Third Eye Spies

[Armitage72]

So there you have it. It really would likewise be comforting to believe that the CIA's psychic study was cancelled because the agency eventually realized psychic powers don't exist and therefore the whole endeavor was pointless; but given the fate of the DoD's recent UFO program, I think we have to at least entertain the possibility that the CIA only stopped studying "remote viewing" because some fundy who had just been promoted into a policy-making position in the organization's leadership decided that psychic powers was "messing with devil-stuff".

I recently read a book, I can't remember which one, maybe a tabletop RPG supplement, in which part of the backstory is that the US government used to have a covert agency tasked with protecting the country from supernatural threats. The problem was that they viewed the supernatural as a weapon that could be used against other threats. When Jimmy Carter, a devout Baptist, took office and learned of the agency and their practices, he insisted that the country would not have dealings with demonic forces and shut it down immediately.

 

[Axxman300]

Allow me to answer that question by posing another: Have you ever heard of Robert Bigelow?

Yes. I met him at work in 1996. The discussion quickly turned to UFO's (I was into them big time back then). He was one of the few people I've ever met who knew as much about the practical end of the phenomenon as I did.

He's just a guy with a lot of money who's willing to put it where his mouth is, and bankroll what is questionable scientific research, but while using actual scientists (gotta pay off those college loans somehow).

My big knock on him, as a guy who keeps one foot in the Woo door, is that after 26 years of research NIDS has yet to release any kind of report to the public. I realize they're a private organization and not obligated to do so, but you'd think they'd have something concrete by now. I understand research of any kind takes time, but those scientific entities he criticizes almost always provide status reports.

Back to the subject, either it works or it doesn't. If I'm in charge of the CIA budget, and my options are spending money on human assets (bribery, coercion, rewards), and verified surveillance technology, or researching psychic powers that, even if they work - only work part of the time, the choice is easy. The CIA isn't there to advance psychic research, the CIA is there to spy on foreign governments.

 

[Checkmite]

Perhaps not as much as you’d like. I think that the best way to decide why the CIA cancelled the remote viewing project is to look at the reasons why the CIA cancelled the remote viewing project and not look at another related cancelled project and then use that as an analogy to the one we are talking about. You may be right but, equally, you may not.

Like I said, merely entertaining the notion. After all, you've just said yourself that the CIA's documented reasons for cancelling the program were really a pretext.

 

[Checkmite]

My big knock on him, as a guy who keeps one foot in the Woo door, is that after 26 years of research NIDS has yet to release any kind of report to the public. I realize they're a private organization and not obligated to do so, but you'd think they'd have something concrete by now. I understand research of any kind takes time, but those scientific entities he criticizes almost always provide status reports.

I can't really hold that against him; according to Knapp, in all that time NIDS hasn't actually found anything that can reasonably be reported. Yes, the organization has internally hacked together a justification for why that lack of evidence actually proves them right all along; but they're intelligent enough to understand they can't put that in a report when they have promised all along to be scientifically rigorous.

To me, using a political connection to create a useless government program that serves no function except to enrich one's own private enterprise is far more reprehensible; it's blatant corruption.

 

[Axxman300]

To me, using a political connection to create a useless government program that serves no function except to enrich one's own private enterprise is far more reprehensible; it's blatant corruption.

Agree 100%.

I think that hints at his ethics. And it provides an overview of the ethics behind many of the folks who push for money to fund this kind of research. Believers of Woo who post threads here often link to websites and Youtube accounts of people trying to sell books, and other accouterments. Like 911A&ETruth, very little research on their various topics is done (if any).

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Hhhmmmm....didn't we say the cia stopped ?

The problem with this kind of approach is that it only works if there is no record of the conversation that led up to it.
No, Bubba, "we" didn't, because there is no "we" here. Some of us said the CIA had stopped. You did not. Here is the complete conversation. Please highlight the part in which you agreed that the CIA had stopped.

If the CIA was so convinced that remote viewing was real why did they stop trying to use it?

Why would anyone think of asking ?

Oh I get it now, it was a joke complimenting Cosmic Yak's joke !

His was brilliant, as it plays well, whether you take it as sarcasm, or as if he was serious ! Genius!

So no actual answer then?

No need.

They covered it very well. To my satisfaction anyway.

Yup. You never said it. This is, of course, SOP for you, and I am neither surprised nor impressed.
So, how about, just for once, going on the record?
1. Yes or no. Do you accept that the CIA has ended its remote viewing programme?
2. Yes or no. Do you think that remote viewing works?

 

[Bubba]

A garden variety fool might think it is possible to know whether or not certain KGB or CIA programs ended, were renamed, went black, or ever were anything more than a calculated hoax.











Yup. You never said it. This is, of course, SOP for you, and I am neither surprised nor impressed.
So, how about, just for once, going on the record?
1. Yes or no. Do you accept that the CIA has ended its remote viewing programme?
2. Yes or no. Do you think that remote viewing works?[/QUOTE]

 

[Axxman300]

A garden variety fool might think it is possible to know whether or not certain KGB or CIA programs ended, were renamed, went black, or ever were anything more than a calculated hoax.

1. All CIA/NSA/NRO projects are Black.
2. Successful, ongoing Black Projects remain secret.

3. Garden variety fools are always the last ones to figure out the CIA has staged a hoax. Between the KGB/FSB and CIA, it is safe to assume most CT's you buy into were started by them.

 

[Bubba]

1. All CIA/NSA/NRO projects are Black.
2. Successful, ongoing Black Projects remain secret.

3. Garden variety fools are always the last ones to figure out the CIA has staged a hoax. Between the KGB/FSB and CIA, it is safe to assume most CT's you buy into were started by them.

Can you name them please?

 

[Cosmic Yak]

The problem with this kind of approach is that it only works if there is no record of the conversation that led up to it.
No, Bubba, "we" didn't, because there is no "we" here. Some of us said the CIA had stopped. You did not. Here is the complete conversation. Please highlight the part in which you agreed that the CIA had stopped.




Yup. You never said it. This is, of course, SOP for you, and I am neither surprised nor impressed.
So, how about, just for once, going on the record?
1. Yes or no. Do you accept that the CIA has ended its remote viewing programme?
2. Yes or no. Do you think that remote viewing works?

A garden variety fool might think it is possible to know whether or not certain KGB or CIA programs ended, were renamed, went black, or ever were anything more than a calculated hoax.











Yup. You never said it. This is, of course, SOP for you, and I am neither surprised nor impressed.
So, how about, just for once, going on the record?
1. Yes or no. Do you accept that the CIA has ended its remote viewing programme?
2. Yes or no. Do you think that remote viewing works?

Once again the concept of 'yes/no' questions eludes you.
If remote viewing doesn't work, then it really doesn't matter whether the CIA, the KGB or even BTS are investigating it, because they'd be wasting their time.
This brings me to my second question- you know, the one you ignored because you were too busy being snidey.
Yes or no. Do you think that remote viewing works?

If you can answer this, we can then start talking about why you think this, and why any of the Evil Alphabets (and, yes, I am including BTS in that class) would bother going all Black-Ops-y on it.