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Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2

d4m10n said:
You said that only the right wing wants to do the violence, as if Steve Scalise never got shot and the Weather Underground was a fictional movement.
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Did I say that?

When I say 'basic logic' I mean basic logic. If 'Cancel Culture' cannot be any set that includes threats of violence or violence, and the sets that originate from the right wing almost always include that, does it follow that sets from the left wing never (or practically never) endorse violence?
 
tyr_13 said:
Did I say that?

When I say 'basic logic' I mean basic logic. If 'Cancel Culture' cannot be any set that includes threats of violence or violence, and the sets that originate from the right wing almost always include that, does it follow that sets from the left wing never (or practically never) endorse violence?
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Basic logic would proceed from the definition of cancel culture and ask whether violence is somehow excluded, given that the other conditions are satisfied. Give it a shot.

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d4m10n said:
Basic logic would proceed from the definition of cancel culture and ask whether violence is somehow excluded, given that the other conditions are satisfied. Give it a shot.

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Got it, I never said what you claimed and you're not going to even try. I mean, I knew that already from previous experience but it's good to remind lurkers.
 
If someone wants to argue that "Cancel Culture cannot be any set that includes threats of violence or violence" then I'd be willing to entertain their framing. Until that happens, it's just a silly hypo.
 
Another NYC professional got fed into the cancel culture machine, this one a lawyer who drunkenly ripped the wig off a stranger on the street.

Fired after he was quickly identified on social media

Lawyer Fired After Allegedly Pulling Off Woman’s Wig

Anthony Orlich, a white lawyer who was caught on video after he allegedly assaulted a Black woman has been fired. Late last week, singer Lizzy Ashliegh posted a video on TikTok alleging that Anthony Orlich, pulled the wig she was wearing off her head. The video has more than 500,000 views on TikTok and has now been shared across several other social media platforms. In it Ashliegh can be seen asking Orlich in a distressed voice why he took her wig off.

“Sir, for what f**king reason? For what reason? For what reason did you take my wig off? Because what made you think that that was the good thing to do? For what? For what? Why did you do that?” Ashliegh can be heard saying in the video.

Orlich is seen on the video smiling, walking on, without any sign of contrition or remorse.
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https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/lawyer-fired-allegedly-pulling-off-204319484.html
 
d4m10n said:
If you're really asking for the worst case examples, consider what happened to Salman Rushdie fairly recently or Theo van Gogh much less recently. After they were publicly demonized for speech or expression, they were individually targeted for violent reprisal.

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What about the international cancellation of South Africa in the 80s to influence their internal policies?
 
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Blank said:
What about the international cancellation of South Africa in the 80s to influence their internal policies?
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It would seem a bit more righteous if we tried that same approach when it actually required significant pain on our end, e.g. when the Saudis used a bone saw on a dissident WaPo journalist.

(Good idea at the time, though.)
 
Just spotted on the contrarian website Spiked, an article quoting 'Right-Winger' Tim Minchin (He must be, he's being quoted on Spiked.) on 'Cancel Culture'...


It has become fashionable in some circles to pretend that cancel culture doesn’t exist. You’ll often hear, from figures in the media or the arts, that the crisis of free speech in the West is all just a right-wing myth, and that no one is really being silenced, shunned or hounded out of their jobs for straying from elite orthodoxy. The ever-growing list of cancellations never manages to dent this narrative.
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https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/06/05/tim-minchin-is-right-cancel-culture-is-psychopathic/
 
d4m10n said:
It would seem a bit more righteous if we tried that same approach when it actually required significant pain on our end, e.g. when the Saudis used a bone saw on a dissident WaPo journalist.

(Good idea at the time, though.)
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An interesting question. I would also be impressed by a strong stance against Saudi human rights violations, but I also acknowledge that comes with significant consequences and we would be wise to pick our battles. On the other hand, using peacetime influence you have over a closer ally is easier... and so in a way inaction is less defensible in that case.
 
Graham2001 said:
Just spotted on the contrarian website Spiked, an article quoting 'Right-Winger' Tim Minchin (He must be, he's being quoted on Spiked.) on 'Cancel Culture'...





https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/06/05/tim-minchin-is-right-cancel-culture-is-psychopathic/
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It's sad, your favorite comedians either die young or live long enough to become middle-aged conservative blowhards. When they start whining about cancel culture you know it's time to take them back behind the barn like old yeller.
 
d4m10n said:
Spreading misinfo on a skeptic website. Points for chutzpah.

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well, looks like i got it wrong. usually assuming the worst about people i hate pans out. my bad.

-edit-

i actually watched the full clip and she appears to be making some kind of jumbled thoughts of a comparison to where election deniers are treated the same as holocaust deniers, then immediately pivots into jews control hollywood. so i don't really know what she's trying to say. so, that's it
 
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Somewhat cancel culture adjacent is this story of Yoel Inbar from the podcast, Two Psychologists Four Beers. Here he is on the Very Bad Wizards podcast explaining how he was initially looking likely to get a job at UCLA until some grad students wrote a letter protesting his appointment because of some remarks he had made on his podcast that were critical of DEI statements, and for being critical of a social science organization for requesting participants of a conference explain the role the work does to futher social justice, oh, and for saying that it should not be a matter for such bodies to state their position on abortion given that not all members are likely to agree.

Link

A link to the letter and some commentary is here.

For his part, Yoel Inbar does not want this to be considered cancel culture as he still has a very nice job at the University of Toronto, but he does accept that these kinds of actions do put a certain chilling effect on what people may or may not want to say on public forums if they want to get work in academia.
 
However,...

I will note that part of the reason why he was being interviewed was because his girlfriend got a job there, and he enquired about a partner programme whereby he could be hired alongside her (though I think not in the same department).

Much of this rides on his own interpretation. He felt like the job was all but being given to him and that he thought the interview was less a formal interview and more of a recruitment, although we cannot really know that.

It is not exactly clear how much the letter played in the hiring decision. Apparently a letter was also signed by other students in support of hiring Yoel Inbar, so I don't know if we can be certain why he didn't get hired.

I think in the podcast, Inbar and maybe Dave Pizarro say that they would advise younger academics to not create waves, but Tamler Somers pushes back on this believing that to fail to state what you think is soul-destroying and ultimately it is better to say what you believe in even at the risk of not being hired somewhere.

Anyway, feel free to have a heated debate.
 
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