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Australian Politics: The Albanese Times

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Dabop said:
Like many others, I am beginning to suspect you aren't arguing in good faith...

The term 'at the governors pleasure' is (well was actually, it has been superseded for over a decade and a half now) does NOT mean 'lock em up and throw away the key'- it most commonly was used for those with mental health issues who were found unfit to stand trial, and were therefore committed until they were treated until they fit stand trial..., with regular inspection requirements...

All legal and above board, not the sinister 'they 'disappeared them' you are trying to make it out to be...
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WTF are you going on about? Did you actually read what I posted?
 
psionl0 said:
I am not going to repeat myself another 50000 times.
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And here the truth comes out. You haven't read the decisions and so your criticism is just what you think they said. Go on, read the decisions and tell us all why Lim and NZYQ are wrong.

Just suffice to say that everything you say is WRONG! :p
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And yet what I've said is supported by the law.
 
Back to the Lehrmann case, the judge has allowed a report from a forensic lip reader as exert evidence despite objections from Whyborn. This could be devastating for Lehrmann is the judge accepts it as factual as it confirms evidence by others that he badgered Higgins into quickly downing three drinks.

The other thing that had me screaming at the screen is that at different times Whyborn has contended that Higgins was sober as she entered PH (because she was walking straight) and so hopelessly drunk she couldn’t remember if her dress was on or not.
 
lionking said:
Back to the Lehrmann case, the judge has allowed a report from a forensic lip reader as exert evidence despite objections from Whyborn.
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I wanted to talk about that, but the voir dire was so boring I forgot what I wanted to say.

This could be devastating for Lehrmann is the judge accepts it as factual as it confirms evidence by others that he badgered Higgins into quickly downing three drinks.
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Especially in light of the other evidence about Lehrmann's actions towards Higgins before that night.

The other thing that had me screaming at the screen is that at different times Whyborn has contended that Higgins was sober as she entered PH (because she was walking straight) and so hopelessly drunk she couldn’t remember if her dress was on or not.
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Well the timeline he wants is Higgins was sober when she entered PH, was sober when she and Lehrmann banged in the minister's office, and afterwards she got so drunk from the alcohol in Lehrmann's office that he claims wasn't there except when he says it was that she forgot about all the consensual stuff.
 
According to the person testifying right now, apparently ASIO had never heard of Lehrmann after he name dropped them early on in the investigation.
 
Wildy said:
And now Whybrow is accusing Higgins' mum of lying about what she's testified to.
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That’s all they have. It was even more pathetic with Higgin’s dad. A tradie who obviously loves his daughter and was very emotional in testifying. Whyborn was doing the usual in trying to find inconsistencies, and the dad kept saying things like “it was five years ago, you have records you are looking at, I don’t”.

It got to the stage where the judge sent the father out and said to Whyborn something like “he’s emotional, he hasn’t got a good grasp of dates, he’s not an historian, so just let us accept that there are some inconsistencies and take representations about their weight”. Whyborn backed off.

In case people think the judge is biased, there was an interesting exchange at the end. He has created what is an Australian precedent in allowing expert evidence by a lip reader. Channel 10 lawyers asked that he give evidence by video as he is in England. The judge refused this request, so he will by flying out on the Aussie dollar and fair enough.

But the really interesting part is that the judge noted that the lip reader would be coming with his own interpreter (he’s deaf) so that he could fully understand the questions. “He’s an expert lip reader and needs an interpreter?” was the judge’s entirely reasonable observation.

Anyway, Channel 10 witnesses in the dock tomorrow. Unless Whyborn can get multiple smoking guns tomorrow, Lehrmann is ******.
 
lionking said:
In case people think the judge is biased, there was an interesting exchange at the end. He has created what is an Australian precedent in allowing expert evidence by a lip reader. Channel 10 lawyers asked that he give evidence by video as he is in England. The judge refused this request, so he will by flying out on the Aussie dollar and fair enough.

But the really interesting part is that the judge noted that the lip reader would be coming with his own interpreter (he’s deaf) so that he could fully understand the questions. “He’s an expert lip reader and needs an interpreter?” was the judge’s entirely reasonable observation.
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That was an interesting exchange surrounding the lip reader, and it makes perfect sense as to why the judge ruled the way he did. I guess the only real counterargument that could be made is that the expert has the ability to rewatch the footage unlike lip reading in real time.

Anyway, Channel 10 witnesses in the dock tomorrow. Unless Whyborn can get multiple smoking guns tomorrow, Lehrmann is ******.
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He'll probably accuse them of not investigating the story enough or something stupid like that. It certainly is starting to look like we're at the "pound the table" part of the adage.

One thing I've noticed about Whybrow is that whenever he's going to accuse someone of lying he'll start his questions with something like "I put it to you..." or "I'd like to suggest..." and then put forward what is basically an accusation of lying.
 
Wildy said:
One thing I've noticed about Whybrow is that whenever he's going to accuse someone of lying he'll start his questions with something like "I put it to you..." or "I'd like to suggest..." and then put forward what is basically an accusation of lying.
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What I’ve also noticed is his use of “whatever the case…” and nobody has ever picked him up on it. Like *excuse me your honour, what case is my learned friend referring to”.
 
Getting close to the end of the Lehrmann defamation trial. Still not looking good for Bruce.

Interesting ruling today. Senator Reynolds chief of staff, Fiona Brown, seems to be trying to avoid giving evidence. She is one of the most critical witnesses, and has claimed to be suffering anxiety (as a nasty aside, maybe due to guilt) and fears a panic attack if called to court. Excuse me for being skeptical of such a tough political operative being so fragile.

Anyway, I thought Judge Lee handled this brilliantly. He acknowledged the (dodgy?) medical certificates, but ruled she give evidence to a court empty of public, but with the media, the proceedings recorded and broadcast the next day.

You could sense the feeling of resignation in Whybrow’s voice.
 
Back to the Lehrmann defamation trial.

Closing submissions, and while there are some inconsistencies in Higgins testimony (judge Lee commented that sexual assault often results in this) Lehrmann’s lies are legion. Spent only $16 at the pub despite videos of him plying Higgins with multiple drinks? Wilkinson’s lawyer was actually laughing at his “reasons” for going back to PH at 2am.

I won’t go into detail, but I believe Judge Lee has already made up his mind. I will be staggered if the suit succeeds.

One particularly compelling comment by Channel 10s lawyer was that, if as I suspect Lehrmann is found to have raped Higgins, his decision to take this action, and put Higgins through the trauma of cross examination was “monstrous”.
 
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