Merged 2024 Election Thread

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dirtywick said:
never thought this thread would turn into a page of arguments about how much more expense made up hamburger prices are now
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Neither did I but here we are and IMO it's an excellent example of the kind of uphill battle Joe Biden faces for re-election. His current, fact based, reality is competing against a rose-tinted, mythologised, fictional version of the past.

It doesn't matter whether hamburger was really readily available for 99c a pound a handful of years ago, what matters is that tens of millions of people probably believe that it was and that prices are now six times higher and it's all Joe Biden's fault.

It's like the oft-repeated mantra that back in the '70s a blue collar man on a single wage could afford to raise a family whilst today people are barely getting by on two salaries. Whilst this is somewhat true, there are a number of significant caveats:

  • It was only a subset of well paid blue collar jobs that allowed this to happen
  • Unionisation was a key element of that - the same people who hark back to this golden age are the same people who broke the unions
  • Today's "barely getting by" lifestyle is much better than the usual '70s lifestyle whether it's the stuff we have, the food we have or the quality of housing we have
 
dirtywick said:
never thought this thread would turn into a page of arguments about how much more expense made up hamburger prices are now
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*shrug* There's a couple parts of this, after all. If ChrisBFRPKY had just left it things at, to shorten things -

ChrisBFRPKY said:
The consumer price increases will be a major factor in this election.
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That would be fairly easily defensible. The voting public is often swayed to some extent by stuff like that without context.

Where ChrisBFRPKY runs into trouble is his attempt to effectively blame it on Biden and praise Trump using decidedly flimsy arguments, like the ground beef one. The counter arguments aren't all good, of course, but the ground beef argument itself is so fundamentally flimsy that it's hard for me to care, at the moment. It's fine and all to fondly remember how things were after Obama handed off a recovered and good economy after the previous Republican economic disaster to Trump and back before Trump played a major role in another Republican economic disaster, of course. Blaming the results of disasters on Democrats rather than taking responsibility for the irresponsible actions of their leaders and actually holding them accountable is pretty much what Republicans do, though, in a larger political sense.
 
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The Don said:
Neither did I but here we are and IMO it's an excellent example of the kind of uphill battle Joe Biden faces for re-election. His current, fact based, reality is competing against a rose-tinted, mythologised, fictional version of the past.

It doesn't matter whether hamburger was really readily available for 99c a pound a handful of years ago, what matters is that tens of millions of people probably believe that it was and that prices are now six times higher and it's all Joe Biden's fault.
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That there is a grain of feel truth to it certainly doesn't help. Prices are largely higher than they were, and that excuses much fallacy in the minds of the motivated. The strongest lies tend to have grains of truth at the core, after all.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
Sale prices and regular prices are two very different things. The current "sale" price for hamburger is $2.99/lb. during Trump it was $0.99/lb

Over 200% higher during Biden's watch.
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Blaming President Biden for global supply chain issues caused by the covid epidemic, is pretty ignorant and dishonest.
 
The Don said:
Neither did I but here we are and IMO it's an excellent example of the kind of uphill battle Joe Biden faces for re-election. His current, fact based, reality is competing against a rose-tinted, mythologised, fictional version of the past.
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idk hopefully biden doesn’t waste too much time and too many resources on trying to reason with lunatics.
 
Hercules56 said:
Blaming President Biden for global supply chain issues caused by the covid epidemic, is pretty ignorant and dishonest.
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It is like some people have totally forgotten how the price of nearly everything except gas started rising when Covid hit in 2020.
 
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surrogate said:
It is like some people have totally forgotten how the price of nearly everything except gas started rising when Covid hit in 2020.
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Forgotten? I'm not so sure. Rather, I'd suggest that the issue may lie somewhere else. To quote their leader -

"I don't take responsibility at all."
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
The truth is a powerful thing. It destroys false narratives such as the one you're desperately trying to push now.
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Yeah, tell us again how the fake alternate electoral certificates that were missing the official state seal and the signature of the Governor and Secretary of State, were not an illegal act of fraud. Then you can talk about "false narratives".
 
Bookies are either taking a lot of bets on Trump, or their algorithms are saying he's a live chance, with latest odds:

Trump - $1-91
Biden - $2-60

I would have thought the other way round was more likely, but the real killer is 3rd favourite: Michelle Obama at $13.

When someone who would never take up the job is on the 3rd line of betting it's a good guide neither of the first two are very popular.
 
Hercules56 said:
Yeah, tell us again how the fake alternate electoral certificates that were missing the official state seal and the signature of the Governor and Secretary of State, were not an illegal act of fraud. Then you can talk about "false narratives".
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That's not really a response to the specific thing that was in question, though? Not that the thing in question deserves the attention that it's gotten, which has given ChrisBFRPKY a straw to hold onto as he tries to push a mess of easily debunked falsehoods alongside it.

With that said, I thought that you already knew ChrisBFRPKY's opinion on that. Holding the criminals responsible for that and all the rest accountable for their actions is political persecution and possibly even the destruction of democracy!
 
The Atheist said:
Bookies are either taking a lot of bets on Trump, or their algorithms are saying he's a live chance, with latest odds:

Trump - $1-91
Biden - $2-60

I would have thought the other way round was more likely, but the real killer is 3rd favourite: Michelle Obama at $13.

When someone who would never take up the job is on the 3rd line of betting it's a good guide neither of the first two are very popular.
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How do odds in dollars work ?
 
The Don said:
It doesn't matter whether it's true or not - the key thing is that people believe that ground beef was available for 99c a pound when Trump was President. :rolleyes:

I'm sure they do.
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Was that when we were at war with Eurasia, or Eastasia?
 
Prices went up pretty much everywhere. And it's getting better, pretty much everywhere. But don't worry, politicians everywhere blame the rise on the other guy, and take the credit for the improvements. But hey, nobody's buying that, right ?
 
Apparently, Trump wants to bring Paul Manafort back into his service as a campaign manager.

The guy who fed information to the Russians so they could easily support Trump's campaign is a totally trustworthy pick, after all, nevermind the illegal part. It's almost like Trump wants him to do it again and pardon him again for it, if necessary.
 
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