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Thoughts arising from police bodycam footage

i agree that between the first amendment auditors that are basically lunatics agitating the cops, and the body cam footage of cops dealing with psychos, they generally do a pretty good job at keeping their cool and deescalating the situation. i wouldn't want that job, just dealing with the worst people in their worst moments day after day.

but as it concerns police behavior, i think the problem is that when the bad behavior is documented, it's rarely treated with the seriousness or appropriate levels of discipline. although, as i've come to learn in life, criminals are shown a lot more leniency than you'd imagine as well. but either way, cops need to be held to a higher standard and those standards need to be enforced, or the public trust erodes. as we've seen.
 
3point14 said:
There are also many ineractions in which the behaviour of the officer concerned, to put it mildly, is well below the standards one would deem acceptable and, and this is the concerning thing, those interactions seldom seem to result in any meaningful consequenses for the officer concerned.
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I would argue that cops typically receive more training in non-escalation than civilians do, and consequently perform much better than citizens in scenarios where non-escalation is called for. This is especially important because the job we've given them is to enter into and remain in situations where someone is escalating or provoking escalation.

But cops are people too, and nobody is perfect. And of course institutions protecting bad behavior among their own is a problem that we should insist on mitigating as much as possible.

However, I don't think it's reasonable to default to "ACAB" just because cops do a hard job better than you could, but still imperfectly.
 
theprestige said:
I would argue that cops typically receive more training in non-escalation than civilians do, and consequently perform much better than citizens in scenarios where non-escalation is called for. This is especially important because the job we've given them is to enter into and remain in situations where someone is escalating or provoking escalation.

But cops are people too, and nobody is perfect. And of course institutions protecting bad behavior among their own is a problem that we should insist on mitigating as much as possible.

However, I don't think it's reasonable to default to "ACAB" just because cops do a hard job better than you could, but still imperfectly.
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the institutions protecting their bad behavior isn't it's own, separate problem here though. is it reasonable to default to acab for that reason, instead of because cops are imperfect? there could be an argument made there imo
 
dirtywick said:
the institutions protecting their bad behavior isn't it's own, separate problem here though. is it reasonable to default to acab for that reason, instead of because cops are imperfect? there could be an argument made there imo
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It would be a foolish argument, since we have a plethora of video evidence that it's not true.
 
theprestige said:
But cops are people too, and nobody is perfect. And of course institutions protecting bad behavior among their own is a problem that we should insist on mitigating as much as possible.
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It doesn't help things when the president advocates "not being too nice" when arresting suspects, when he says he wants to give cops immunity from prosecution.
theprestige said:
However, I don't think it's reasonable to default to "ACAB" just because cops do a hard job better than you could, but still imperfectly.
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I'm betting that I watch as many cop/auditor/sovcit videos as you and I can definitely say I could do the job better than some of the cops I've seen. It's unfortunate that they have to put up with bad behavior from frauditors trying to cash in on a bad arrest, but that's the job. On the other hand, when these layabout frauditors harass librarians, county clerks and private citizens with foul language and worse, they should be able to just tell these ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ to ◊◊◊◊ off.
 
theprestige said:
It would be a foolish argument, since we have a plethora of video evidence that it's not true.
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we have a plethora of video of institutions being stopped from protecting bad behavior of cops?

want to try again?
 
theprestige said:
I would argue that cops typically receive more training in non-escalation than civilians do, and consequently perform much better than citizens in scenarios where non-escalation is called for. This is especially important because the job we've given them is to enter into and remain in situations where someone is escalating or provoking escalation.

But cops are people too, and nobody is perfect. And of course institutions protecting bad behavior among their own is a problem that we should insist on mitigating as much as possible.

However, I don't think it's reasonable to default to "ACAB" just because
cops do a hard job better than you could, but still imperfectly.
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How do you know that?
 
Resume said:
It doesn't help things when the president advocates "not being too nice" when arresting suspects, when he says he wants to give cops immunity from prosecution.
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I wouldn't be surprised if you've spent more time thinking about the president is saying than these cops have.

Resume said:
I'm betting that I watch as many cop/auditor/sovcit videos as you and I can definitely say I could do the job better than some of the cops I've seen.
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Yes, and "some" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there.
 
Resume said:
It doesn't help things when the president advocates "not being too nice" when arresting suspects, when he says he wants to give cops immunity from prosecution.

I'm betting that I watch as many cop/auditor/sovcit videos as you and I can definitely say I could do the job better than some of the cops I've seen. It's unfortunate that they have to put up with bad behavior from frauditors trying to cash in on a bad arrest, but that's the job. On the other hand, when these layabout frauditors harass librarians, county clerks and private citizens with foul language and worse, they should be able to just tell these ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ to ◊◊◊◊ off.
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It's really not that hard to not annoy the auditors. It goes like this:

"Show me your ID"
"No, I don't have to"
"You're right, Sir/Madam, without reasonable, articulatable suspicion of a crime, you don't have to identify yourself, that's in the constitution. Have a nice day"


That's it. That's all they need to do to make all the auditors bored enough to stop doing it.
 
3point14 said:
It's really not that hard to not annoy the auditors. It goes like this:

"Show me your ID"
"No, I don't have to"
"You're right, Sir/Madam, without reasonable, articulatable suspicion of a crime, you don't have to identify yourself, that's in the constitution. Have a nice day"


That's it. That's all they need to do to make all the auditors bored enough to stop doing it.
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That might work if that's all the frauditors do.
 
cxkwz3374 said:
I just learned something new. I didn't know about drunk drivers' claims of nearby residency. I thought that every drunk driver swore that he only had two beers.
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That too. But everybody knows that part. There's a whole litany:

  • "I haven't been drinking."
  • "I had two drinks like six hours ago."
  • "I live right over there."
  • "You can follow me home if you want."
  • "I can just walk from here."
  • "Don't you have more important things to do?"
  • "But I did all the tests perfectly!"
  • "But why?"
  • "But why?"
  • "But why?"
 
3point14 said:
Reply


Could you provide examples?
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Certainly.

The disgusting frauditor Glenn Cerio enters a taped off crime scene after hours and when advised by a black officer in passing patrol car to leave, he berates the officer, calling him an effing N-word. Or when the same vile fellow insinutates himself on a DUI stop where a female officer is towing the car, he shouts she probably slept her way to her position. He also has some expletives for the tow truck driver.

Or the Iowa frauditor who when not getting the exact supplication he demands from a county clerk, calls her an effing C-word and more. The whole public servant, yaddah yaddah yaddah thing. He returns to harass her and is finally charged with harassment and serves time for it, deservedly so.

This ◊◊◊◊ crosses the line, and is the reason some states have passed halo laws concerning traffic stops, and harassment laws protecting clerks, librarians, etc. from jerks with cameras with nothing else to do.
 
of course, we never see the days and hours of harassment by police prior to individuals snapping and doing something stupid.
 
theprestige said:
We have a plethora of evidence that not all cops are bastards. It would be foolish to argue that we should default to that.
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oh i thought it was just a slogan. not really interested in arguing the liternalness of it.
 
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