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Cont: Electric Vehicles II

Was Dabop incorrect or exaggerating when he said that on a 4-5 hour trip he went through three 'average speed' cameras, at least a dozen fixed speed cameras, and several dozen red light/speed/mobile phone use cameras?

How many traffic cameras would it take to reach your definition of "surveillance state"?
And because NOBODY speeds (well hardly anyone lol) I received exactly ...

ZERO....

tickets....

My mum drove up to my sisters place (about 700km trip, multiple speed cameras (instant and average) plus at least a couple of dozen redlight/speed/phone cameras and - no tickets....)

Its almost like it makes people OBEY THE BLOODY LAWS!!!!!!!

(a strange concept for some people I know- but it works and we LIKE living in a safe society where idiots doing the wrong thing rapidly get removed from the road....)

We 'used' to be like the yanks- no speed cameras, no redlight cameras, no RBTs- and our road toll was (like the US) massive- until the public demanded action take place- and it did...

A strange concept for the yanks- it isn't some 'tyrannical government plot'- it is THE PUBLIC driving these laws lol
 
And because NOBODY speeds (well hardly anyone lol) I received exactly ...

ZERO....

tickets....

My mum drove up to my sisters place (about 700km trip, multiple speed cameras (instant and average) plus at least a couple of dozen redlight/speed/phone cameras and - no tickets....)

Its almost like it makes people OBEY THE BLOODY LAWS!!!!!!!

(a strange concept for some people I know- but it works and we LIKE living in a safe society where idiots doing the wrong thing rapidly get removed from the road....)

We 'used' to be like the yanks- no speed cameras, no redlight cameras, no RBTs- and our road toll was (like the US) massive- until the public demanded action take place- and it did...

A strange concept for the yanks- it isn't some 'tyrannical government plot'- it is THE PUBLIC driving these laws lol
Anecdotes don't constitute evidence. Are you suggesting they don't issue thousands, even hundreds of thousands of tickets?
 
No Art, I think he is describing it very accurately.
No, he isn't. He's not the one driving in this country, I am. I know what I'm talking about. Driving past the occasional fixed speed camera is very much not analogous to having a police car follow you about constantly documenting everything you're doing.
 
My mum drove up to my sisters place (about 700km trip, multiple speed cameras (instant and average) plus at least a couple of dozen redlight/speed/phone cameras and - no tickets....)
This is 700km. In Freedom Units that's 435 miles, if that makes it easier for you to visualise. This is hardly the density of surveillance that is being implied.
 
Anecdotes don't constitute evidence. Are you suggesting they don't issue thousands, even hundreds of thousands of tickets?
I have clocked up millions of logbook recorded hours (driving a truck, every minute has to be accounted for in your logbook) and I haven't received a ticket (of any description) since the 1990's....

And thats WITH this 'tyrannical' level of surveillance lol

(looks around furtively- pssst wanna know my secret???)

I obey the road rules....

And the road toll is (despite a massive increase in the number of people driving on the roads since I first got my licence) actually LESS than what it was then!!!!

Mind you last year was the worst in more than a decade- with 1300 dead in all of Australia (which is actually less than HALF the number that died the year I got my licence (3508), despite the huge population increase.. (from 14.5 million to 28.2 million...)

So the death toll on our roads has plummeted....

Sure safer cars helped, but so does drivers actually- you know- driving safely.....
 
No, he isn't. He's not the one driving in this country, I am. I know what I'm talking about. Driving past the occasional fixed speed camera is very much not analogous to having a police car follow you about constantly documenting everything you're doing.
We disagree.
 
If you had a police car follow you every time you went out, then mailed you a ticket for any perceived infractions, you would consider this to be harassment and an abuse of power.

I would consider it a ridiculous waste of money and resources, as there are much cheaper ways of encouraging motorists to drive safely and sensibly.

I have received two speeding tickets in over 40 years of driving. I deserved both of them.
 
I could not find a decent graph of Australian deaths per 100 million kilometers. The best I could find is deaths per 10,000 registered vehicles, Figure F2 of: Road deaths in Australia 1925–2008

As you claim that the Australian surveillance system has greatly reduced traffic deaths, please point to me on Figure F2 the year that the cameras were installed. As you are claiming great results, it should be relatively simple to identify the deflection point on the graph.

Per Table 6 of Road Safety International Comparisons–2023:

  • The US fatality rate per 100 million vehicle kilometers is 0.8
  • The Australian fatality rate per 100 million vehicle kilometers is 0.5.

Really, not as different as some have claimed.

From the same table, Australia lags far behind the Scandinavian countries. I wonder why?

I also can't help but wonder why the total number of deaths on Australian roads has increased over the last several years.

I thought this article was quite interesting: Australian road toll hits five-year high: Why speed cameras aren’t saving lives

"Most road deaths occur in regional areas or the open road, most speed cameras and speed enforcement is done in metropolitan areas where governments can rake in the most money," said one high-ranking highway patrol officer, speaking on condition of anonymity.

"The 'speeding under 10km/h over the limit is dangerous' message is also a lie. What the government is neglecting to tell the public is that people who are killed at these modest speeds had a crash for other reasons: because they were drunk, drug affected, banned from driving, or had an unsafe or unregistered car. That group (is) by far the biggest menace on the roads. Not mums and dads going to work every day.

"Until the government is prepared to properly address road safety, speed cameras will keep clicking and the road toll will keep rising."
 
I could not find a decent graph of Australian deaths per 100 million kilometers. The best I could find is deaths per 10,000 registered vehicles, Figure F2 of: Road deaths in Australia 1925–2008

As you claim that the Australian surveillance system has greatly reduced traffic deaths, please point to me on Figure F2 the year that the cameras were installed. As you are claiming great results, it should be relatively simple to identify the deflection point on the graph.

Per Table 6 of Road Safety International Comparisons–2023:

  • The US fatality rate per 100 million vehicle kilometers is 0.8
  • The Australian fatality rate per 100 million vehicle kilometers is 0.5.

Really, not as different as some have claimed.

From the same table, Australia lags far behind the Scandinavian countries. I wonder why?

I also can't help but wonder why the total number of deaths on Australian roads has increased over the last several years.

I thought this article was quite interesting: Australian road toll hits five-year high: Why speed cameras aren’t saving lives

"Most road deaths occur in regional areas or the open road, most speed cameras and speed enforcement is done in metropolitan areas where governments can rake in the most money," said one high-ranking highway patrol officer, speaking on condition of anonymity.

"The 'speeding under 10km/h over the limit is dangerous' message is also a lie. What the government is neglecting to tell the public is that people who are killed at these modest speeds had a crash for other reasons: because they were drunk, drug affected, banned from driving, or had an unsafe or unregistered car. That group (is) by far the biggest menace on the roads. Not mums and dads going to work every day.

"Until the government is prepared to properly address road safety, speed cameras will keep clicking and the road toll will keep rising."
19753,69426.659
19763,58325.55435.5
19773,57825.252
19783,70525.852
19793,50824.24831.5
19803,27222.343
19813,32122.342
19823,25221.4[3]3925.6
19832,75517.932[3]
19842,82218.132[3]
19852,94118.6332.320.9
19862,88818.031[3]
19872,77217.030[3]
19882,88717.53018.8[3]
19892,80116.729[3]
19902,33113.6623.1
19912,11312.22114.1[3]
19921,97411.2819
19931,95311.0519
19941,92810.8018.0
19952,01711.1618.412.1
19961,97010.7617.3
19971,7679.5415.1
19981,7559.3814.510.5
19991,7649.3214.4
20001,8179.4914.69.8
20011,7378.9513.99.1
20021,7158.7313.48.9
20031,6218.1512.38.0
20041,5837.8611.78.0
20051,6277.9811.77.9
20061,5987.7211.27.7
20071,6037.6210.87.4
20081,4376.6896.5[3][4]
20091,4916.78, or 6.86[5]106.7[3]
20101,3536.06, or 6.14[5]8.46.1[2][3][6]
20111,2775.71, or 5.72[5]5.55.5[3][7]
20121,3005.78, or 5.73[5]5.45.5[7][8]
20131,1875.164.65.0[5][7]
20141,1504.914.54.8[7][9]
20151,2095.085.0[10]
20161,2935.345.0[10]
20171,2254.985.0[10]
20181,1354.604.0[10]
20191,1944.3[11]
20201,0954.34.4[12]
20211,1234.4[13]
20221,1944.6[14]
20231,2664.8[15]
20241,3004.8

Thats the road toll figures from 1975 until 2025...

Since then, we have had RBT introduced, speed cameras, as well as radar then laser speed checking (mobile and fixed) have seen a MAJOR drop in deaths on Australia's roads, despite a huge increase in the number of registered vehicles on the road (about 7.5 million vehicles in 1975, up to around 22 million in 2025, the number of fatal crashes resulting in deaths has actually halved....

Had the numbers remained constant ie zero improvement then with a 3 fold rise in registered vehicles, then you would expect a 3 fold rise in deaths (so from 3600 in 75, you would extrapolate that to close to 11000 deaths annually- and we are still bitching because its still considered high at 1300!!!!!!
 
Ironically, that list shows what I have been saying, that since covid, the number of dickheads on the roads has been steadily rising (speeders, red light runners etc are definitely on the rise and need to be curbed) and lo and behold- the number of deaths in the last few years has also spiked noticeably....
 
By the way, are you able to pre-heat your battery half an hour before arriving at a charger? If you can, try that.
Thanks for the tip. I found a video by another Scenic owner about this. Like me, he only charges at 50-60 kw when not pre-heating, but he charges at 132 kw when pre-heating.

The snag is that Renault has chosen to make pre-heating invisible. It isn't even mentioned in the manuals. There is no way of knowing if it is on or off. The system switches pre-heating on if you select a charging station in the built-in navigation system, which is Google Maps. If this charging station is an intermediate destination, and not a final destination, the car will invisibly switch on pre-heating.

I don't use Google Maps, I use a navigation system called Sygic that works from my telephone over Apple CarPlay. This means that I need to use the inferior Google Maps if I want pre-heating. 😡

That is, of course, if this is not something that the video guy has in his car that I don't. He claims that his is just a standard Scenic, but during the video he demonstrates loads of stuff that isn't installed in my standard Scenic.
 
I’m preparing for the 1,000km-ish drive back to Geneva tomorrow and as usual the range of my bladder is more of a preoccupation than the range of my TM3 😆
 
I’m preparing for the 1,000km-ish drive back to Geneva tomorrow and as usual the range of my bladder is more of a preoccupation than the range of my TM3 😆
Yeah, my prostate would definitely be the determining factor in where I would stop.

I absolutely believe that 10, even 5 years ago, Cobra's concern about his trip from Texas to Daytona, Florida might have been "materially inconvenienced by charging stops. But not today.
 
I’m preparing for the 1,000km-ish drive back to Geneva tomorrow and as usual the range of my bladder is more of a preoccupation than the range of my TM3 😆
Further to my previous posting, I had no range or bladder comfort issues on my trip home yesterday. I did, however, spend nine hours at the Shuttle terminal in Cheriton and finally get onboard a crossing seven and a quarter hours after my expected departure time, thanks to the massive power outage that caused chaos on international services. My plans to do most of the drive in daylight did not come to fruition.
 

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