Project 2025

Project 2025 would ban abortion pills nationally . It would also build the federal apparatus to track and monitor all pregnant women throughout the United States. Those who obtained or attempted to obtain abortions would be imprisoned.
 
zorro99 said:
Project 2025 would ban abortion pills nationally . It would also build the federal apparatus to track and monitor all pregnant women throughout the United States. Those who obtained or attempted to obtain abortions would be imprisoned.
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But if it does not contain the exact words "ban abortions," the conservative apologists will never acknowledge that banning abortions has any part in the mere fact that the result is the banning of abortions.
 
Norman Alexander said:
Trump lies about everything, even if he doesn't have to. So the reality will be diametrically opposite to whatever he says.

On that basis, Trump "distancing" himself from Project 2025 is obviously another pile of bovine excrement from the same source.

He's into it, 110%, no worries.
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Of course he is.
Imho the mistake they made with 2025 is going public with it; should have been done in secret.And it could have been done more subtly;It could have been done, though more slowly through the normal replacement of
political appontess" that happens every time the White House changes hands.
 
zorro99 said:
Project 2025 would ban abortion pills nationally . It would also build the federal apparatus to track and monitor all pregnant women throughout the United States. Those who obtained or attempted to obtain abortions would be imprisoned.
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It is a monstrous idea but I have myh doubts about hoe well ti would work....remember prohibition.
If you have widespread public oppostion to a law, it is hard to enforce.During Prohibition you had an awful lot of
Jury Nullification.
 
dudalb said:
Trump does not give a damn about abortion.
He will do whatever he thinks is to his best political advantage.
That is what amazes me about the evanglicals, they worship a guy who ould sell them out in a minute if they though it would benefit him politically.
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You are amazed that people who choose to believe silly, irrational things against their own best interests...believe silly, irrational things against their own best interests?
 
bruto said:
But if it does not contain the exact words "ban abortions," the conservative apologists will never acknowledge that banning abortions has any part in the mere fact that the result is the banning of abortions.
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Yes, it's like "bribe" vs. "gratuity" or "official acts" vs. "anything Trump does is legal."
We all know what they really mean, and so do they, but they'll hang on to their nonsense rhetoric and lies.
 
zorro99 said:
Project 2025 would ban abortion pills nationally . It would also build the federal apparatus to track and monitor all pregnant women throughout the United States. Those who obtained or attempted to obtain abortions would be imprisoned.
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Link?
Quote?
Page number?
Chapter?

Anything other than Prison Planet-esque proclamations?
 
Segnosaur said:
What an idiotic argument. Why would anyone trust Trump and the republicans over abortion rights?
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Because it has nothing to do with trust. It's entirely an evaluation of what his interests are. He doesn't have a motive to pursue a national abortion ban. If he told his supporters he would try to get one passed, they shouldn't trust him to actually do it, because it's not in his interest to try.
 
dudalb said:
Trump does not give a damn about abortion.
He will do whatever he thinks is to his best political advantage.
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EXACTLY!

That is what amazes me about the evanglicals, they worship a guy who ould sell them out in a minute if they though it would benefit him politically.
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He already gave them everything he's going to give them on abortion. Which is quite a lot, from their perspective, but they aren't getting more. If you're an anti-abortion voter, then voting for Trump just on what he already did still makes sense. But that's precisely why he's not going to go further. He doesn't need to in order to get their support.
 
zorro99 said:
Project 2025 would ban abortion pills nationally . It would also build the federal apparatus to track and monitor all pregnant women throughout the United States. Those who obtained or attempted to obtain abortions would be imprisoned.
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Even if they went on a month's holiday to Mexico or Canada?
 
Ziggurat said:
Because it has nothing to do with trust. It's entirely an evaluation of what his interests are. He doesn't have a motive to pursue a national abortion ban. If he told his supporters he would try to get one passed, they shouldn't trust him to actually do it, because it's not in his interest to try.
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The assurances from Trump voters about what Trump will and won't do continue to ring hollow, particularly when they have a questionable record.

Trump didn't have any more a less of an interest in facilitating the overturning of Roe v Wade, and he gleefully did that. Trump is an empty vessel; a moral, ethical, and intellectual vacuum. He does whatever he wants to do in any given moment, despite denying he would do it only a moment before.

What is undeniable is that the extremist movement he leads absolutely wants a federal abortion ban and they would only back away from that position because they know it's unpopular and they want to get their guy elected. Once they have him in office, they will actively start pushing that agenda again.
 
johnny karate said:
Trump didn't have any more a less of an interest in facilitating the overturning of Roe v Wade, and he gleefully did that.
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Well, no. He had a very big interest in nominating conservative justices. That was a large part of his appeal. And he delivered. But he can't push abortion restrictions any further by that pathway, anything more would require federal legislation. Pushing it through congress is both unnecessary (he's already got a lock on the abortion opponent votes because of his judicial nominations) and much harder to do. So he's not going to do it. Too much work, not enough gain, possible considerable loss. And even in the unlikely case he did win a ban in Congress, unlike with the courts, it can easily be overturned by that same Congress. And likely would.

What is undeniable is that the extremist movement he leads absolutely wants a federal abortion ban
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Uh, no. A small group of people want a federal abortion ban, and they have rallied behind Trump. But they are a minority of Trump supporters. Most Trump supporters don't really care about abortion that much.

And keep in mind, Trump cannot ever run again, so he won't really care about pressure from a fringe group. But he WILL care about Congressional elections, since that will determine what he can do in the second half of his term. So he needs to rally support for Congressional elections, and we already saw that pushing abortion restrictions isn't good for Republicans in Congress.

A federal ban is a losing issue for him. He's not going to pursue it.
 
Ziggurat said:
Uh, no. A small group of people want a federal abortion ban, and they have rallied behind Trump. But they are a minority of Trump supporters. Most Trump supporters don't really care about abortion that much.
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I'm convinced you don't have an accurate mental map of Trump's support base.
 
Newt Gingrich came up with his 10 point "Contract with America". The opposition got some purchase calling it the "Contract on America". None of the points actually got implemented, in spite of the victory and political hot air, go figure.

Some of these 2025 points seem so ludicrous it casts doubt on the legitimacy of the list. If one wants to presume scurrilous, secret behavior, why assume one way and not the other?


Are you the kind of person the list was supposedly designed to entice? Or was the list designed to outrage you?
 
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Ziggurat said:
Well, no. He had a very big interest in nominating conservative justices. That was a large part of his appeal. And he delivered. But he can't push abortion restrictions any further by that pathway, anything more would require federal legislation. Pushing it through congress is both unnecessary (he's already got a lock on the abortion opponent votes because of his judicial nominations) and much harder to do. So he's not going to do it. Too much work, not enough gain, possible considerable loss. And even in the unlikely case he did win a ban in Congress, unlike with the courts, it can easily be overturned by that same Congress. And likely would.

Uh, no. A small group of people want a federal abortion ban, and they have rallied behind Trump. But they are a minority of Trump supporters. Most Trump supporters don't really care about abortion that much.

And keep in mind, Trump cannot ever run again, so he won't really care about pressure from a fringe group. But he WILL care about Congressional elections, since that will determine what he can do in the second half of his term. So he needs to rally support for Congressional elections, and we already saw that pushing abortion restrictions isn't good for Republicans in Congress.

A federal ban is a losing issue for him. He's not going to pursue it.
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You also said Trump wouldn't be stupid enough to attempt a coup. He ended up attempting a coup. You clearly have no real sense of what Trump will or won't do, and are either lying to yourself or everyone else.

And the idea that Republicans don't want a federal abortion ban is ludicrous. The majority of Republicans support making abortion illegal in all or most cases and House Republicans proposed a budget just a few months ago that endorsed a federal abortion ban. But you want us to believe that the constituents that they represent don't want the thing that they proposed.

And again - and I can't stress this enough - the assurances given by Trump voters about all the ways Trump would be stopped even if he wanted to do the terrible things they insist he won't do only apply if we accept Trump as a normal politician and not what he is: A 34-time convicted felon, sexual abuser, and fraudster who aimed a violent mob at the Capitol because he lost an election and clearly has no compunction about upending norms and breaking laws.
 
Checkmite said:
I'm convinced you don't have an accurate mental map of Trump's support base.
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If you want to work yourself into a state of panic about Trump and his supporters, go ahead. But it's unnecessary, it won't help you, it'll just make you feel bad.

I can't help you any more than that.
 
Beerina said:
Newt Gingrich came up with his 10 point "Contract with America". The opposition got some purchase calling it the "Contract on America". None of the points actually got implemented, in spite of the victory and political hot air, go figure.

Some of these 2025 points seem so ludicrous it casts doubt on the legitimacy of the list. If one wants to presume scurrilous, secret behavior, why assume one way and not the other?


Are you the kind of person the list was supposedly designed to entice? Or was the list designed to outrage you?
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Believing people when they explicitly tell you the things they want to do seems like a more straightforward approach.
 
And one other thing, for better or worse, the Republicans have been making hay the past few years with "The 1619 Project". Why in god's name would they deliberately duplicate the form of that name, knowing how readily it lends itself in current parlance to derrogation?

If so, sounds like they need to kick their ad agency to the curb.
 
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