cause for pause, as there is no corroboration or verifiable reporting. The article presents no independent journalism at all, drawing off another article from The Telegraph. Also, unsurprisingly, with no corroborating information. Basically an "I heard this at the water cooler" level of journalism.
 
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Thermal said:
Lack of reputable media covering the story is cause for pause, as there is no corroboration or verifiable reporting. The article presents no independent journalism at all, drawing off another article from The Telegraph. Also, unsurprisingly, with no corroborating information. Basically an "I heard this at the water cooler" level of journalism.
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Telegraph article says the following:


Mr North said he stood by the contents of his post, and that officers questioned him on whether he knew that Tommy Robinson had also shared the image online.

He said: “I was asked whether I intended to incite racial hatred by posting the meme. I replied that Islam is not a race. I had not intended to stir up racial hatred. I simply agree with the premise of the meme.

“Nobody should be facing police inquiries for posting memes on Twitter.”

He later said: “It will be interesting to see if they do charge me. I don’t think they will, but I don’t think they care because the whole point of this exercise is not to win convictions. It’s to terrorise people like me into thinking twice about posting spicy memes.”

The former Ukip activist said he was released without charge at 1.30am and arrived home in a taxi at 3am.


He was arrested for posting THIS meme:

Screenshot 2025-09-27 215525.jpg


Ive seen no evidence, been provided no evidence, that there is any missing info.
 
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Hercules56 said:
Ive seen no evidence, been provided no evidence, that there is any missing info.
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You forgot what was being discussed. You said you had no reason to doubt. Yes, you do. The article you provided was apparently written by a young and stupid child that could do little more than copy the work of others. That is alone is sufficient reason to doubt.

That journalistic triumph The Daily Mail, for instance, actually did a little homework and includes the video of the police interaction. The rag you quoted was too lazy to actially do anything, hence should not be taken on their word as credible.
www.dailymail.co.uk

Moment police arrest man for posting 'f*** Hamas on social media

British police officers have been branded as the 'Stasi of East Germany' after they arrested a man last night over a social media post.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
The joke article you propped up got bitch slapped by the Daily Mail. Let that sink in.

Eta: your article was so poorly done that it didn't even get the town where the arrest occurred. That's about as lame as you get for reporting.
 
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Thermal said:
You forgot what was being discussed. You said you had no reason to doubt. Yes, you do. The article you provided was apparently written by a young and stupid child that could do little more than copy the work of others. That is alone is sufficient reason to doubt.

That journalistic triumph The Daily Mail, for instance, actually did a little homework and includes thr video of the police interaction. The rag you quoted was too lazy, hence should not be taken on their word as credible.
www.dailymail.co.uk

Moment police arrest man for posting 'f*** Hamas on social media

British police officers have been branded as the 'Stasi of East Germany' after they arrested a man last night over a social media post.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
The joke article you propped up got bitch slapped by the Daily Mail. Let that sink in.

Eta: your article was so poorly done that it didn't even get the town where the arrest occurred. That's about as lame as you get for reporting.
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Thanks for the Daily Mail article.

Shows that the facts of this incident remain unchanged. Guy was arrested for posting a meme that people found offensive and bigoted.

I guess Freedom of Speech in the UK is very different than in the US. Here we think all non-violent speech, even hateful and bigoted and offensive, must be protected from the heal of Big Government.
 
Hercules56 said:
Thanks for the Daily Mail article.

Shows that the facts of this incident remain unchanged. Guy was arrested for posting a meme that people found offensive and bigoted.

I guess Freedom of Speech in the UK is very different than in the US. Here we think all non-violent speech, even hateful and bigoted and offensive, must be protected from the heal of Big Government.
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I'm not entirely positive on this and would welcome clarification from a UKer, but I think thier arresting is much less consequential than ours, really little more than a formalized questioning. Last couple times I was arrested, I was cuffed and tossed in holding while I was given one shot at making bail before going to county. The UK concept of arrest is kinda genteel.

Eta: this guy was not fined, cited, or charged, and no restrictions put on him. Near as I can see, it was a strongarm questioning about possible hate crime activity. Not exactly Thoughtcrime territory.
 
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Thermal said:
I'm not entirely positive on this and would welcome clarification from a UKer, but I think thier arresting is much less consequential than ours, really little more than a formalized questioning. Last couple times I was arrested, I was cuffed and tossed in holding while I was given one shot at making bail before going to county. The UK concept of arrest is kinda genteel.

Eta: this guy was not fined, cited, or charged, and no restrictions put on him. Near as I can see, it was a strongarm questioning about possible hate crime activity. Not exactly Thoughtcrime territory.
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British policing has many, many faults and needs massive reform however PACE (Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984) sets out a national framework for Wales and England in regard to policing and has many good aspects, for example how interviews and arrests must proceed.

The police in this instance seem to have been a bunch of pillocks, yes they should investigate complaints but we have had enough case law now to establish that what was posted (if that is all that was posted) was not anything someone could be prosecuted for posting. We also don't know what triggered the police action, the initial complaint could have been that he was posting something like actual threats of violence. So I suppose it could be argued that they didn't know whether that was the extent of his posting and if they called on him and he wouldn't cooperate they may have had to arrest him to be able to conduct a more in-depth investigation. But that's weak sauce if you ask me.

ETA: The police in the UK do not decide who to prosecute. Those decisions are made by the crown prosecution service in Wales and England, we don't have the politicisation of the prosecutor position unlike many places in the USA, over here it's a "civil service" position.
 
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Hercules56 said:
When it comes to Free Speech, we er on the side of more speech, not less. You guys seem to er on the side of protecting peoples' feelings.
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Except when you say things Trump does not like. Or your science reports things Trump does not like. Or you give economic figures Trump does not like. Or allow demonstrations Trump does not like.
The UK (and most EU) seeks a balance between free speech and protecting it's citizens. The US now just protects Trumps feelings.
 
There is also a difference between freedom of speech and freedom of publication. The issue is what was written and published, whilst the meme is reproduced, the associated comments and responses were not. if this was published with the comment that violence was wrong, peoples rights should be respected, I wouldn't expect the police to call. If it was supported by a comment that if they don't go willingly they should be forced out (as has happened to people in the US who have been detained and deported for expressing support for Palestine), driven into the sea, then I would think this was an unacceptable call to violence. A warning from the police that you are at risk of breaking the law might be reasonable.

What would be the response if the comment was that all Jews who protested against Hamas and nurses wearing Palestinian flag badges should '◊◊◊◊ off back to Israel'?

Would people be claiming this was anti-semitic? Would people be commenting on anti-Semitic violence and that this is an incitement to anti-Semitism?

Would his claim that Jews aren't a race be accepted as a defence?
 
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