What did Democrats do wrong?

[Emily's Cat]

Does this qualify as responsive on your wettest desert planet? It doesn't on mine.

I ask again: Must we have actual famine in order to notice a problem?

If we're going to have a famine if we don't import slave labor, I'd say we already have a problem.

 

[Emily's Cat]

A vast portion of the American economy is founded on exploitative labor and below sustenance wages. Restaurount workers have to depend on he gratuity of strangers (tips) to survive, big-boxes like Walmart make it almost necessary for its floor workers depend on benefits like SNAP to get by. Most employers probably long for the return of a slave economy and are just doing the best they can in the meanwhile.

I don't understand why people never blamed major industries for "taking away their jobs" when those Industries, with the support of the American government, decided to offshore production to firm up their bottom lines and boost their stock values.

Where have you been? People have been objecting to the offshoring of US jobs for decades. Some of the very first were foundational industry - steel and iron working, core materials manufacturing. And that had a huge amount of objection specifically because it was taking away US jobs.

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

Where have you been? People have been objecting to the offshoring of US jobs for decades. Some of the very first were foundational industry - steel and iron working, core materials manufacturing. And that had a huge amount of objection specifically because it was taking away US jobs.

The offshoring done by the people bankrolling the GOP? That offshoring?

 

[Olmstead]

If we're going to have a famine if we don't import slave labor, I'd say we already have a problem.

Thank God the best possible people are on the case. They will open the great bread silos of the South and remove all that famine Biden has caused by keeping them closed. Children will eat their hamburgers with tears in their eyes.

 

[Emily's Cat]

The offshoring done by the people bankrolling the GOP? That offshoring?

Why on earth would you place all of this at the foot of republicans? Are you so partisan that you can't comprehend that democrats also had a part in this?

 

[Olmstead]

Why on earth would you place all of this at the foot of republicans? Are you so partisan that you can't comprehend that democrats also had a part in this?

The Democrats are the only ones with actual solutions, while all the GOP can do is lie about bringing back obsolete coal mining jobs.

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

Why on earth would you place all of this at the foot of republicans? Are you so partisan that you can't comprehend that democrats also had a part in this?

Because the GOP is/was the party of profit above all. And the profit was in laying off US employees and offshoring, while at the same time eroding worker's rights.

 

[Reformed Offlian]

If we're going to have a famine if we don't import slave labor, I'd say we already have a problem.

Still non-responsive.

In case you forgot, I was not suggesting that we will have actual famine. I was calling out *your* apparent inability to perceive farmers as having any problems as long as *you* can get groceries at your local store. Hence my question: Must we have actual famine to notice a problem?

 

[d4m10n]

What did we do wrong?

New report recently dropped trying to answer the OP question from a center-left POV

https://twitter.com/x/status/1982824952832160081

 

[thaiboxerken]

If you could achieve higher wages for farm workers by enforcing immigration laws, why wouldn't you?

I agree, farmers should be held to account if they hire undocumented workers.

 

[Susheel]

I had a discussion on here with somebody some years ago, probably one of our "I am not MAGA, but..." interlocutors about the "Tipping" culture in the US. I mentioned that if restaurants paid a living wage to its workers, this would not be a problem. I was informed that if that was the case, the restaurant owners would go out of business. I replied that if your business plan did not account for labour costs and expected people to work and also depend on the kindness of strangers to make a living, then there they shouldn't be running a business in the first place. Didn't get a reply after that. It was at that time that I realised American private enterprise is based on the exploitation of labour for the sake of profits...and it is a model that they seem to want the world to emulate.

 

[arthwollipot]

I had a discussion on here with somebody some years ago, probably one of our "I am not MAGA, but..." interlocutors about the "Tipping" culture in the US. I mentioned that if restaurants paid a living wage to its workers, this would not be a problem. I was informed that if that was the case, the restaurant owners would go out of business. I replied that if your business plan did not account for labour costs and expected people to work and also depend on the kindness of strangers to make a living, then there they shouldn't be running a business in the first place. Didn't get a reply after that. It was at that time that I realised American private enterprise is based on the exploitation of labour for the sake of profits...and it is a model that they seem to want the world to emulate.

Yeah, bugger that. Pay people what they deserve.

 

[Susheel]

Yeah, bugger that. Pay people what they deserve.

Who decides what they deserve? It isn't definitely the "market" (may its name be praised) which seems to have a skewed idea about the worth of labor.

 

[Darat]

Who decides what they deserve? It isn't definitely the "market" (may its name be praised) which seems to have a skewed idea about the worth of labor.

In the UK the tax-payers subsidise employers that employ folk on the minimum wage because you would be (if you had a family) eligible for state benefits if you were paid the minimum wage. And a lot of employers are crafty with contracts etc. to be able to pretty much pay less than the minimum wage.

 

[Susheel]

In the UK the tax-payers subsidise employers that employ folk on the minimum wage because you would be (if you had a family) eligible for state benefits if you were paid the minimum wage. And a lot of employers are crafty with contracts etc. to be able to pretty much pay less than the minimum wage.

Similar in the US I take it, since most Walmart, Amazon employees also need SNAP and other such to make it through.

 

[Susheel]

Should there now be a "What did MAGA* do wrong?" thread? The only option I can think of though, is that They were bigoted, racist ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊.


I think we can forego the Republican label now. Maybe Cuomo can start a New Republican party. You know:

 

[dann]

Democrats did this wrong! And it was not back then. It is NOW! They are still doing it.

Senate breaks Democratic filibuster in key vote toward reopening the government (CNN, Nov 9, 2025)
• Senate moves forward: The Senate has voted 60-40 on a key step toward reopening the government. The vote came after a critical group of eight Senate Democratic centrists reached a deal with Senate GOP leaders and the White House to reopen the government in exchange for a future vote on extending enhanced Affordable Care subsidies.

Senate Democrats blink on the shutdown after 40 days of pain (MSNBC, Nov 10, 2025)
After nearly six weeks of a painful shutdown, a critical number of Senate Democrats backed a Republican funding bill to reopen government — with little to show for holding out so long.
The breakthrough, which came together suddenly on day 40 of the shutdown, offers Democrats few new concessions beyond what Republicans had already proposed. In fact, the emerging deal mirrors what Senate Majority Leader John Thune, R-S.D., floated weeks ago during an interview with MSNBC: reopen the government now, and Republicans will later give Democrats a vote on extending the expiring Obamacare subsidies.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on X, Nov 10, 2025
The average monthly SNAP benefit is $177 a person.
The average ACA benefit is up to $550 a person/mo.
People want us to hold the line for a reason. This is not a matter of appealing to a base. It’s about people’s lives.
Working people want leaders whose word means something.

Ro Khanna on X, Nov 10, 2025
Senator Schumer is no longer effective and should be replaced. If you can’t lead the fight to stop healthcare premiums from skyrocketing for Americans, what will you fight for?

Democrat ENDS SCHUMER CAREER By Doing UNTHINKABLE! (Jack Cocchiarella on YouTube, Nov 10, 2025 - 13:04 min.)
Political commentator Jack Cocchiarella reacts to Chuck Schumer being called out by elected Democrats.

Secular Talk on X, Nov 10, 2025

 

[dann]

Even centrist Democrats like Hakeem Jeffries and Gavin Newsom now appear to be up in arms against the right-wing fraction of the party, Schumer's guys:
"It's complete BS": Dems go ballistic over Senate shutdown deal (AXIOS. Nov 10, 2025)

Sen. Bernie Sanders on X, Nov 9, 2025
I’m voting no on the continuing resolution that would double healthcare premiums for 20 million Americans, kick 15 million people off Medicaid & allow 50,000 Americans to die unnecessarily every year. All to give $1 trillion in tax breaks for billionaires.

With a video, 3:24 min.

Sen. Bernie Sanders on X, Nov 10, 2025
Tonight was a very bad night.

With a video, 1:39 min.

Governor Gavin Newsom on X, Nov 10, 2025
Tonight’s Senate vote on the federal government shutdown should have been a time for strength.
Instead we saw capitulation and a betrayal of working Americans.
The American people need more from their leaders.

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

Democrats did this wrong! And it was not back then. It is NOW! They are still doing it.

I saw that, never trust a centrist. They will throw the general good under the bus every single time to support the far right.

 

[Segnosaur]

Democrats did this wrong! And it was not back then. It is NOW! They are still doing it.

Senate breaks Democratic filibuster in key vote toward reopening the government (CNN, Nov 9, 2025)

There are certainly going to be a lot of people pissed off at the Democrats over this, and understanably so. (They 'gave up' over health care issues, for the equivalent of some magic beans from the republican side.)

Amazingly, Schumer was not one of the senators who caved.

However, lets try to look for a silver lining...

- From what I understand, some of Trump's firings will be cut back, people will get paid, and SNAP payments will go through. (Admittedly, I don't care about the MAGAchud who were faced with the prospect of going hungry, but there were some decent people who were also facing food problems.)

- This deal/capitulation is not permanent... and there is the prospect of another shutdown in a few month's time. Hopefully, if the republicans continue being the party of Trump, democrats can initiate another shutdown, and if that happens, it will be closer to the mid-term elections (and probably more damaging to the republicans as a result)

- People are concerned about inflation. Republicans will probably see their support erode when health care subsidies end and people's health care premiums go up. (Yeah, the democrats wanted to prevent that, but from a "win the next election" point of view, it might actually benefit them to let the republicans cut health care funding.)

- If the House is back in session to vote on funding, MAGA Mike Johnson will be forced to swear in Adelita Grijalva. Given her support of the decision to release the Epstein files (and assuming none of the republicans change their mind), you could see some damaging information released about Trump.