• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Merged Peace President invades Venezuela,/U.S. Forces Capture Maduro

Dr.Sid said:
Russia can totally take Baltics. All it needs is Trump to leave NATO. And he will.
Click to expand...
Maybe Russia could, four years ago. But they can't now, those capabilities are spent. And I don't think you understand the force disparity between Russia and NATO. NATO doesn't need the US to kick Russia's ass.
Dr.Sid said:
No, China won't take out Taiwan's leader. You keep making up stuff in your mind and then reacting to it. Try reading what's actually being said.
Click to expand...
Then what's this going to do to encourage them?

Nothing. Again, they need no encouragement, they need no justification. All they need is the capability. Which this operation does not change.
 
Resume said:
And somehow he's not president anymore.
Click to expand...
And in just over three years, Trump won't be either.

But just as Obama was able to use the military without Congressional approval, so too will Trump be able to. Because it is not actually any different. Presidents get to do that. Maybe they shouldn't, but they do. This wasn't the first time, it won't be the last. Get used to it.
 
Ziggurat said:
Maybe Russia could, four years ago. But they can't now, those capabilities are spent. And I don't think you understand the force disparity between Russia and NATO. NATO doesn't need the US to kick Russia's ass.

Then what's this going to do to encourage them?

Nothing. Again, they need no encouragement, they need no justification. All they need is the capability. Which this operation does not change.
Click to expand...
Ok, I let you argue with yourself ..
 
Resume said:
Obama, Obama, Obama! But her e-mails, e-mails, e-mails! Marcia, Marcia, Marcia!!! ◊◊◊◊ me, you guys are easy.
Click to expand...
He wasn't the only one. Clinton also used the military without Congressional authorization. So did Reagan. The opposition party always complains (be they Dem or Rep), but nothing happens. Presidents do it. Trump isn't peculiar in this regard. Whine all you want to, but that's the reality.
 
JayUtah said:
Mineral extraction on Venezuelan soil used to be conducted largely by U.S. oil companies. When Venezuela nationalized its petroleum industry, U.S. companies lost their mineral rights. The Trump regime is literally trying to argue that Venezuela's oil is somehow still rightly U.S. property.
Click to expand...
Just like Saudi Arabia, then. When are we going in to kidnap MBS?
 
Bush the Younger campaigned many months, went to the UN, went to Congress, amassed a collation, spent many billions, and 4K+ American KIA for regime change. Trump just does it in several hours with no American KIA. He really is a stable genius.
 
Last edited:
Trausti said:
Bush the Younger campaigned many months, went to the UN, went to Congress, amassed a collation, spent many billions, and 4K+ American KIA for regime change. Trump just does it in several hours with no American KIA. He really is a stable genius.
Click to expand...
The two events cannot be compared in terms of difficulty. Compare this to Reagan's invasion of Granada. A small country that is close to the US with a relatively small armed forces and no direct links to other hostile countries.
 
Dr.Sid said:
Also lets judge the outcome when it's finished.
Click to expand...
The majority of deaths and injuries and cost happened after the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan. Even if the invasion of Venezuela is relatively benign there is still going to be an expensive minimum deployment to "run" the country. Trump has said he's not going to immediately hand over control to a democratic process because he won't control that ourcome.
 
a_unique_person said:
The two events cannot be compared in terms of difficulty. Compare this to Reagan's invasion of Granada. A small country that is close to the US with a relatively small armed forces and no direct links to other hostile countries.
Click to expand...
Well, certainly, the US was apparently aided here by the Venezuelan army's absolute unwillingness to die for a socialist dictator.
 
a_unique_person said:
The majority of deaths and injuries and cost happened after the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan. Even if the invasion of Venezuela is relatively benign there is still going to be an expensive minimum deployment to "run" the country. Trump has said he's not going to immediately hand over control to a democratic process because he won't control that ourcome.
Click to expand...
But Biden left the USA broke! And Venezuela is a ◊◊◊◊-hole country and broke also. So how is Trump going to afford to run two whole countries?

He could sell both the oil tankers he stole, maybe. Should nett a couple of million, maybe ten. That should go a long way to helping, I'll bet!

I know! They could sell all the drugs they recovered from blowing up the "narco boats"! ....waddayamean, nothing??
 
Trausti said:
Well, certainly, the US was apparently aided here by the Venezuelan army's absolute unwillingness to die for a socialist dictator.
Click to expand...
Trump hates Venezuelans in the US. Venezuelans have suffered from decades of extreme right wing and left wing governments. It is impoverished despite its oil wealth. Trump wants the oil but not the people.
 
There is also the simple fact that the entire apparatus that kept Maduro in power is still there.
Trump acts as if the county has surrendered after his act of war.
But it is far more likely the next in line will step up.
If I were their government I'd prepare for the invasion by seeking to kill as many US soldiers as possible when they invade, then go for guerrilla warfare as the US cannot win against that.
In the meantime rig all the oil installations to blow so the US cannot use them anytime soon.
 
Lukraak_Sisser said:
There is also the simple fact that the entire apparatus that kept Maduro in power is still there.
Trump acts as if the county has surrendered after his act of war.
But it is far more likely the next in line will step up.
If I were their government I'd prepare for the invasion by seeking to kill as many US soldiers as possible when they invade, then go for guerrilla warfare as the US cannot win against that.
In the meantime rig all the oil installations to blow so the US cannot use them anytime soon.
Click to expand...
Like Iraq did.
 
Norman Alexander said:
Like Iraq did.
Click to expand...
Yes, but Iraq was mostly open desert, which is relatively easy to monitor and invade. Venezuela is mostly jungle.


AS for Venezuelans celebrating this, why would anyone hide this. It is well known a large part of the country hated the populist dictator. People would similarly celebrate in Argentina if someone were to do this to Milei.
Heck you can probaly find US citizens celebrating if the same were to happen to Trump.

Regimes based on fear, hate, exclusion and cults of personality always need suppression to stay in power, and thus always cause larger resentment in those they oppress.
 
Helen said:
And Oden forbid that the Venezuelan people should be allowed to decide for themselves.
Click to expand...
Maduro stole the election in 2024 from the opposition, who won at least 70% of the votes. Maybe now that the U.S. has deposed him, the Venezuelan people will, for the first time in more than two decades of living under criminal dictators, actually be able to decide for themselves.
 
Beelzebuddy said:
Would it surprise literally anyone at this point to learn that there was also insider trading going on? At least one person made over $400k betting on Maduro's kidnapping just hours before his kidnapping.

Click to expand...
That's actually good news, it means the maniac's activities will be broadcast before they happen. He's surrounded by people just as greedy and self-serving as himself and that can hamper him.
 
JayUtah said:
Pres. Trump has explicitly said he will send American oil companies back into Venezuela to run their oil industry for them.
Click to expand...
That also means that China will no longer be getting that oil. There is a geopolitical angle here, too.
JayUtah said:
The pretext of narco-terrorism didn't even last as long as it took them to get Maduro to New York.
Click to expand...
Oil was never a pretext. It was one of several reasons we intervened. Indeed, Venezuela was the perfect storm of reasons for an intervention: It is a country in our own backyard run by a criminal dictator who stole an election from the democratically elected winner and who exports drugs and criminal gangs to the U.S.; it is an ally of our biggest geopolitical enemies, Iran, China, and Russia, an oil supplier to the latter two and a training ground for the terrorist armies of the first. And it has oil reserves that US companies had had access to and now can have access to again.
 
Last edited:
jt512 said:
That also means that China will no longer be getting that oil. There is a geopolitical angle here, too.

Oil was never a pretext. It was one of several reasons we intervened. Indeed, Venezuela was the perfect storm of reasons for an intervention: It is a country in our own backyard run by a criminal dictator who stole an election from the democratically elected winner and who exports drugs and criminal gangs to the U.S.; it is an ally of our biggest geopolitical enemies, Iran, China, and Russia, an oil supplier to the latter two and a training ground for the terrorist armies of the first. And it has oil reserves that US companies had had access to and now can have access to again.
Click to expand...
Well Ukraine is still an independent... oh wait, sorry, thought I heard Putin talking there.
 
Beelzebuddy said:
Would it surprise literally anyone at this point to learn that there was also insider trading going on? At least one person made over $400k betting on Maduro's kidnapping just hours before his kidnapping.

Click to expand...
What doesn't surprise me as that the TDS sufferers would assume that somebody who bet and won in a prediction market had inside information.

You can get 5:1 on the proposition that there will be regime change in Iran in 2026. Winning such a bet hardly implies inside information.
 
Last edited:
jt512 said:
Maduro stole the election in 2024 from the opposition, who won at least 70% of the votes. Maybe now that the U.S. has deposed him, the Venezuelan people will, for the first time in more than two decades of living under criminal dictators, actually be able to decide for themselves.
Click to expand...
According to Trump the US military will be involved in running Venezuela. But then maybe he's lying about that as well?

I repeat; I have no love for Maduro, but I still think that this quite flagrantly breaks international, as well as US, law, and creates a truly dangerous precedent. And I do not for a moment believe that this was done for some kind of noble, humanitarian reasons - there are far worse dictators around, whom Trump loves to describe as his friends. If Maduro had flattered and bribed him, he would have been a trusted ally in Trump's eyes.

And i do wonder why you think that the US had any right to do this? Might makes right, is that it?
 
Some cold hard truths here


For Venezuelans, our situation will not be fixed by Mr. Maduro’s departure, let alone by a foreign occupying force. We are not a nation held together by a government or a social contract, but a collection of individuals trapped in a struggle for survival. Replacing the man at the top will not dismantle the web of bosses, private loyalties, corrupt practices and institutional ruins that have replaced public life here.​

The Fat Orange Turd will be happy with what he has done... to get his grubby mitts on the oil reserves and deny them to Iran and China. But he won't give a toss about the people of Venezuela... he won't want to put the work in to assure a solid, corruption free future for them. He's likely to introduce MORE corruption rather than he is to reduce what already exists. Everything The Fat Orange Turd does is for his own benefit.
 
Dr.Sid said:
They will learn soon. But to be fair, the country will mostly likely be better off without Maduro.
Click to expand...
Iraq was better off without Saddam, too. That means it was all okay, right?

Ziggurat said:
And in just over three years, Trump won't be either.
Click to expand...
You keep being optimistic about that.

jt512 said:
...the Venezuelan people will, for the first time in more than two decades of living under criminal dictators, actually be able to decide for themselves.
Click to expand...
Keep being optimistic about that, too.
 
Helen said:
According to Trump the US military will be involved in running Venezuela. But then maybe he's lying about that as well?
Click to expand...
No. You are. Trump said that the U.S. will "run" Venezuela on a temporary basis until a "safe, proper and judicious transition" can be completed.
Helen said:
I repeat; I have no love for Maduro, but I still think that this quite flagrantly breaks international, as well as US, law, and creates a truly dangerous precedent.
Click to expand...
No. It doesn't embolden similar actions by our enemies. It does exactly the opposite: it deters them. Trumps declaration to the Islamic regime in Iran that the U.S. is "locked and loaded" to protect Iranian demonstrators from violence from the regime means a lot more today than it did yesterday.
Helen said:
And I do not for a moment believe that this was done for some kind of noble, humanitarian reasons.
Click to expand...
I've already explained why Trump took this action.
 
jt512 said:
No. You are. Trump said that the U.S. will "run" Venezuela on a temporary basis until a "safe, proper and judicious transition" can be completed.
Click to expand...
Ah yes. "A temporary basis." Very reassuring. Always worked out really well, historically.
jt512 said:
No. It doesn't embolden similar actions by our enemies. It does exactly the opposite: it deters them. Trumps declaration to the Islamic regime in Iran that the U.S. is "locked and loaded" to protect Iranian demonstrators from violence from the regime means a lot more today than it did yesterday.
Click to expand...
Oh, it does, does it? How does that work for China, then? No, can't take Taiwan, the mighty Trump stands in our way. And Putin must be quaking in his boots, and planning an immediate withdrawal from Ukraine.
jt512 said:
I've already explained why Trump took this action.
Click to expand...
No. You have given your opinion, not an explanation, but it's fine; we do know why he did. He's not exactly shy about why it was done.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom