Electric Vehicles

[Roger Ramjets]

Well, obviously the latter would be silly. The problem is that charging takes, even at best, a hundred times longer than just filling up a gas tank.

But when you look at the total time taken that's not actually true. I have often had to wait 10 minutes during busy periods just to get to the pump. At other times I had to make a special trip that was out of my way. Depending on where you live, driving to the gas station, filling up, paying for the gas, and driving back home again could take a considerable time (and you're burning gas to get there and back!).

With the electric car? Just plug it at night or in the morning when you get up - takes about 30 seconds. That's a minimum of 15 minutes of my time saved compared to going to a Gas station. Plus it's a lot nicer (man, do I hate the smell of gas now!).

 

[bruto]

But when you look at the total time taken that's not actually true. I have often had to wait 10 minutes during busy periods just to get to the pump. At other times I had to make a special trip that was out of my way. Depending on where you live, driving to the gas station, filling up, paying for the gas, and driving back home again could take a considerable time (and you're burning gas to get there and back!).

With the electric car? Just plug it at night or in the morning when you get up - takes about 30 seconds. That's a minimum of 15 minutes of my time saved compared to going to a Gas station. Plus it's a lot nicer (man, do I hate the smell of gas now!).

But that's only true for home charging. Of course, if you can charge overnight enough to get you through the day, then everything is fine. If you have to stop partway through a trip for a charge it's more of a problem.

Which is why I think electrics at least for the present make much more sense as urban runabouts, buses, taxicabs, and the like.

I expect battery technology will continue to improve and like many other technologies will do so at an accelerating rate, but it's not quite good enough yet for everything.

 

[JoeMorgue]

No crumple zones though. The car will survive a wreck, but they'll have to pressure wash your battered remains out of the cabin before handing it off to your next of kin.

Jalaponik ran an article about a week back asking for people to share things they disliked about modern cars.

About 90% was Boomers going "Waaaah! Waaah! All these safety features! I like it better when you just died!"

 

[SezMe]

Your dad was good people.

I'm sure - but I've heard some lingering concern about one of his kids.

 

[Galaxie]

No crumple zones though. The car will survive a wreck, but they'll have to pressure wash your battered remains out of the cabin before handing it off to your next of kin.

Why you gotta be so negative? Kidding, I almost brought that up in my post. "I'd buy the hell out of that...well, until I saw one crash."

Jalaponik ran an article about a week back asking for people to share things they disliked about modern cars.

About 90% was Boomers going "Waaaah! Waaah! All these safety features! I like it better when you just died!"

I'm not even a boomer and I get annoyed by the lane-departure warnings and blind spot monitors. I'm not really looking forward to replacing my beater partly for that reason.

 

[jadebox]

They of course had the same problem. The battery and how to charge it.

Actually, they had the advantage back then. Places to charge were easier to find than places to get gas.

 

[Shalamar]

But that's only true for home charging. Of course, if you can charge overnight enough to get you through the day, then everything is fine. If you have to stop partway through a trip for a charge it's more of a problem.

Which is why I think electrics at least for the present make much more sense as urban runabouts, buses, taxicabs, and the like.

I expect battery technology will continue to improve and like many other technologies will do so at an accelerating rate, but it's not quite good enough yet for everything.

It's one of the Reasons my wife and I bought a Tesla Model Y. I'm currently using it for work, and I average about 80-120 miles a day. We have a fast (ish) home charger, which takes about 4-5 hours for a full charge if we drop it very low (under 20%).

It has enough charge to get to the Inlaws (Seattle - Portland) and we use a trickle charge there.

But Tesla has the Supercharge network. DC Fast charging across the nation that only Teslas can use. We know where they are, the car knows where they are, and if you pull in when you're very low, takes about 30 mins to get you to the next supercharger for long trips.

It helps to know the cars limitations, and I admit, it's the best damn car I've ever owned.

 

[Filippo Lippi]

If they could make a cheap battery that could store enough and charge fast enough we would see cheap EVs. Much cheaper than ICE vehicles.

Robert Llewellyn on his Fully Charged Youtube channel (the thing that seeded my interest in EV's) is sure that we're already there. Batteries are close to $100 a Kwh, and you can buy an EV for under £10k in China, now. He is sure that it is legacy manufacturers inflating the cost of their EV's to protect sales of their ICE cars, because they can't transition the plants quickly enough.

 

[gnome]

Why you gotta be so negative? Kidding, I almost brought that up in my post. "I'd buy the hell out of that...well, until I saw one crash."


I'm not even a boomer and I get annoyed by the lane-departure warnings and blind spot monitors. I'm not really looking forward to replacing my beater partly for that reason.

I'm glad for them--I think of all the times I almost wrecked (and one time I did) where features like that would likely have avoided incident altogether. Sure, a fresh, alert driver probably doesn't really need them... but how many people commuting to and from work are fresh and alert? How many are not as sharp as they think they are at the time?

 

[Fast Eddie B]

I'm not even a boomer and I get annoyed by the lane-departure warnings and blind spot monitors. I'm not really looking forward to replacing my beater partly for that reason.

I AM a boomer, vintage 1949, and while those systems do occasionally annoy, they are to me a net positive.

My car has fairly primitive assists: Adaptive Cruise Control, Lane Keep Assist and some sort of emergency braking function (I forget the acronym, something about collision mitigation). Around town, they don’t do a whole lot. But on road trips, I find that collectively they do noticeably reduce fatigue and make driving longer distances a more pleasurable experience. I look forward to our next car - a CyberTruck? - having even more driver assist features.

 

[Lplus]

I AM a boomer, vintage 1949, and while those systems do occasionally annoy, they are to me a net positive.

My car has fairly primitive assists: Adaptive Cruise Control, Lane Keep Assist and some sort of emergency braking function (I forget the acronym, something about collision mitigation. Around town, they don’t do a whole lot. But on road trips, I find that collectively they do noticeably reduce fatigue and make driving longer distances a more pleasurable experience. I look forward to our next car - a CyberTruck? - having even more driver assist features.

I'm assuming this is because you don't have to concentrate so hard? I'm not convinced that systems that allow drivers to relax are a net benefit.

 

[gnome]

I'm assuming this is because you don't have to concentrate so hard? I'm not convinced that systems that allow drivers to relax are a net benefit.

Not so much relax, but to better focus on other driving concerns.

Adaptive cruise control for example--I still have to remain aware of how close other cars are, but now I don't have to do it while constantly adjusting and monitoring my speed. That's a huge fatigue reducer right there, and arguably I've got MORE attention for spatial awareness, and less time looking at my dashboard to try to find a fixed speed that works for a while.

 

[The Don]

I'm assuming this is because you don't have to concentrate so hard? I'm not convinced that systems that allow drivers to relax are a net benefit.

The last 12 months or so I've not driven very much at all but prior to that I did, by UK standards a fair amount of driving. For much of the first decade of the 2000's I was driving around 50,000 miles a year (I realise that by US standards this is nothing ), more recently 20-25,000.

Well over 80% of my driving was done on motorways (freeways), much of it when the traffic was pretty heavy. Driving in stop/start traffic when you're doing 80mph one minute and are stopped the next, constantly checking to see who is going to come at you next and from which direction is tiring. 8 hours of driving under those conditions were hard (especially because the driving was on top of the actual work I was doing). Any tools that make that less wearing are, IMO, likely to improve road safety by allowing drivers to concentrate the most important things.

On the other end of the scale for a couple of years I set off between 0300 and 0400 in order to beat the traffic for the drive up to see my Dad. Lane assist and cruise control would have been helpful on a number of occasions.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Drivers should not be lazy or distracted.

The penalty for them being lazy or distracted should not be them wrapped around a telephone pole or turning a pedestrian into a technicolor smear.

So safety features are still a net good.

 

[gnome]

"Stay in my lane or the car will scold me" still encourages alert driving, without being as stressful as "stay in my lane or I'll crash into somebody".

 

[Fast Eddie B]

I'm assuming this is because you don't have to concentrate so hard? I'm not convinced that systems that allow drivers to relax are a net benefit.

The last 3 posts do a good job of summarizing my position. Thanks.

 

[Dr. Keith]

I'm assuming this is because you don't have to concentrate so hard? I'm not convinced that systems that allow drivers to relax are a net benefit.

I assume you have a ten inch tungsten spike mounted to your steering wheel to keep you alert while driving. That little pressure in the middle of your chest as you brake a little too hard is a great reminder of how important safe driving is.

 

[JoeMorgue]

That's why it's vitally important that you never tell your children to be quiet so you can concentrate on driving. Real drivers only drive manual cars with no traction control, no ABS, no seatbelts, no airbags, and with their trunks filled with nitroglycerin so they are always completely on while driving.

 

[ponderingturtle]

No crumple zones though. The car will survive a wreck, but they'll have to pressure wash your battered remains out of the cabin before handing it off to your next of kin.

The not wanting to get speared by the steering column through the heart will insure they drive responsibly.

 

[bruto]

I'm all for safety features. I've never driven without seatbelts except in old cars that had none. I don't mind airbags though I'd just as soon skip them and wear a good belt. I certainly appreciate crush zones and door rails, better bumpers, dual brake systems, and that sort of thing.

But I'm not so sold on some of the other features. I've been utterly stuck on back roads when my traction control would not allow my tires to spin a little. I'd just as soon be rid of ABS too, and go back to knowing how to apply the brakes, which I've done with great success since 1965. I'd rather have good side view mirrors and a proper rear window than a bunch of buzzers and cameras and more electronics to go wrong.

I do use cruise control occasionally on long trips, just to ease the leg cramps, and do nowadays (reluctantly) have an automatic transmission, though that is only because since my 2012 cycling accident I can no longer drive very long distances myself, so need a car my wife is comfortable driving too. But for most purposes I'd just as soon ditch the cruise and go back to a stick shift.

Of course I know I'm an outlying old curmudgeon, but there it is. I still wish (vainly) that someone someday would design an electric economy hot rod with all that luxo crap left off. Bring back my 1985 Honda hatchback with an electric power train. No air, no traction control or abs, manual windows, big rear window you could see out of. Handled well, went fast enough, great gas mileage. If the camshaft had not snapped in half at 185 thousand miles I'd probably have it still (rust patches and all).