Split Thread Philosophical musings about trans rights

[Paul2]

You didn't refute it. You asserted it was false.

That's not my memory; It doesn't sound like me to assert that something like that was false, rather I think I would have just questioned whether you could make and support the claim.

However, I can't be arsed to look it up to confirm it one way or the other, but I'm happy to be shown incorrect.

The conversation then went down two paths. One was the assertion that there was no way to tell whether the various social changes since the 60s had improved anybody's life satisfaction.

On further reflection, perhaps the critique (not refutation) was based on the problems with trying to separate out the cause of lesser women's happiness, which was implied to be liberalism if not explicitly stated.

 

[Paul2]

I am saying that you can't prove morality, and your moral intuitions are profoundly unconvincing to anybody who does not share them. Your confidence in them resolves nothing.

All morality is not intuitive. The immortality of chopping someone's head off in the absence of extenuating circumstances is clear and obvious and has nothing to do with an intuition.

 

[Cat Not Included]

So if I'm understanding here correctly:


* Population decline is a major problem in the US, despite the population growing by millions per year.

* Somehow, despite being approximately .4% (yes, that is .4%, not 4%) of the population, transgender/non-binary individuals have...something to do with lack of population. (Estimated 1.6 million transgender or non-binary out of a population of 331.9 million)

* (Even though transgender/non-binary individuals are often still capable of having children).

* The solution to the population catastrophe (of...population increasing?) is "make life miserable for transgender/non-binary people". Which...will make them have children that they otherwise wouldn't have?

If we're going to increase our population by making life miserable for certain people, why not target, say, people who've contributed to the spread of covid, which as killed more people in the US than the estimated number of existing transgender/non-binary people? How about making life miserable for people who don't pay employees enough or offer good enough health benefits to afford children? That would probably get a bigger impact.

Also, if "being fine with transgender/non-binary people" leads to societal collapse, what's the collapse going on in some of the countries that are top rated for LGBT/trans/non-binary friendliness? Denmark, Iceland, Canada, Belgium...what major societal collapses are they facing?

Meanwhile, things are going just swimmingly for the extremely hostile to LGBT/tras countries like Nigeria, Iran, Russia...oh wait, no they aren't. Russia is actually in the middle of a societal collapse. Nigeria and Iran are ranked among the worst places in the world to live.

 

[Leumas]

So if I'm understanding here correctly:


* Population decline is a major problem in the US, despite the population growing by millions per year.

* Somehow, despite being approximately .4% (yes, that is .4%, not 4%) of the population, transgender/non-binary individuals have...something to do with lack of population. (Estimated 1.6 million transgender or non-binary out of a population of 331.9 million)

* (Even though transgender/non-binary individuals are often still capable of having children).

* The solution to the population catastrophe (of...population increasing?) is "make life miserable for transgender/non-binary people". Which...will make them have children that they otherwise wouldn't have?

If we're going to increase our population by making life miserable for certain people, why not target, say, people who've contributed to the spread of covid, which as killed more people in the US than the estimated number of existing transgender/non-binary people? How about making life miserable for people who don't pay employees enough or offer good enough health benefits to afford children? That would probably get a bigger impact.

Also, if "being fine with transgender/non-binary people" leads to societal collapse, what's the collapse going on in some of the countries that are top rated for LGBT/trans/non-binary friendliness? Denmark, Iceland, Canada, Belgium...what major societal collapses are they facing?

Meanwhile, things are going just swimmingly for the extremely hostile to LGBT/tras countries like Nigeria, Iran, Russia...oh wait, no they aren't. Russia is actually in the middle of a societal collapse. Nigeria and Iran are ranked among the worst places in the world to live.

 

[Thor 2]

I wonder, if the need to identify a person as being positively of one gender or another, my be perceived as being less necessary in the future in our society.

I lived in Thailand for almost 7 years. I mean the real Thailand, in country areas well to the north - not those tourist places in the south. I lived within Thai families so got to know attitudes fairly well.

Sexual diversity and gender didn't seem to be issues, that bothered the average Thai. Many, many times, I encountered people I could not specify the gender off, and homosexuals, of both sexes, where open and obvious, everywhere.

The experience was quite refreshing.