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Merged Murder investigation in UK after 39 people found dead in lorry container

catsmate said:
And soon after the UK's economy collapses as every truck entering the country has a couple of extra hours added to its journey time. We discussed such delays up and their effects in the last Brexit thread.
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The government and press seem to have gone quiet but after Brexit the refuge border camps at Calais are to be passed back into UK hands. That'll be chaos as there will no longer be shared security info (if a no-deal).
 
Nessie said:
In the case of the refrigerated lorry, it would have taken seconds to open the door and look inside.

By making drivers more responsible for their load, the onus is on them not just to do a reasonable check of the load (if the lorry is packed with crates, I would not expect it to be unloaded and all the crates opened. I would also not expect to miss 10 people lying on top of the crates) but also to be more questioning about its origins, the paperwork, the possibility it is being used for smuggling.

As it is, if this driver is charged and his defence is that he did not know, but he gets convicted, then it very much in the interests of all drivers to be more careful.

If his defence of he did not know works, then sadly we have all drivers with an alliby and they can now turn a blind eye to a horrific crime. That is disgusting.
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On the converse, one could ask why the truck driver decided to 'break the seal' at 1:40am when there was no docking bay in sight.
 
Nessie said:
Questioning a previous keeper of a vehicle for which you have an owner who admits to ownership and a drive who admits to being the driver, is not an enquiry that I would expect so early in such an investigation. It is also not an enquiry that I would justify a house search.
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Probably the great show of wealth, which raised their suspicions.
 
cullennz said:
As much as I love your hysteria I was in England in 2000 and other years when massive fuel shortages were going on, truck drivers were doing blockades and people were panic buying.

Queues to petrol stations were about 1/2 a mile long

The economy didn't collapse
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The economy didn't collapse because the whole thing lasted about a week at the most.

I remember it well. I had the morning off work and had driven into the nearby town for something. On the way home I saw a queue forming outside the petrol station on the main road. I decided to go to the petrol station in the village to fill up. I discovered they had no petrol left at all. I turned back to the one on the main road, waited in the queue which wasn't terribly long at that point, and filled my tank. The assistant told me they thought they'd run out by about four o'clock at the rate it was going.

I then went to work and got hold of all my staff and advised everyone who had less than half a tank of petrol (indeed, maybe less than three quarters) to go to the open petrol station and fill up. They duly did so.

We had a crisis meeting with the boss of our courier firm, whom we relied on to fetch the pathology samples our business analysed. He said as our business was vital and we were also his best customer, he was reserving all the fuel he'd been able to acquire for our clients. He had also managed to fill all his vehicles at that point.

Thus the crisis didn't affect us at all. The whole thing had blown over before we actually needed to buy any more petrol. I think a lot of businesses managed in a similar way, by seeing what was coming and getting hold of the available stocks before the strike really bit. But if it had gone on much longer, a lot of people would have been in big trouble.
 
I saw news of an absolutely heartrending text message sent by one of the victims to her parents when she knew she was dying of suffocation. This really is the most appalling tragedy.
 
Driver charged with manslaughter of 39 people

A lorry driver has been charged with the manslaughter of 39 people found dead inside a refrigerated trailer.

Maurice Robinson, 25, was arrested after the bodies of 31 men and eight women were found in Grays on Wednesday.

He is further charged with people trafficking, immigration and money laundering offences, Essex Police said.

Mr Robinson, of Laurel Drive, Craigavon, Northern Ireland, is due before Chelmsford Magistrates' Court on Monday.
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-50196265
 
Darat said:
Has that been confirmed?
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I don't know. I read it on Twitter on my phone this morning and didn't note the source. The poster said the text was originally in Vietnamese and what was posted was a translation.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Driver charged with manslaughter of 39 people

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-50196265
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I'm not getting this. The driver was in possession of the container for 35 minutes. The container would have been already sealed for hours before he hooked it up to his tractor, so it is very unlikely that the 39 people were alive in the container for all those hours beforehand, and all suddenly up and died in the 35 minutes between when he hooked the container to his tractor and when he stopped and opened the container.

If they were already dead, how can he be physically respnsible for their deaths?
 
smartcooky said:
I'm not getting this. The driver was in possession of the container for 35 minutes. The container would have been already sealed for hours before he hooked it up to his tractor, so it is very unlikely that the 39 people were alive in the container for all those hours beforehand, and all suddenly up and died in the 35 minutes between when he hooked the container to his tractor and when he stopped and opened the container.

If they were already dead, how can he be physically respnsible for their deaths?
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Perhaps with the other charges, they are considering him part of the same organization that killed them. Like charging the getaway driver with murder because one of the bank robbers shot the manager.
 
smartcooky said:
I'm not getting this. The driver was in possession of the container for 35 minutes. The container would have been already sealed for hours before he hooked it up to his tractor, so it is very unlikely that the 39 people were alive in the container for all those hours beforehand, and all suddenly up and died in the 35 minutes between when he hooked the container to his tractor and when he stopped and opened the container.

If they were already dead, how can he be physically respnsible for their deaths?
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If he knew he was taking part in people smuggling then he's probably guilty as part of the whole operation. I think it's known as "joint enterprise". They may have good evidence that he was a willing participant in the operation and not just an innocent hired lorry driver.
 
Rolfe said:
If he knew he was taking part in people smuggling then he's probably guilty as part of the whole operation. I think it's known as "joint enterprise". They may have good evidence that he was a willing participant in the operation and not just an innocent hired lorry driver.
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Silly Green Monkey said:
Perhaps with the other charges, they are considering him part of the same organization that killed them. Like charging the getaway driver with murder because one of the bank robbers shot the manager.
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OK then.

If they have already proved that, then its pretty good and quick work by the Essex Police.
 
smartcooky said:
I'm not getting this. The driver was in possession of the container for 35 minutes. The container would have been already sealed for hours before he hooked it up to his tractor, so it is very unlikely that the 39 people were alive in the container for all those hours beforehand, and all suddenly up and died in the 35 minutes between when he hooked the container to his tractor and when he stopped and opened the container.

If they were already dead, how can he be physically respnsible for their deaths?
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I don't get that either, but maybe there is evidence that they could still have been alive when he collected the trailer.
 
Nessie, "joint enterprise". They don't need to have proved he was knowingly engaged in people smuggling so long as they have decent evidence suggesting he was. Presumably they have enough of that to get it past the English equivalent of the PF.
 
Rolfe said:
Nessie, "joint enterprise". They don't need to have proved he was knowingly engaged in people smuggling so long as they have decent evidence suggesting he was. Presumably they have enough of that to get it past the English equivalent of the PF.
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The CPS website is blank when it comes to joint enterprise;

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidan...ns-principal-secondary-and-inchoate-liability

There is doubt over joint enterprise;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35598896

The CPS instead has secondary liability;

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidan...charging-decisions-principals-and-accessories

"The guidance sets out how charging decisions are to be approached in cases involving persons who assist or encourage another to commit a crime. These persons are known as accessories or secondary parties."

"Manslaughter
D2 will not be guilty of murder but will be guilty of manslaughter where:
D2 is a party to a violent attack on another without an intent to assist in causing death or really serious harm, but the violence escalates and results in death.
D2 participates by encouragement or assistance in any other unlawful act which all sober and reasonable people would realise carried the risk of some harm (not necessarily serious) to another, and death results. The test is objective."

D2 is an accessory or secondary party.
 
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