Iacchus said:Science gets more than its share of funding from the federal government, I can assure you.Look at all the federal funding that goes into the public school systems for example. But then again, if we were to consider evolution a religion, that would be a breach of church and state now wouldn't it? And we all know that is now don't we? A no no! ...
You are right science is bad, evil grrrrrrrr.
We don’t need all the health, medical, nutrition etc, etc advance science brings us.. I am more then happy to be in a cave and who cares about death causing illnesses and such. I say down with science. It is so ironic to see people complain about science and using a computer to do so…
Iacchus said:
No, the fact is you don't know what my belief in God entails. And none of this "conjecture" on your part is going to do you a bit of good to establish what you're saying.
Not the case. I have read many of your post for 2 years now, read much of your "book" as you know tried to debate you at your site but all I was able to get was name calling etc and not one answer to a single question.
As you informed me that at your site you only ask questions and do not answer them.
So you see it is not at all "conjecture" at all on my part unless you are saying what you write is not what you believe?
Skeptical Greg
Agave Wine Connoisseur
Uhhh, which universe are you talking about? There is anything but order in this one..Iacchus said:
Another reason to to infer, that if there is a creator, it is not a very good one.
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena, Pronouns: he/him
Iacchus said:
What on earth does altruism have to do with order? Did I miss a step here?
a: Where does altruism come from?
b: It's a survival trait among social species.
a: But that doesn't explan the existence of order in the universe!
Um, no, it doesn't. Was it supposed to?
I was following along nicely until this ghastly non-sequitur. Order exists because the universe started in a state of extreme order. The primordial nugget (sometimes erroneously called the Big Bang) necessarily was in a state of extremely low entropy, and has been getting more and more disordered ever since! What has that got to do with altruism?
Wow. I just want to gild this post and hermetically seal it to keep it from fading...Your understanding of Science is abyssmal, and now we know that your understanding of religion is, too. As well as your understanding of federal support of programs and of public school funding. But the fun part is, you allude to what is essentially a conspiracy--we call evolution "science", rather than "religion", simply so that we can channel vast amounts of federal tax dollars to supporting this secular (but really religious, just don't tell, winkwinknudgenudge) propaganda...Iacchus said:Science gets more than its share of funding from the federal government, I can assure you.
Iacchus, this is not just wrong, but ludicrous, on so many levels. I really wonder...do you really believe what you are saying? A post like this one, I have to doubt it.
*****
Hey, did you know that most religions have no problem with the idea of evolution by natural selection? Did you know that evolution is not a religion by even the most broad definitions of the word? And a bit of homework for you...could you please find how much federal money goes to public schools and compare it to military spending? I know it is a silly comparison, but I want you to get a sense of perspective...
Well, believe it or not it's a yes or no proposition. And if you don't know -- most of us are born "not knowing" anything by the way -- it simply becomes a matter of faith.Pahansiri said:
Nag, nag, nag ...
Yes, I do ask a lot of questions. But, for some reason most people don't seem to get it. These are the questions they should be asking. I'm just trying to prime the pump by getting them to ask the questions.
Life is slippery is it not? If you want to know the meaning to life, don't ask me.
Ha ha ha ha ha! The joke is always on you my friend!Pahansiri said:You are right science is bad, evil grrrrrrrr.
It is so ironic to see people complain about science and using a computer to do so…
I never claimed Science was evil ... albeit people can certainly do "evil" things with it.There is the truth to religion and there is the truth to science, neither of which is known by any of us at birth. Neither can any of us expect to become omniscient in this regard. So, what exactly would you call it, the state between not knowing and knowing "something" but, by no stretch of the imagination, knowing "everything?" What does it tell us? aside from the fact that man's existence is "faith based" and, perfectly coincides with the notion of a Creator who "reveals" all things ... some of which are more blatantly obvious than others no doubt.Mercutio said:
Hello again Iacchus
Not sure how this is relevant to what I said. You said I do not know what your beliefs are, I pointed out that I have read your cyber book and read your post for about 2 years or so.
What is a yes or no proposition?
Believing in a God or Gods? That would not be true some are not sure, most in fact in reality all are not sure. You believe and have faith there is a god or gods and I respect that. People do not believe and that is to be respected and people are not sure and that is to be respected and people simply do not care.
What does a child being born having no knowledge have to do with this discussion? Remember you said it was human nature to believe in a god so then a child being born human would be born with a belief in a god. The fact is that is not the case and it a learned belief.
Are things simply a matter of faith? Of course and by such should be respected as a belief, a faith it is true. The problem comes when one who has faith a belief that what they wish to believe is true and all others are lost, blind and need to be changed to be like them.
They say “ abandon what you believe, forget the facts you know and simply believe what I do because I want you to so I feel better about myselfâ€
Think of these quotes
Yet another mature response to facts you do not like.
We are all “lost and blind†you are good and smart and are the sole holder of truth. Yes that was sarcasm.
The problem is not you asking questions ( which I and most I believe here always answer as what respectful people do), the problem is you refuse to answer any.
the questions YOU believe should be asked, when answered you simply ignore the answers. The reason you will not respond to questions, well I have my belief as to why you refuse.
What in the world does this have to do with what I asked???????
Not sure how this is relevant to what I said. You said I do not know what your beliefs are, I pointed out that I have read your cyber book and read your post for about 2 years or so.
What is a yes or no proposition?
Believing in a God or Gods? That would not be true some are not sure, most in fact in reality all are not sure. You believe and have faith there is a god or gods and I respect that. People do not believe and that is to be respected and people are not sure and that is to be respected and people simply do not care.
What does a child being born having no knowledge have to do with this discussion? Remember you said it was human nature to believe in a god so then a child being born human would be born with a belief in a god. The fact is that is not the case and it a learned belief.
Are things simply a matter of faith? Of course and by such should be respected as a belief, a faith it is true. The problem comes when one who has faith a belief that what they wish to believe is true and all others are lost, blind and need to be changed to be like them.
They say “ abandon what you believe, forget the facts you know and simply believe what I do because I want you to so I feel better about myselfâ€
Think of these quotes
Yet another mature response to facts you do not like.
We are all “lost and blind†you are good and smart and are the sole holder of truth. Yes that was sarcasm.
The problem is not you asking questions ( which I and most I believe here always answer as what respectful people do), the problem is you refuse to answer any.
the questions YOU believe should be asked, when answered you simply ignore the answers. The reason you will not respond to questions, well I have my belief as to why you refuse.
What in the world does this have to do with what I asked???????
Yes, I realize I may have jumped the tracks a bit, but I was just cutting to the chase. Because ultimately, in order to understand anything, we have to ask what order is and, how it came about. While here, I don't see how it's possible that order can have a beginning if, in fact everything is derived from order. What does it have to do with altruism? Well, how could it "elvove" (into a survival trait), if it was merely following the pre-existing order of things? Does the design on the carpet "elvolve" when you roll the carpet out? No, not at all. And, although it may "appear" that way, it merely unfolds according to a predefined pattern.arthwollipot said:
Of course I can not know for sure but it does not need to be “implanted†or “ part of a designâ€.
Many of mans advances perhaps most or all have come from learning, trial and error, reaction to stimuli.
To be harmed causes suffering, pain beings will naturally seek to avoid pain, suffering. One sees the effect of a stimuli on themselves that brings about pain, suffering sadness. They see how such causes the same reaction to others knowing what it feels like.
Causing suffering to another brings about pain and suffering in oneself in great degrees to the nagging pain of guilt.
I believe the truest nature of living things is the desire not to suffer, to be happy.
Iacchus said:
Please read what I write.
I have never declared I know or do not know if your god or any gods exist and I can not prove they do not as you can not prove they do.
I do not demand they do not exist as I do not demand 100’ invisible bunnies exist. But if some demands to me that they do I was ask they prove this to be true.
May I ask your question to you Do you know whether the God you believe in truly exists or not? Like hell you do!
But I do respect you and that you believe he/she does.. Please do Remember as I have pointed out before this is a discussion board, at such places we find discussions. Exchanges of ideas and beliefs and discussions about said beliefs. There is no need for anger or to become upset because people wish not to believe what you want them to.
And is this a deliberate attempt to be stupid on your part or, is it designed to get me angry?Pahansiri said:
What, you believe that I believe in this "non-existent" being? Whoa ... Isn't that a big leap of faith?
Oh, I honestly believe that you believe what you believe. So what? Aside from that though, I think you're full of crap.
Hey, that's not the problem in the least. The problem is when someone deliberately tries to get you angry, just so you can play this little game with them. Ha ha ha ha ha! The joke is always on you my friend!