Going Down

[apathoid]

One your using my statement to Gravy to apply to all videos. That is a no-no.

The one I posted is from Gravy's video. To which you replied:

"Great video! You just proved that fly-by's at air shows are near take off and landing speeds not at 530 mphs"

Apparently you think that this airplane, which is quite clearly hauling ass, is going less than 200 mph. I can't see how anyone who actually watched the flyby could make such a claim. It's one of the silliest statements I've ever seen on this forum.

Sorry, I don't get Youtube at my NWO office. If the video doesn't display the speed of the plane, I won't bother watching it.

It doesn't. Are you saying you cannot discern fast from slow? No problem, the airplane also does a slow speed pass in the same clip.

Two, does the video show the pilot correcting for ground effect or not? If he is correcting for ground effect, then that is a sign of an experienced pilot, while ground effect for an amateur pilot is very hazardous.

Show the pilot correct for ground effect......? Dude, the video is taken from outside. It's an airshow. How am I supposed to know if the pilot is nudging the column forward a bit.

Why yes I have, thank you.

Well.....were you able to do a simple turn?

 

[beachnut]

Burner, did you say burner?

http://www.defence.gov.au/aerospacecentre/videos/afterburner1.mpg
http://www.defence.gov.au/aerospacecentre/videos/afterburner1.mpg
http://www.defence.gov.au/aerospacecentre/videos/mtmitchell1.mpg
http://www.defence.gov.au/aerospacecentre/videos/mtmitchell.mpg
http://www.defence.gov.au/aerospacecentre/videos/air9.mpg
http://www.defence.gov.au/redflag/video/F-111.mpg

but those are the only afterburners I had... poor tanker toad

 

[Swing Dangler]

The Texas Sharpshooter is alive and well. What measures are you suggesting Hani took to determine the occupancy of the building before hitting it?

Hmm a major attack that took years to plan which I would . You tell me. Or are you suggesting the incompetent terrorist theory? Nevermind, you are.

firstly, the attack was aimed at intimidation rather than necessarily inflicting maximum loss of life

Can you source any reference by the terrorists for the motivation of attacking the Pentagon and its location?

Hanjour approached the Pentagon too high, made a diving turn to lose height, then aimed straight at the Pentagon from the point where he happened to find himself at the end of the turn. He very nearly screwed it up by hitting some things on the way in, but he got lucky and made it all the way.

And the logical contortions you're going through to imply that only a really good pilot would choose a route that involved hitting a bunch of avoidable obstacles are as good a disproof of whatever it is you're trying to suggest as any counter-argument I could ever come up with.

Dave the the contention by me was that he aimed at that portion of the Pentagon you are arguing that he didn't that it was simply a mistake.
My other contention is that as a terrorist who had years of planning, he would have hit the most populated largest part of the building via the easiest route to ensure the greatest success. You disagree in that he made a big mistake and chose to hit the smallest part of the building with the greatest chance for error and failure along a difficult route.

Dave, watch the flight path. He had a straight shot to the Pentagon with the ability to descend into the building head on with the least amount of error and with the greatest amount of speed with the potential to cause more human harm and destruction to the building than that which occurred.

And will you be debunking your buddy, Beachnut about the experience of the pilot? So far I've read here is was not experienced, then I have someone else spouting he is experienced. Why the confusion when defending the OS?

 

[Dave Rogers]

I'm not saying that he aimed at a specific part of the Pentagon. I'm saying that he aimed at the Pentagon, and given that he wan't much of a pilot he was happy to hit it just about anywhere. And anyway, he did hit the populated part of the building, and he hit it almost square in the middle of a wall. I have no idea what you mean by "the smallest part of the building", and I suspect neither do you.

As for the years of planning, the idea that part of the plan was to hit the most populated part of the building is purely your own invention and is of no relevance to Hanjour's intentions.

Dave

 

[DGM]

Hmm a major attack that took years to plan which I would . You tell me. Or are you suggesting the incompetent terrorist theory? Never mind, you are.

Swing:
This is why he convinced everyone he was a lousy pilot. You know flunking the landings in front of instructors. That way you would try to convince everyone he didn't do it. Get you guy's to talk "inside job". Hanni was indeed brilliant wasn't he?

 

[Swing Dangler]

I'm not saying that he aimed at a specific part of the Pentagon. I'm saying that he aimed at the Pentagon, and given that he wan't much of a pilot he was happy to hit it just about anywhere. And anyway, he did hit the populated part of the building, and he hit it almost square in the middle of a wall. I have no idea what you mean by "the smallest part of the building", and I suspect neither do you.

As for the years of planning, the idea that part of the plan was to hit the most populated part of the building is purely your own invention and is of no relevance to Hanjour's intentions.

Dave

1. Now wait just a second, I just read a post on this same thread that he was a competent pilot because he had the FAA certificate. Now which is it?

The smallest part of the building to me would be at ground level, 1st floor, instead of say the expanse of a roof line or the top 3 floors, etc.

2. Now tell me again was he a competent pilot or an incompetent pilot?

3. Can you provide the source material from the terrorists that you referenced? Or can you source Hani's intentions as you seem to think you know what they were? Thanks!

 

[beachnut]

Would Hani want to hit a part of the Pentagon that is greatly populated or one with very few people in it to cause the greatest loss of life? I would say the greatly populated area.

Would Hani want to do everything possible to complete a successful mission or aim his plane at an area that has a great measure of potential failure associated with it? And yet for some reason he took the greatest route for failure.

But instead Hani hits perhaps the most difficult part of the building along a difficulut flight path to hit a portion of the builiding with very few people. Not only that, he adjusts the flight pattern to do so.
This leads the reasonable person to believe the was aiming for that particular target. Texas Sharpshooter has now left the building.
What other explanation is there? Coincidence?

Where did he hold this certificate? Where was it located? What is your source? Has it been produced and verified by the examiner? Please tell me it wasn't at the flight school in Florida?
My grandfather was a FAA Flight Examiner so I have a little bit of knowledge on this subject.
Does that mean if I hold a Japanese Ninja Certificate it makes me a certified Ninja?

See the above quote. So does that mean you let them take the controls without input from yourself and they executed a simple term?

Hani was a commercial pilot, it is a series of requirements to be a commercial pilot. The pilots who fly you around have ATPs, at least the Captain does, but all pilots get them who want to fly for the Airliners. You spew crap about flying. The commercial license is earned after so many hours, tests, and check rides. A commercial pilot can be a new pilot, not experienced. To do the flying on 9/11 you did not need training; I put kids who never flew in a simulator and they hit the WTC, first time, no previous flying ever. Why are you so research deficient?

Swing wonders why Hani found the Pentagon. OH MY. Hani knew how to use the VOR; all pilots do. He tuned in DCA, and it points straight to DC. All he had to do was point the plane to this arrow and follow it; THE VOR he pointed to was only 1 mile from the PENTAGON; the FDR shows DCA was tuned in, the last distance from DCA, the DME that goes with DCA was 1.5 nm; Think Hani can see the Pentagon from 1 mile. Can you see a 1700 foot building from a mile Swing?

Hani hit the Pentagon; I could take most kids and they could hit the Pentagon. The only idiots on the whole earth who say someone can't hit the Pentagon are the P4t, they can't hit the Pentagon; They are not as good as terrorist pilots, who did it.

Looks like you failed to gain knowledge on flying from anyone!!

Would you agree that most pilots after take off turn the auto pilot on leading to the straight path you claim?

What the junk is this!?

Second, he couldn't find the White House but at altitude and several hundred miles away he can find the Pentagon?

They use a VOR, it points to about a mile from the Pentagon! Are you even trying?

Anyone could flown like he did without training? ********. You are complete ball of contradictions. The pilots lacked the experience to do even simple turns but perform one beautifully over the Pentagon area. Facts? You just make **** up don't you and state them as fact?

No, you lack the ability to understand what is said. Hani was not a great pilot, would you be real smooth after killing two pilots? Yes, anyone with any ability to walk and talk, can fly as good as or better than the terrorist on 9/11. You may have a problem, but then your post is not as good as Hani's flying.

No precision? How can you reconcile this with the flight path of 77 and the debris left behind by this lack of precision? Considering birds can punch holes through wings, this guy had great precision to run through light poles and keep the plane level enough and off the deck to hit the bottom floor after clipping a fence and trailer as well.

He never knew he hit light posts, you can't see the light posts at 500 mph; he was looking at the Pentagon and was aiming 20 feet too low because he flew little planes, in the jet, he is sitting 20 feet higher, he did not compensate so he almost hit the ground. Hani was only looking at the Pentagon, he was lucky not to hit the ground. What did you miss? Hani should have aimed for the top floor, the plane would have hit and cut deeper into the building; maybe, you have to ask a building engineer and architects. Hitting a 1700 foot wide building is not precision, it is CRAP just like your post and your pathetic understanding of 9/11.

Why do you think this amateur pilot decided to take the most difficult route (low altitude through light poles, fences, and trailers) to his target against a newly renovated part of the building instead of slamming it into the roof area?

You are so full of crap with this statement. You have zero flying knowledge. Come back in 10 years.

So simulators are now harder to fly than the real thing?

Yes, the simulator is not as easy to fly as the plane. I think some pilots may find the simulator easier to fly but after thousands of hours in the sim and the aircraft; This Air Force Instructor pilot, and ATP holder, says, the simulator is harder to fly than the airplane. I must have something for real stuff, real fires, real wind and real ground. Why would a simulator be any good if it was easier to fly? This is an opinion based on facts; the fact being I am an instructor and an evaluator in the Air Force. I give checks in the sim and in the aircraft. But I think it is funny you have zero knowledge and don't have a clue!

ROFLMAO. That is one of the most comical statements I've ever heard. I would have thought the fear of death in the real thing might be a little more difficult to deal with along with the mechanical unknowns, atmospheric conditions, and the other planes in the air.

So tell me how many hours you have in a simulator? A four engine or two engine simulator, full scale cockpit of a 300,000 pound aircraft? Go ahead make me lol.

On a scale of 1 to 10 your post earned.... 0

So you do not understand how a pilot can be not good, but hit a building. LOL....................

 

[beachnut]

1. Now wait just a second, I just read a post on this same thread that he was a competent pilot because he had the FAA certificate. Now which is it?

You are posting; and Hani was flying! Questions?

The smallest part of the building to me would be at ground level, 1st floor, instead of say the expanse of a roof line or the top 3 floors, etc.

What? The smallest part of the Pentagon is the Pentagon. What is is this smallest part stuff? LOL, you are not having a good day.

2. Now tell me again was he a competent pilot or an incompetent pilot?

Hani was better at flying than you are at understanding 9/11 and flying. Not a very good question slick. Hani hit a 1700 foot wide target, but he always got close to a 50 to 150 foot target hundreds of times in aircraft. Come with facts or go learn.

3. Can you provide the source material from the terrorists that you referenced? Or can you source Hani's intentions as you seem to think you know what they were? Thanks!

Crap question again; Please find some of this and then come and talk; are you tried of JAQ. lol

You are a cherry picking zero comprehension guy. I said Hani did not fly as good a the pilots you are use to flying with on like United, American, or Delta. Does not mean Hani could not fly; I said his turn sucked from a pure flying technical point. You failed to comprehend; you failed! Failure as you continue to mess up flying stuff. And you had a chance to learn this stuff but blew it!

It comes down to this is my expert observations, but I have to admit the real guy who said Hani would have no problem hitting the Pentagon flew with him! An instructor pilot. So you ignore facts and evidence then argue with pilots about flying. You have failed from a position of ignorance and lack of comprehension. You do not ask question for understanding.

 

[beachnut]

And will you be debunking your buddy, Beachnut about the experience of the pilot? So far I've read here is was not experienced, then I have someone else spouting he is experienced. Why the confusion when defending the OS?

Funny stuff. I agree with most the posts. You are the only one here who can not comprehend what people are saying.

Experience is relative. His turns sucked but like you as a driver or a back seat driver. Hani's flying was like your posts. He hit the Pentagon, hitting buildings is not an example of good flying; just like your posts are not good examples of comprehending what we have told you. You are messing up and looking very bad for understanding stuff.

Relative to many of the pilots posing at JREF, Hani was not experience. But as I have told you over and over. Any kid could hit the building in jets they never flew before as on 9/11. Pay attention an even you could learn.

So the bottom line is, Hani was good enough to hit the Pentagon. I agree with most the post except yours and other truthers.

If you have specific problems that are well thought out try asking a real question. But so far you are making up bs about nothing very substantial.

 

[Swing Dangler]

Originally Posted by beachnut View Post
As you can see, the expert pilots fly very straight. The flight of 77 was crap. He varied the bank and pitch in a non pilot way. But a non pilot idiot could fly and hit buildings as done on 9/11 with ZERO training. You should research this, many people have put in new pilots in the exact simulators, which are harder to fly than the real plane, and hit buildings the first time.

Beachnut, was he experienced or not? Here you state the flight was crap and flew in a non pilot way.

The flying you saw on 9/11 was not the best, it was inexperience pilot at best. You do not understand a bad flight, bad flying looks okay from the ground, but sucks if you are in the plane. These pilots lacked the experience to do even simple turns like you are use to.

Beachnut, was he expereinced or not? Here you state he was inexperienced?

In my 34 years of flying I know anyone could fly the way the terrorist did, and without prior flight training. I have trained new pilots in 300,000 pound aircraft. You are not correct, there was no precision at all you have failed to do research; you have failed to get the minimum knowledge on flying. Total failure.

Beachnut, here you imply the terrorists flew like someone without training. Was Hani an experienced licensed pilot or not?

Considering your a flight instructor with training and the likes on Sims, why can't I determine your stance on Hani?

Now lets examine what you just spouted:

Hani was a commercial pilot, it is a series of requirements to be a commercial pilot. The pilots who fly you around have ATPs, at least the Captain does, but all pilots get them who want to fly for the Airliners. You spew crap about flying. The commercial license is earned after so many hours, tests, and check rides. A commercial pilot can be a new pilot, not experienced. To do the flying on 9/11 you did not need training; I put kids who never flew in a simulator and they hit the WTC, first time, no previous flying ever. Why are you so research deficient?

Now clear it up once and for all. Was Hani an experienced licensed pilot that could make simple turns or was he an inexperienced pilot? And can your analysis correspond with the flight school instructor testimony? Or did Hani actually complete the training to get an FAA commercial licenses as someone else posted.

With these multiple contradictions I have a hard time believing you trained anyone and if you did it probably wasn't very good training because it appears you do not know the difference.

Hani hit the Pentagon; I could take most kids and they could hit the Pentagon.

Can they hit the Pentagon under the conditions and through the objects that Hani did to hit the first floor without clipping the ground? Go ahead and document the kids who can do this if you would.

This is an opinion based on facts; the fact being I am an instructor and an evaluator in the Air Force. I give checks in the sim and in the aircraft.

Can you source your expertise?

 

[Swing Dangler]

Yeah, I kinda winced at that too. My Grandpa worked in a shipyard for like 50 years and I don't know the first thing about boats, much less about assembling them. It's funny that swingie trusts his own gut feeling over the input from experienced pilots here.

Oh so you assumed I was dropping the title to impress not as a source of knowledge for my own instruction. Your fault. Did you not ask your grandfather to be instructed in boat construction? Sad.

I ask because the concept is exactly the same in an airplane. There is a wheel that rotates. Turning it either direction will start a turn in that direction.Apparently you think that this airplane, which is quite clearly hauling ass, is going less than 200 mph. I can't see how anyone who actually watched the flyby could make such a claim. It's one of the silliest statements I've ever seen on this forum.Well.....were you able to do a simple turn?

You left out the altitude part, the yaw, banking, etc, etc. Not quite the same.

What was the speed of the plane Apathoid? Do you have any clear indication other than a youtube video? Was it closer to 530 mph's or closer to take off and landing speeds?
As far as the turn no, I was unable to complete the turn because I didn't correct for the loss of altitude at the time, as a result the pilot took over. Being a teenager at the time, it was one of my first attempts.
I think he may have been a bit concerned as it was an old Vietnam era Grasshopper he had restored. It sit quite nicely next to his aerobatic stunt show biplane, now that does nice barrel rolls.

 

[Good Lt]

Do you have any clear indication other than a youtube video?

I'm going to bet that this is one of the most ironic statements ever posted by a Troofer here. Or anywhere.

 

[beachnut]

Oh so you assumed I was dropping the title to impress not as a source of knowledge for my own instruction. Your fault. Did you not ask your grandfather to be instructed in boat construction? Sad.

You left out the altitude part, the yaw, banking, etc, etc. Not quite the same.

What was the speed of the plane Apathoid? Do you have any clear indication other than a youtube video? Was it closer to 530 mph's or closer to take off and landing speeds?
As far as the turn no, I was unable to complete the turn because I didn't correct for the loss of altitude at the time, as a result the pilot took over. Being a teenager at the time, it was one of my first attempts.
I think he may have been a bit concerned as it was an old Vietnam era Grasshopper he had restored. It sit quite nicely next to his aerobatic stunt show biplane, now that does nice barrel rolls.

You can tell the planes are going fast because if they were near landing speed with no FLAPS, they would be about 6 or 7 degrees nose up. These planes are going high speed, you are not doing too good at this.

So you are the one who is challenged on flying and understanding 9/11. This is the problem, you can't fly or understand 9/11. You are twisting the posts of others. You are playing around like a kid who does not comprehend or listen to what is being said. Sorry if you can not handle the fact Hani hit the Pentagon at 463 KIAS, at about 5 degrees nose down. Never flying the super low level just above the GRASS stuff you and JDX make claim to. He flew the plane, and the plane was only below 50 feet above the impact point for ONE second. Not a long time below 50 feet, JUST a SECOND of low flying. ONE SECOND.

Most people could fly the jets into buildings. But this is a could. Do you understand could. When I put in two kids, both in their teens, into a simulator and they hit building the first time they ever flew; this does not mean you could hit a building or even fly for a minute without crashing. It is relative.

You are upset because Hani, just an average pilot who I said his turn was not smooth as it varied back and forth, can fly into buildings and pushed up the throttles 20 seconds before impact at the Pentagon.

Yes you found out flying little airplanes is harder than flying big airplanes. I could tell you this.

You can check my flying out at the FAA; I have an ATP.

Your posts on flying suck please ask better questions. You do not understand simple stuff about not being a smooth pilot, and not being able to fly. Why are you being so truthy?

 

[apathoid]

Oh so you assumed I was dropping the title to impress not as a source of knowledge for my own instruction. Your fault. Did you not ask your grandfather to be instructed in boat construction? Sad.

I'm sure I did, but it likely went in one ear and out the other. I'm an aviation guy, always was. Could care less about boats.

You left out the altitude part, the yaw, banking, etc, etc. Not quite the same.

So now AA77 was yawing and banking while hugging the ground? Do you actually like attacking strawman? There was no yaw and the bank was less than 5 degrees for the last 30 seconds of FDR data.

What was the speed of the plane Apathoid? Do you have any clear indication other than a youtube video? Was it closer to 530 mph's or closer to take off and landing speeds?

As someone who's been to more airshows than I can count, and who regularly watches airliners takeoff and land...I work at the worlds busiest airport.... I think I can safely say that the A310 is going much closer to 530 mph than 150-180.

The Icelandair 757 in Gravy's video was an example of one that likely was only doing a bit more than approach speed(220-250 mph) since the nose was pointed up a bit, the aircraft was not climbing, and the flaps and slats were completely retracted - meaning the plane has to fly a little faster to keep from stalling. It also didn't seem to cover ground anywhere near as fast as the TAP A310. Please review these two videos when you get home from work. It's clear as day that one is going much, much faster than the other. Hardly takeoff or landing speed, at any rate.

As far as the turn no, I was unable to complete the turn because I didn't correct for the loss of altitude at the time, as a result the pilot took over. Being a teenager at the time, it was one of my first attempts.

Okay, but you eventually did learn how to complete a simple turn, no?

 

[Gravy]

Our resident know-nothing apparently missed post 25 in this thread, which contained this video:

Google Video This video is not hosted by the ISF, the ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

 

[SDC]

Oh so you assumed I was dropping the title to impress not as a source of knowledge for my own instruction. Your fault. Did you not ask your grandfather to be instructed in boat construction? Sad.

Since I started that wisecrack I would like to say something. The phrasing of your statement said nothing, nichts, nichego, nic, about gaining any instruction. You simply referred to a grandfather, and then said that you therefore had a little knowledge.

In a rational conversation I would have assumed that some sort of training or instruction by the grandfather had, indeed, taken place. But what with your obstinate, silly, ostentatiously wooden-headed trolling, I could only assume you meant that since Grandpa had known Something, you too Knew Something, by some kind of biological transmission of information. (There were people who believed that, but I won't say who, because I don't want to get Godwinned.)

Sheesh. What silly comments you make. I feel like saying "Betelgeuse" three times just to see who will appear; might be more interesting.

 

[Corsair 115]

Second, he couldn't find the White House but at altitude and several hundred miles away he can find the Pentagon?

What are the relative sizes of the White House and Pentagon? Are they similar in size or is one of them much larger than the other? Do you think the size of a building might affect how easy it is to spot from the air? Have you ever tried to identify specific structures from the air?

The pilots lacked the experience to do even simple turns but perform one beautifully over the Pentagon area.

Performing a turn is remarkably easy — just bank the wings of the aircraft and it will turn. Why do you think a turn is hard? Do you have any flight experience at all?

Considering birds can punch holes through wings, this guy had great precision to run through light poles and keep the plane level enough and off the deck to hit the bottom floor after clipping a fence and trailer as well.

The jet was moving very quickly which means it had a lot of intertia. Which means it would require a lot of force to deflect it significantly from its path. Basic physics.

Why do you think this amateur pilot decided to take the most difficult route (low altitude through light poles, fences, and trailers) to his target against a newly renovated part of the building instead of slamming it into the roof area?

Because diving onto a target at a steep angle is a much more difficult procedure than hitting a target from a very shallow angle. Read up about the differences between dive bombing and glide bombing and the relative skill level required to peform each of those attack approaches.

You left out the altitude part, the yaw, banking, etc, etc. Not quite the same.

You're not referring here to Loose Change's statement about how the aircraft did a 330° turn and descended 7,000 feet in 2½ minutes are you? Because if you are, if you knew anything about flying you'd know how unimpressive that statement actually is.


The really sad thing about all this is that Swing could resolve for himself how easy or difficult it is to fly. He could enroll himself in a flight course and learn firsthand what it takes to fly. He could get himself some time in a real flight simulator and try some maneuvering to see whether it's easy or not to turn or descend a jetliner.

But instead he persists in remaining in the dark over what flying actually involves.

 

[ihaunter]

Beachnut, here you imply the terrorists flew like someone without training. Was Hani an experienced licensed pilot or not?

Considering your a flight instructor with training and the likes on Sims, why can't I determine your stance on Hani?

Probably because you seem to think that pilot experience is purely an either/or situation. Either he has pilot experience and was an ace pilot who would be 100% perfect in everything he does, or he had zero experience and would completely fail at everything. Neither of these actually describe Hani. He was a pilot, had some experience, but not enough to make him an expert flier. What he actually accomplished on 9/11 didn't require much skill to do. Even though he was successful, doesn't mean he did it particularly well.
That seems to be the primary source of your confusion, at least, to me. Try to avoid thinking in absolutes, it tends to create false dichotomies.

 

[jaydeehess]

7,000 feet in 2½ minutes

That equals 47 ft/sec
Hardly an impressive desent rate

I gotta love

1. Now wait just a second, I just read a post on this same thread that he was a competent pilot because he had the FAA certificate. Now which is it?

He flew well enough to perform the manouver seen. It was not a difficult manouver. Had the pilot been an ace he might have chosen to atempt a dive at the Pentagon which is what you believe he should have tried. This would most certainly take any ground effect off the table but instead introduce much more difficult control problems in pitch and roll. A completly incompetant pilot, such as yourself, also might attempt such a dive. such a person would then likely end up inverted, stalled and tumbling out of control but I suppose hitting Arlington Cemetary with a plane load of Americans would have been traumatic for the country as well.

The smallest part of the building to me would be at ground level, 1st floor, instead of say the expanse of a roof line or the top 3 floors, etc.

Probably one of the most idiotic things you have stated here SD. Is your intention to say that the roof represents a larger surface area than the vertical wall? If so then you again seem to be suggesting that a vertical dive at the building would be the way to go once again proving your incompetance to comment on such matters.

2. Now tell me again was he a competent pilot or an incompetent pilot?

As has been made very clear on so very many occassions that it is incomprehensible that you have not been able to grasp the notion, he was most certainly competatnt enough to perform the manouvers that are known to have been undertaken by the aircraft in question.
He did not have to perform a take off
he did not have to perform a landing
he did not have to set the cruise trim of the aircraft
he did not have to rely soley on instruments for navigation

All he had to do was get the aircraft within 20 miles of the Pentagon and look for the most distinctive shaped building in the entire county, a building surrounded by open spaces , not other buildings or forest, and a building that laid alongside a bend in a major river. Then all he needed to do was perform a 2 1/2 minute desending turn and WHEN HE COMPLETED THE TURN, then aim for the side of a building that presented itself to him and which was several times the width of the aircraft, and then when it was a certainty that he was lined up to push the engines to maximum. By the time he hit the lamposts the plane could have pitched sright down and the bulk of the aircraft would still have carried to the Pentagon.

3. Can you provide the source material from the terrorists that you referenced? Or can you source Hani's intentions as you seem to think you know what they were? Thanks!

You have assumed that the aircraft hit exactly where it was intended to hit. You have looked at the impact zone and THEN drawn the bullseye on that spot.

You can be a great marksman if you get to place the bullseye after having pulled the trigger first.

 

[CHF]

Perhaps you should do the research. Not only that, fly the beast through several light poles, a trailer, and a fence and then hit the target without clipping the ground.

As if the plane somehow flew around carefully aiming at, and hitting, those objects.

The striking of light poles, a trailer, and a fence all occurred within a second, Swing.