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Shutdown 2023

JoeMorgue said:
In any sane world if Congress goes "You must spend 10 dollars
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That's where we are. Congress is going "you must spend... uhhh... uhhhhhh..." like they're ordering at McDonald's and don't remember what's on the menu. They'll eventually get the same burger and fries they get every time, but first they have to order it.
 
theprestige said:
Oh no! The Dreaded Shutdown! I guess we're all ******, for the thirty seconds it actually takes for some political clowns to agree on which one gets out of the car first!
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I have a lot of friends who are federal employees. Will you loan them money so they can put food on the table during the shutdown?
 
JoeMorgue said:
Just copying and pasting myself from the last time we went through this:

Let me explain this because it's so stupid it sounds like a joke.

Congress, by law, decides two things.

1. How much money the government will spend.
2. How much money the government collects in taxes.

The President, by law, must

1. Put the budget AND tax law Congress sets into action.

Here's where it get stupid.

Congress can make the amount they want to spend bigger than the amount they want to bring in in taxes, leading to a deficit.

The President must then ask Congress for permission to borrow over a set limit in order to pay for the things Congress says he has to buy with the amount of money Congress gives him.

And Congress can tell him no. That's where reality breaks. In any sane world if Congress goes "You must spend 10 dollars and I'm only giving you 5" the right of the President to borrow the remaining 5 would be implied but that's not how it works in this nut house.

That's it. That's all this is. THAT'S ALL THIS IS. A quirk of governmental procedures allows Congress to go "Here's 10 dollars. Go to the store and buy 20 dollars worth of things. You can only put 5 dollars on the credit card."

That's it. Seriously look at me. Look me in the eyes. That's all it is. I tell you this because literally any moment now Republican Trolls are going to flood this thread to tell you that it is literally anything other than that and it is not, they will be lying.
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You are flat out wrong. That's the debt limit that you describe.

The analogue would be "Here's zero money. Don't buy anything until we give you some. We actually have the money via taxes and borrowing, but we're not giving you any. Therefore, you can't buy a damn thing."

ETA: Highlighted. Borrowing has nothing to do with next week's shutdown. The borrowing/debt limit issue was resolved (albeit temporarily) months ago. This is the budget, a separate issue.

Debt limit is about money in the bank. The budget is the approved shopping list. Store won't sell anything to us kids until Mom and Dad write up the shopping list and agree on it. Mom and Dad don't agree so the store won't sell, no matter how much money is in the bank.
 
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crescent said:
Debt limit is about money in the bank. The budget is the approved shopping list. Store won't sell anything to us kids until Mom and Dad write up the shopping list and agree on it. Mom and Dad Mom don't agree so the store won't sell, no matter how much money is in the bank.
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FTFY. Nobody's even asked Dad yet.

Dave
 
Hercules56 said:
I have a lot of friends who are federal employees. Will you loan them money so they can put food on the table during the shutdown?
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In the building where I work, hundreds of federal employees are skilled, unionized, blue-collar types who do the actual work of maintaining the fleet for the Air Force. These guys can most likely skip a paycheck by leaning on Visa or Mastercard, but two or three pay periods will probably make things pretty tight.
 
Some of the military focused banks (USAA, Navy Federal, etc) have in the past given interest free short term loans in cases of government shutdowns, but again the point is people shouldn't have to put up with that while the government plays games.
 
crescent said:
It figures.

So I'm a federal employee. I've even got a work-from-home gig. It's nice.

I've got an office set up in the basement. We do multiple video calls a day. The basement has been looking a little rough so I use a false background - I just pick pretty pictures I've taken of places I've been. Usually northern Germany because northern Germany is frippen gorgeous.

But I have also been fixing up the basement to make it look presentable. New paint, some nice (second hand) book shelves, and old dresser I revarnished, a nice (also secondhand) aquarium. I got a photo given to me by former co-workers framed. It has all been progressing for months now.

So the plan for this upcoming weekend was to finish the work on the area behind me. Hang up some framed pics (of places I used to work), a few little shelves with knickknacks. Then I would (some of the time) not use the false background just so they could see the nice bookshelves and stuff behind me. I would even be pretentious and arrogant and refer to as my "study". I could look very studious in my study.

So they shut the whole damn government down just so I can't show off my effort. :mad::mad::mad::mad:
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Swap out a couple of the items for, say, a lava lamp and an old Snap-on calendar and - voila! - you’ve got yourself a den of iniquity!

Perhaps repurpose it as a den of iniquity?
 
Let's not forget this is not just about the deficit, some crazy Republicans also want to defund the justice department investigations into Trump. (But of course it's okay to investigate Hunter and Menendez)

;)
 
a_unique_person said:
What time it happens it starts to become the norm.
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GOP takes the House and shuts down the government is an historical norm, at least since I became old enough to vote.

  • 1995–1996 United States federal government shutdownsWP
  • 2013 United States federal government shutdownWP
  • 2018–2019 United States federal government shutdownWP

ETA: 2023 wiki page pending; watch this space.
 
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Regnad Kcin said:
Swap out a couple of the items for, say, a lava lamp and an old Snap-on calendar and - voila! - you’ve got yourself a den of iniquity!

Perhaps repurpose it as a den of iniquity?
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We've got a couple of lava lamps in the kids rooms. But they seem terribly energy inefficient. Maybe in winter when the heat would be useful anyway.

I do have a Turkish lamp. That's pretty good too.

I think for a real den of iniquity I would need a couch. There isn't really room for that though, not with the current layout.

Efforts to get my wife to "step into my office and discuss that job/promotion opportunity;)" have not yet been successful. I maintain hope, but it may not happen.:(
 
JoeMorgue said:
Some of the military focused banks (USAA, Navy Federal, etc) have in the past given interest free short term loans in cases of government shutdowns, but again the point is people shouldn't have to put up with that while the government plays games.
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They shouldn't have joined the military if they did not want their life and wellbeing to be used for political gains.
 
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