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Cont: Brexit: Now What? The Perfect 10.

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McHrozni said:
Yeah, but that was just one aspect of what was promised.

The other was that UK would retain all the benefits of membership, including frictionless trade with EU.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ds-entering-uk-will-not-apply-until-july-2021
Nope.

That's not really a minor issue, it was a promise by architects of Brexit that was broken for all to see.

How will the Irish border work, by the way?

McHrozni
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The thing is, at the moment we are post-Brexit and we still have frictionless trade with the EU and the UK/Irish border is exactly as it was before, therefore Project Fear was completely wrong.

Of course we likely will not have those two things in place on 1 January 2021 but that's in the future and although all "experts" are suggesting that it'll be a complete ****-show, they can be safely ignored. :rolleyes:
 
McHrozni said:
Yes, yes, definitely. Those all played a major role :o

Germany needed two world wars to get those out of their system. UK will need Brexit, followed perhaps by Scotxit and maybe Breentryasajuniortradepartner (tacky abbervision pending) to do the same.

What will USA and China need, I wonder? Dread, even.

McHrozni
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Will not happen. Our trade deal with the US will prohibit it. :(
 
The Don said:
Will not happen. Our trade deal with the US will prohibit it. :(
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Well, I can modify Breentryasajuniortradepartner to Brentryasajuniortradepartner. That means it's British entry and not reentry, the rest is the same anyway.

That assumes, of course, there is a trade deal with the US in the meantime. Between the mandatory summer break in July and August and the election campaign that follows that leaves what? Six weeks to strike one? During a pandemic and the resulting economic crash?

Fun fact, Joules Verne wrote a book that takes place in 2600 where UK is a colony of the USA. I love that author you know?

McHrozni
 
McHrozni said:
Yeah. I can understand architects of Brexit, they're either motivated by personal greed and wish the UK to become a disaster zone they can loot, or else scheming politicians that wish to see UK become disaster zone so it's less of a threat. This later group also wishes to see EU damaged, so Brexit serves two purposes. I don't support them, in fact I think Azkaban is too good for them, but I understand their goals and motivations.

But the grunts, those I'll never understand. Look, the architects told you a plethora of lies, not one of their major Brexit claims has turned out to be factual. Why do you still believe them?

Cognitive dissonance and sunk costs suck :(

McHrozni
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The grunts were in it for the fight, they wanted to stick it to foreigners, the EU, politicians and 'the Establishment Elite', to use Boris' own metaphor they were throwing rocks at their neighbour's greenhouse to hear the crash because it gave them a feeling of power, they never thought beyond that as they expected to lose and go back to complaining about the other side cheating (you can always tell, when one side is angrier after winning than before, this). And between the architects and the grunts was a layer of populists who were actually the elite but pretending to be grunts while betraying both sides.
 
The Don said:
The thing is, at the moment we are post-Brexit and we still have frictionless trade with the EU and the UK/Irish border is exactly as it was before, therefore Project Fear was completely wrong.

Of course we likely will not have those two things in place on 1 January 2021 but that's in the future and although all "experts" are suggesting that it'll be a complete ****-show, they can be safely ignored. :rolleyes:
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I suppose you can shorten that to "room temperature IQ".

In Celsius.

McHrozni
 
P.J. Denyer said:
The grunts were in it for the fight, they wanted to stick it to foreigners, the EU, politicians and 'the Establishment Elite', to use Boris' own metaphor they were throwing rocks at their neighbour's greenhouse to hear the crash because it gave them a feeling of power, they never thought beyond that as they expected to lose and go back to complaining about the other side cheating (you can always tell, when one side is angrier after winning than before, this). And between the architects and the grunts was a layer of populists who were actually the elite but pretending to be grunts while betraying both sides.
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They could at least be honest to themselves and admit the miserable failure of Brexit is there by design and like Brexit for the failure that it is. Instead they pretend they like the result they're given because it's different from the result they were given. Somehow.

McHrozni
 
McHrozni said:
They could at least be honest to themselves and admit the miserable failure of Brexit is there by design and like Brexit for the failure that it is. Instead they pretend they like the result they're given because it's different from the result they were given. Somehow.

McHrozni
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"It's easier to con someone than persuade them they've been conned"

This goes double when you've dragged everyone around you into it.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Context?
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Context is Farage having one of his rants.
LBC dropped his radio show so he needs some other way of staying in the limelight.

Brexit is all he has, he can't get elected as an MP, his US dreams are in ashes.

How else will he get publicity?
 
McHrozni said:
Well, I can modify Breentryasajuniortradepartner to Brentryasajuniortradepartner. That means it's British entry and not reentry, the rest is the same anyway.

That assumes, of course, there is a trade deal with the US in the meantime. Between the mandatory summer break in July and August and the election campaign that follows that leaves what? Six weeks to strike one? During a pandemic and the resulting economic crash?

Fun fact, Joules Verne wrote a book that takes place in 2600 where UK is a colony of the USA. I love that author you know?

McHrozni
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The US trade deal will not only prohibit UK membership of the EU, it will prohibit the UK having a free trade deal with the EU. If the UK signs up to the US trade deal then EU membership is out of the window for at least a generation. :mad:

The UK will get a trade deal with the US, if the US wants one, because the UK will simply accept any and all terms that the US wants. There will be no need for protracted trade talks because the UK will simply say "Yes" to whatever the US wants. AIUI there is already a draft set of terms issued by the US (including the points on food standards and prohibiting place of origin labelling, sore points here in the UK) so as I see it, the only possible cause of delay is if the US wants to "double-dip" and see whether they can get even more favourable terms and/or even greater access to the NHS.
 
The Don said:
The US trade deal will not only prohibit UK membership of the EU, it will prohibit the UK having a free trade deal with the EU. If the UK signs up to the US trade deal then EU membership is out of the window for at least a generation. :mad:

The UK will get a trade deal with the US, if the US wants one, because the UK will simply accept any and all terms that the US wants. There will be no need for protracted trade talks because the UK will simply say "Yes" to whatever the US wants. AIUI there is already a draft set of terms issued by the US (including the points on food standards and prohibiting place of origin labelling, sore points here in the UK) so as I see it, the only possible cause of delay is if the US wants to "double-dip" and see whether they can get even more favourable terms and/or even greater access to the NHS.
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That's what I called Brentryasajuniortradepartner, once UK is very well shafted by the US maybe then the Bexit grunts will realize they were conned through and through.

Of course there's the issue of the American elections, which paralyze the already crippled administration even more. Between that, the pandemic and the riots I find it doubtful the USA can secure the deal - even if the UK says "yes" to everything there may not even be a partner in USA with the ability to sign one.

We'll see. Trade talks began in mid-May, chlorinated chicked and hormone-fed beef seem to be major points where USA wants absolute capitulation by the UK. BJ has tried to resist a little thus far.

McHrozni
 
The Don said:
The US trade deal will not only prohibit UK membership of the EU, it will prohibit the UK having a free trade deal with the EU. If the UK signs up to the US trade deal then EU membership is out of the window for at least a generation. :mad:

The UK will get a trade deal with the US, if the US wants one, because the UK will simply accept any and all terms that the US wants. There will be no need for protracted trade talks because the UK will simply say "Yes" to whatever the US wants. AIUI there is already a draft set of terms issued by the US (including the points on food standards and prohibiting place of origin labelling, sore points here in the UK) so as I see it, the only possible cause of delay is if the US wants to "double-dip" and see whether they can get even more favourable terms and/or even greater access to the NHS.
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I've heard it said that the meat standards are being opposed by Carrie Symonds. Which, if true, means that the shape of future trade of our county is being decided by two unelected people with the PM's ear.

I'd expect Cummings to win, though. Johnson relies on him for more, and is too much of a misogynist to take his missus' side on something like that.
 
McHrozni said:
That's what I called Brentryasajuniortradepartner, once UK is very well shafted by the US maybe then the Bexit grunts will realize they were conned through and through.

Of course there's the issue of the American elections, which paralyze the already crippled administration even more. Between that, the pandemic and the riots I find it doubtful the USA can secure the deal - even if the UK says "yes" to everything there may not even be a partner in USA with the ability to sign one.

We'll see. Trade talks began in mid-May, chlorinated chicked and hormone-fed beef seem to be major points where USA wants absolute capitulation by the UK. BJ has tried to resist a little thus far.

McHrozni
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The UK government has already clearly signalled that the UK is now perfectly happy to capitulate on food standards - and on anything else for that matter - for example, the NHS is also back on the table.:mad:
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
I've heard it said that the meat standards are being opposed by Carrie Symonds. Which, if true, means that the shape of future trade of our county is being decided by two unelected people with the PM's ear.

I'd expect Cummings to win, though. Johnson relies on him for more, and is too much of a misogynist to take his missus' side on something like that.
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For Boris Johnson, significant others are consumable items.
 
I have to say this is by far the most complex annexation of a new state to the union so far. Still, where to put the 51st star on the flag might be the biggest hurdle.

:boxedin:
 
Delphic Oracle said:
I have to say this is by far the most complex annexation of a new state to the union so far. Still, where to put the 51st star on the flag might be the biggest hurdle.

:boxedin:
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I don't think that there'd be any desire for a 51st state - too many voters used to "socialised" medicine - much better just to have a tame client state willing to take substandard goods.....
 
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