Regarding Franko...

[Mossy]

I thought you wanted to discuss your beliefs Mussy?

Why won't you explain why TLOP must be a non-conscious mystery force?

Actually, Fran, I wanted to discuss fatalism - but as a starting point I wanted you to ditch the whole "prove free-willy" line, since I have clearly stated that I don't believe in it. But you, Fran, are unwilling to even admit that some people might know their own personal beliefs better than you. If you are going to approach the whole thing as yet another, "I know what you believe better than you do" thing - then I won't waste my time.

I wrongly assumed you might know something about fatalism - silly me.

Second, do you honestly consider this type of crap a "discussion":

• I think you are lying and you do believe you have magic powers. You are just too embarassed to admit it...
• Everyone knows that the reason you are so obsessed with me is that because I have wiped the floor of the R&P up with your worthless ass more times than can be counted.
• Do you just randomly select words from a dictionary when you make posts? You should try stringing them together into coherent sentences that actually reflect the way things work in reality
• I guess Trixy making a PLOP on you would be a predictable outcome
• It makes you look like an idiot religious fanatic desperately trying to defend his absurd dogmatic claims by any illogical means possible.
• It is pretty obvious that they are all much smarter than you are.
• Did you some here simply to demonstrate how much smarter you were then stupid theist with their “crazy” beliefs in “invisible gods”? Did you come here just so you could pat guys like TP and De-bungler on the back about how much more “superior” you are with your magic “free will” powers, and no consequences for your actions?
• Don’t lie and say you don’t have this information Mussy. You simply choose to ignore it because you are insane – you Fear God and the idea of Fate.

(and that was just in one post, folks! Impressive!)

That isn't even counting the misrepresentation, lies or dodges in the last post! Quite the debate!

So, if you'd like to have a discussion or debate, no problem. Once again, just let me know.

-Ed

 

[Franko]

Actually, Fran, I wanted to discuss fatalism - but as a starting point I wanted you to ditch the whole "prove free-willy" line, since I have clearly stated that I don't believe in it.

Actually, Wussy, I wanted to have a back and fourth discussion on equal footing without your typical double standards. A discussion in which you explain what you believe, and why you believe it, and then I explain what I believe, and we debate which way makes more sense. But as a starting point I wanted you to ditch the whole A-Theist Double Standard of assuming that everything you believe is TRUE, and everything that I believe is FALSE.

That isn’t debate or discussion Wussy. That is you pretending that Solipsism is True. But unfortunately we both know you aren’t pretending and Solipsism is True.

But you, Fran, are unwilling to even admit that some people might know their own personal beliefs better than you.

You claimed that you didn’t believe in “free will” I wanted to see if you meant it since you have lied to me so many times in the past. As usual for our discussion you are off to lying again right from the beginning. This is why conversation with your kind is nearly impossible. Until you are willing to honestly and fairly discuss what you believe, not much can be accomplished by conversing with you other than continually pointing out how you are no different than any other brainwashed Religious fanatic who is unable to logically prove the absurd nonsense he believes.

If you are going to approach the whole thing as yet another, "I know what you believe better than you do" thing - then I won't waste my time.

If you are unwilling to answer any questions regarding your beliefs then you never really wanted to have a conversation in the first place. Your whole reason for being in this forum has NOTHING to do with Skepticism, and everything to do with you trying to feel better about yourself and your miserable existence by badmouthing Christians, and talking about how much superior you are to “Religious people”. That isn’t Skepticism Wussy, that is called bigotry. If you are superior to anyone it is only because you were blessed by the divine luck of TLOP and the Initial State.

I wrongly assumed you might know something about fatalism - silly me.

Even if I could do your thinking for you, I never would on that topic in particular.

So, if you'd like to have a discussion or debate, no problem. Once again, just let me know.

And anytime you want to finish explaining how it is not logically inconsistent for you to claim that Your CAR is more conscious then YOU are … let me know …

TLOP controls/makes YOU controls/makes CAR

 

[Mossy]

Seven outright lies, and three blatant misrepresentations in that one post, Fran, nicely done!

-Ed

 

[MRC_Hans]

Nice Darwin Fish, Mossy. Is it your own?

Hans

 

[Mossy]

Nice Darwin Fish, Mossy. Is it your own?

Hans

Yeah, it's pretty old now and my views have changed quite a bit - but I still dig it...

-Ed

 

[Loki]

Franko,

Your whole reason for being in this forum has NOTHING to do with Skepticism, and everything to do with you trying to feel better about yourself and your miserable existence by badmouthing Christians, and talking about how much superior you are to “Religious people”

Right M.O., but the wrong subject. The only poster I can recall who has openly admitted that he is here to "talk trash" to those who hold a differing opinion to himself is, well, you. Didn't you recently describe yourself as "the trashman", and declare that you "enjoy it" and are "good at it"?

Oh, and say "bye" to wraith for me

 

[MRC_Hans]

Frank:

And anytime you want to finish explaining how it is not logically inconsistent for you to claim that Your CAR is more conscious then YOU are … let me know …

TLOP controls/makes YOU controls/makes CAR

How come that every time this little line of yours is seriously refuted, you ignore it, yet you keep bringing it up in other threads?

Would you mind pointing out a post where somebody claimed that their car was more consious than them?

While you are at it, show me someplace where somebody claims the Earth is flat, like you are also fond of claiming.

Alternatively, stop making claims about what others believe. Instead address their arguments (and your own) in a sensible way, and you might yet end up a respected debater here.

Hans

 

[Franko]

That's not and explaination MRC!

Explain how you can be logically consistent and claim that you are more conscious then BOTH your CAR and TLOP at the same time?

The fact that YOU can MAKE and CONTROL a CAR makes you a superior consciousness to a CAR.

The fact that TLOP can MAKE and CONTROL YOU makes TLOP a superior consciousness to a YOU.

It's that simple A-Theist.

Although I can't wait for you to tell us it is not ...

 

[Franko]

Loki,

Right M.O., but the wrong subject. The only poster I can recall who has openly admitted that he is here to "talk trash" to those who hold a differing opinion to himself is, well, you. Didn't you recently describe yourself as "the trashman", and declare that you "enjoy it" and are "good at it"?

Ohhh, I am learning all kinds of new things here my friend. Besides, unlike your pathetic little A-Theist buddies, I actually am a Skeptic, and not simply a religious fanatic.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Explain how you can be logically consistent and claim that you are more conscious then BOTH your CAR and TLOP at the same time?

The fact that YOU can MAKE and CONTROL a CAR makes you a superior consciousness to a CAR.

The fact that TLOP can MAKE and CONTROL YOU makes TLOP a superior consciousness to a YOU.

It's that simple A-Theist.

The fact is that I have explained it several times and you have ignored it.

If you want to address my explanation you are welcome to find it and do so.

It's that simple, Frank.

Hans

 

[Franko]

Franko:
Explain how you can be logically consistent and claim that you are more conscious then BOTH your CAR and TLOP at the same time?

The fact that YOU can MAKE and CONTROL a CAR makes you a superior consciousness to a CAR.

The fact that TLOP can MAKE and CONTROL YOU makes TLOP a superior consciousness to a YOU.

It's that simple A-Theist.

MRC_Hans:
The fact is that I have explained it several times and you have ignored it.

If you want to address my explanation you are welcome to find it and do so.

It's that simple, Frank.

Hans

Ohh come-come now my little A-Theist chum, just who are we kidding? You are the fulfillment of my prophecy – A-Theists are masters of talking without actually telling you anything.

Where is this wondrous logically valid explanation of yours??? I would think that if you had done it, the Fool, and Trixy, and CWL, and the rest of the loonie tunes would have something more to gossip about then what my Spring wardrobe will look like.

Come on Hanna!! You can do it!

TLOP makes/controls YOU makes/controls CAR

How can you rationalize your claim that there is no evidence for “god” … and – at the same time – explain how YOU can possibly be more conscious (superior too, more complex than) both TLOP and CAR at the same time? What you are asserting is obviously flawed and logically inconsistent. 90%+ of the world’s population can perceive it … why can’t you?

 

[Upchurch]

You are the fulfillment of my prophecy – A-Theists are masters of talking without actually telling you anything.

Not really so much a prophecy as a claim. A prophecy would be more along the lines of, A-theists will talk without actually telling you anything. It also has the advantage of being subjective enough as to be open to interpretation.

Upchurch

 

[ImpyTimpy]

Interesting train of thought

As deluded as Franko is, he does pose an interesting philosophical question. Is the Universe just a giant body of conciousness? Sort of a question of, are we just parts of a larger concious system, just like our cells are a part of us?

 

[The Fool]

Where is this wondrous logically valid explanation of yours??? I would think that if you had done it, the Fool, and Trixy, and CWL, and the rest of the loonie tunes would have something more to gossip about then what my Spring wardrobe will look like.

Well now that you mention it ........come up with the final position on free will yet, does it include some explanation of all the statements you made that may contradict the final version of your cult dogma on free will?

Ignoring and/or attempting to belittle the inconsistency will not make it go away....come on franko, you can do it. The goddess needs your support, don't go to water in the face of one simple question...

"I do have free will or choice of what I will wear"

does free will mean free will in this quote or does free will mean something that is not free will that you still call free will......make sense??

 

[MRC_Hans]

Ohh come-come now my little A-Theist chum, just who are we kidding? You are the fulfillment of my prophecy – A-Theists are masters of talking without actually telling you anything.

Where is this wondrous logically valid explanation of yours??? I would think that if you had done it, the Fool, and Trixy, and CWL, and the rest of the loonie tunes would have something more to gossip about then what my Spring wardrobe will look like.

Come on Hanna!! You can do it!

TLOP makes/controls YOU makes/controls CAR

How can you rationalize your claim that there is no evidence for “god” … and – at the same time – explain how YOU can possibly be more conscious (superior too, more complex than) both TLOP and CAR at the same time? What you are asserting is obviously flawed and logically inconsistent. 90%+ of the world’s population can perceive it … why can’t you?

Your lapse into insult mode indicates that you are cornered. I really dont see why it should be my problem that you are too lazy (or scared?) to look back into the earlier posts on this subject, but what the hell:

You can start by answering this question:

If your assumption of hierachy:

TLOP > Driver > Car

is correct, how come TLOP cannot drive my car without me?

And, please present evidence that 90%+ of the world population believes that the laws of physics is a conscious entity.

Hans

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by Franko
You are the fulfillment of my prophecy – A-Theists are masters of talking without actually telling you anything.

What a delightful gem..pot calling kettle spring to mind reading that.

 

[Guest]

TLOP > Driver > Car

is correct, how come TLOP cannot drive my car without me?

Technically the car can drive without you.. you actually only turn the car to enable it to drive, you mearly steer the car, accelerate its speed, brake to stop it.
The car itself does drive providing it has fuel and battery requirement to start the engine, if you leave it in gear it will run off on its own

 

[MRC_Hans]

Flower:
Heheh, still, the result is usually messy whenever tlop "decides" to take a drive.

Hans

 

[Franko]

radiating-un-flower:

Technically the car can drive without you.. you actually only turn the car to enable it to drive, you mearly steer the car, accelerate its speed, brake to stop it.

So you are claiming that CARs are equal or superior in consciousness to a HUMAN then?

The car itself does drive providing it has fuel and battery requirement to start the engine, if you leave it in gear it will run off on its own

So you are claiming that CARs are equal or superior in consciousness to a HUMAN then?

Because unless you want to pretend that Your CAR (or TOAST) is superior to YOU, then you can’t pretend that there is no evidence for “God” and claim to be “logically consistent” at the same time.

Of course how “logically consistent” is someone who claims that their CAR is superior in consciousness to them?

When you drive your Car radiating-A-Theist, do YOU control the CAR, or does the CAR control YOU?

 

[Franko]

As deluded as Franko is, he does pose an interesting philosophical question. Is the Universe just a giant body of conciousness? Sort of a question of, are we just parts of a larger concious system, just like our cells are a part of us?

So I am delusional for bringing up an interesting question A-Theist fanatic?

I wonder who is really delusional in reality???