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Did We Kill Michael Jackson?

You are right.

And there is also the thing I once heard on America Most Wanted that they often have toys around or objects that are of interest to kids (Neverland Theme Park)
 
People who seek fame have little cause to complain about the effects of it.

the question here is, Did he seek fame? Or did he get thrown in the maelstrom of fame as a 6 year old boy, and never had the choice to get out?

sure you can say he could have stopped as an adult. But dancing and singing was all he could do, he never learned to do anything else. And as soon as he got real success I bet dozens of people around him kept pushing him, in search for a piece of the loot.
 
I don't know. Did he have anything really like a normal life?

We can never know because we cannot walk in his shoes.

Actually we can know, because we have control subjects - four other children who grew up in the exact same circumstances as Michael did until the age of majority. After 18, they did not go on to become quite as famous, but their developmental years were the same - and they did not end up like him. Jackson's questionable ideosyncracies may be the result of many things, but to say they were primarily the result of his so-called "lost childhood" is to make a bigger leap than the suggestion that he was a pedophile. Whatever happened to make him "different", happened when he was an adult.
 
the question here is, Did he seek fame? Or did he get thrown in the maelstrom of fame as a 6 year old boy, and never had the choice to get out?

sure you can say he could have stopped as an adult. But dancing and singing was all he could do, he never learned to do anything else. And as soon as he got real success I bet dozens of people around him kept pushing him, in search for a piece of the loot.

Then it all boils down to how much responsibility for one's actions one bears, and how much one can lay at the upbringing. I'm just pointing out that someone who dislikes attention does not float a giant statue of himself down the Rhine. If he didn't seek fame originally, he sure as hell sought it later.
 
Paris Hilton is a victim!!!

LEAVE BRITNEY SPEARS ALONE!!! :cries:
 
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Add to the mix the fact that in North American society women are all pretty much gold diggers.

Really? Talk about your generalizations. I'm insulted.

I'd date Michael because he was drop dead gorgeous. Not because he was rich.
Too bad that I missed him by a few generations.
 
You are right.

And there is also the thing I once heard on America Most Wanted that they often have toys around or objects that are of interest to kids (Neverland Theme Park)

Exactly, grown men who own lot of toys and gifts that they give to droves of strange kids who are invited to sleep in their bedrooms with no adults around.
 
Really? Talk about your generalizations. I'm insulted.

I'd date Michael because he was drop dead gorgeous. Not because he was rich.
Too bad that I missed him by a few generations.
..
Bolding...
WTF?
Which version?
Before or after the Sling's "face circumcision"?
Up until the mutilation began, he looked fine to me.
 
I am reading more and more information that is just coming out.
I think it is too early to speculate.
 
The DEA is now invovled in the investigation. They have the power to overrule Doctor/Patient confidenciality where drugs are involved. This could blow the whole seamy routine of "Entertainment Doctors" prescribing whatever their Celeb patienst want wide open.
 
EMM,

Exactly. We can't know for sure if the guy was a pedophile but there are a lot of signs he seemed to lean that way. Aside from being an older single man who routinely invites kids into his bedroom, here are some other red flags that, taken collectively, look pretty goshdarn suspicious IMO ...

Michael continued to have his adult-free sleep-overs even after a serious accusation. The guy hits me as odd, but not stupid. Pedophiles often risk legally questionable behavior w/kids, even after being accused of molestation or rape, or being convicted.

Pedophiles also tend to court women for the main purpose of being around her kids (or to have them). And often seem to lack interest in adult woman (or men).

They tend to see children as their developmental equals, or claim they see it that way (Michael stated that in at least one interview I can recall).

They often were physically and/or sexually abused themselves.

They often have poor social boundaries with kids ... am thinking of that interview with Bashir where Michael is holding hands with the boy; fingers intertwined like lovers. Or Michael calling kids up at 3AM to have a chat ... The way he described the kids sleeping over ("charming", how he'd "light the fireplace"). My subjective opinion is his language often described eros rather than agape and his obsessive love of kids to the exclusion of adults was more than a little disturbing.

And that alarm system outside his bedroom ... I don't know. But the most disturbing thing IMO was that parents thoughtlessly rented their kids out to him for overnights.


What you said.

And here are some more:

He often waxed poetic about the beauty and innocence and purity of children. Language typical of a pedophile.

He invited children of both genders to his home but the boys seemed to outnumber the girls...and he displayed very little interest in the girls. If he loved children so much, why didn't he pay attention to these children's sisters?

The boys he took an interest in were often of the same specific age and the same stage of puberty. Both accusers were 13 at the time of the alleged rape.

The boys never seemed to stay around when they became teenagers and adults. Few if any of them seem to have maintained their relationships with him past a certain age.

He surrounded himself with children who were terminally ill, had single parents, were very poor or had some other personal problems. Generosity? Or singling out a weak, shy, needy, lonely and defenseless child, as pedophiles often do? Or both?

He lavished money, time and attention on children he didn't abuse, maybe to gain the trust and goodwill of parents and guardians and the goodwill of the public and community. Typical of a pedophile.

He had few companions and friends of his own age- Uri Geller and Deepak Chopra seem to be exaggerating their relationship with him and he didn't seem all that close with other people who say they were friends, such as Liz Taylor and MC Hammer- and seemed more comfortable and relaxed around children than around adults.



Again, this isn't hard evidence. Again, this doesn't prove he was a pedophile. Still, when you stack them up and take them all together, they do seem to point to it.

The parents of these kids, though. What were they thinking? A complete and total stranger and they left their children all alone with him for weeks, something you wouldn't do if he was your own brother or your closest friend.
 
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I think I might start a discussion thread implying we were the driving force behind OJ's troubled life as well.
 
What you said.


He had few companions and friends of his own age- Uri Geller and Deepak Chopra seem to be exaggerating their relationship with him and he didn't seem all that close with other people who say they were friends, such as Liz Taylor and MC Hammer- and seemed more comfortable and relaxed around children than around adults.

Well, now it has come out that at least that part is an exaggerated myth spun by tabloids:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5d9lGasMGk


Maybe lots of your other points are half-truths and myths and lies from people wanting a piece of his riches.

We live in a nation that loves to sue and accuse and invent stories.

At least there are stories floating around that the first molestation case was a shake-down and the jurors in the second case thought that was a fake charges too.
 
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You are probably joking but when you mentioned OJ, I had a thought about him.

There was speculation that OJ had anger and hatred towards women because his father abandoned OJ's mother and their four children to, as Dominick Dunne put it in his coverage of the trial, "pursue an alternative lifestyle".

If this indeed prompted OJ to abuse his partners, it stemmed from something that happened long, long, long before he was ever famous.

This is probably the case with many famous people: they had problems before they were famous and fame only made it much worse. For instance, Chris Farley was reported to be an out of control drunk even as a teenager and came from a household and environment where drinking was as common as eating and breathing. His father, though described as kind and loving, was grossly overweight and an alcoholic in deep denial and Farley seemed to have both inherited his problems and learned from his parents' questionable behavior (a brother says that his parents actually used to host midnight beer bashes for their sons and their sons' buddies- when the boys were 16 or younger!).

So he had addictions because of both nature and nurture and fame just made it several times worse.
 
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You know, I have been doing some digging around.
Maybe MJ was not as much of a freak as we thought.
The way he had Blanket makes sense to me now.

He said it was with a woman he knew (the egg donor)
and he insisted that all three kids came from his sperm.

The egg donor was someone who wanted to have MJ's
kid and he said he had a relationship with her.

But she didn't want all the tabloid scum (can you blame her)?

So that is why the child was carried by a surrogate who
never knew who the parents were.

Makes sense afterall.

Lets see if there is a logical explaination for other stuff....
 
They all seem to quote the BGNES news agency. I never heard of them. But they must be legit otherwise, why would anyone quote them?
Let's just wait and see if this is legit.
So the legitimacy of a source can be determined by the number of times it's repeated?

Wow!!! This changes everything!!!

I'm going to have to re-evaluate that Bible stuff.
 
Another strong piece of evidence against Jackson: a porn magazine was reportedly found with both his fingerprints on it and the accuser's.

A favorite tactic of molesters' is to share porn with their victim before abusing them. With teenage boys, it serves both to entice them to visit the molester's home and to arouse them. Maybe also as a way to emotionally bond with your victim and gain their friendship, by sharing something as intimate as that.

Of course, there are other explanations...goodness knows teenage boys know where in the house "stuff" is...but if Jackson was showing the boy "pictures of girls", it would also "fit" the theory and "fit" in the profile of an average child molester.

It would fit in very, very well.

As would the fact that he was giving children wine. Again, something pedophiles are known to do, because they know what toys a 13-year-old boy likes, how to emotionally bond with them and how to take advantage of them.

Even if he weren't a pedophile, those parents were crazy to leave their kids alone with him. An utterly irresponsible guardian who behaves like an 11-year-old? In charge of dozens of kids, some of them handicapped or ill? Who thinks nothing of serving them wine? And lets them drive mini cars and ride a home Ferris wheel? Lets them indulge their every whim, from playing video games all day to staying up late all week? At the very least, this is emotionally unhealthy and at the worst, it could very easily end in physical injuries and lawsuits left and right. Let's see, let's count the ways this could end in tears...!

Here's a blog post whose author must have read my mind-

http://santitafarella.wordpress.com...-michael-jackson-might-have-been-a-pedophile/
 
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BTW: Is there any evidence that Michael Jackson was sexually abused by his father/did he ever say something about that despite the mental and physical abuses in terms of punishment/caning?
 

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