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All appliances in house go out in power outage but not the digital clocks?

The cap is charging/discharging to smooth out the ripple in the rectified AC. Now suppose you had a way of shutting off the AC at any point. If you shut it off when the AC is crossing 0v vs shutting it off at the peak (around 120Vac in the US), how would that affect how long the cap might supply power to the circuit? I wouldn't think it would matter much, but I've never looked into this aspect of a AC/DC converter. If i did the math right, 60Hz is about 16.6ms.

Very little. If the capacitor is big enough to maintain a smooth voltage, that's equivalent to it taking much more than that 16ms to discharge a significant amount, pretty much by definition.

(Actually it's 8. 3ms for a full wave rectifier because both positive and negative parts of the cycle give a peak, but that's just nitpicking in this context.)

Dave
 
Once a while ago my house abruptly went into a low-power state. Lights worked but were dim, major appliances did not, electronics did not. No clock-radio to remember, though.

I assume that was what's called a "brown-out". We joked that if we could get the computers going we'd be running on Windows 47 and a half.
 
So a couple nights ago at around 11 PM, my room lights flickered on and off and the TV cut off and back on, obviously a power outage... I've heard that it's possible for temporary outages "sensitive equipment" like fans and TVs can go off, but clocks can survive. The only thing is that one of the clocks that survived is very sensitive. We're talking the power goes out the instant I unplug it. I just don't think it would be able to survive, and that's kinda creepy to me.
Yes, it's creepy. But only because you don't know anything about how electronic devices work.


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." - Arthur C. Clarke


Electronic devices can do many peculiar things when they fail. If you don't understand how they work then it may seem like 'magic' because the cause and effect is so unintuitive. But those of us who design and repair electronic devices know that no matter how weird the symptom there is always a rational explanation. We know because we have to deal with it every day.

Types of power outage
Power outages are categorized into three different phenomena, relating to the duration and effect of the outage:

A transient fault is a loss of power typically caused by a fault on a power line. Power is automatically restored once the fault is cleared.

A brownout is a drop in voltage in an electrical power supply. The term brownout comes from the dimming experienced by lighting when the voltage sags. Brownouts can cause poor performance of equipment or even incorrect operation.

A blackout is the total loss of power to an area and is the most severe form of power outage that can occur. Blackouts which result from or result in power stations tripping are particularly difficult to recover from quickly. Outages may last from a few minutes to a few weeks depending on the nature of the blackout and the configuration of the electrical network.

Your description of the power outage suggests a combination of transient fault and brownout. This may have been caused by a short circuit somewhere in the grid, perhaps due to power lines blowing in the wind or a car crashing into a power pole. When this happens the grid voltage will sag due the high current in the short, then overload breakers will trip to isolate the fault and try to reroute power to other parts of the grid. The power at your location may momentarily drop to a low voltage, then rise above the normal voltage as the fault is cleared and load reduced.

Most modern electronic devices such as clocks, TVs etc. convert the AC mains to a lower DC voltage via a transformer and rectifier. But the rectified DC still has the AC sine wave impressed on it, so a large capacitor is used to hold the voltage up during the 'troughs' of the waveform. Depending on how much current the device uses, the capacitor may take anywhere from a few tenths of a second to several seconds or even minutes to fully discharge. At some point the voltage will go too low for the device to work properly, and then it will either misoperate or stop working altogether.

Many modern devices contain digital electronics which has undefined operation when the voltage is too low, so they include a brownout reset circuit that operates before the voltage gets too low. Because power outages are a thing, devices which need to maintain their state often have a backup battery, super capacitor, or nonvolatile memory to store important information while the power is off. However even devices that don't have such backup circuits may (unreliably) hold their state for a few seconds due to internal capacitance.

Electronics is a broad and complex field, but it is all very well defined by mathematics and logic. It is also a fascinating subject that anyone with a reasonably logical mind can learn. But no matter how much you learn it's still magic - the magic of technology.
 
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I just tried it, my hypothesis was right. The other two clocks go out in what seems almost instant, but which I can tell is several milliseconds, I timed it at around 0.21 and 0.18. The other seems to go out with the other appliances, maybe a split second later

Oh. How did you actually time that?

Mmm, whatever, so what? You now claim your clocks are sometimes going out in .. quick .. and sometimes not.

Or, what?

Hans
 
Very little. If the capacitor is big enough to maintain a smooth voltage, that's equivalent to it taking much more than that 16ms to discharge a significant amount, pretty much by definition.

(Actually it's 8. 3ms for a full wave rectifier because both positive and negative parts of the cycle give a peak, but that's just nitpicking in this context.)

Dave

Right, however, it will dimensioned to only loose 10-20% during a cycle, so it will last far longer before it is actually down to, say 50%.

However, I think this is beginning to be silly. First, the OP claims his clocks kept running during a longer power-out, next he claims to have timed them to milliseconds .... with two decimals.

I'm trying to be open-minded and objective here, but ... I think we are owed an explanation.

Hans
 
Then, as I went to go tell my parents, my room light looked brighter, kinda hard to explain but it's just a normal room light that appeared to be almost twice as bright. I assumed it was a result of the power outage doing something to our circuit board just sending extra surges of electricity.
That's unlikely. Most houses are equipped with circuit breakers that prevent random power surges from overloading the circuit. But the room seeming brighter has a possible explanation. How long were the lights off? If it was more than a few seconds, your eyes will have started to adjust to the lower light level. Your pupils will have started to dilate to let in more of what little light there is. Then, when the light came back to its normal level, it seemed brighter. It's the same reason why you have to squint when you move from a dark room to bright sunlight. Your eyes take a little time to adjust.

I also would like to add this: DebunkThisPls, don't stop asking questions, despite what anyone else here says. Asking questions is the way you learn new things and that's objectively a Good Thing. Additionally, a lot of the posters here are... well, older than you, and have a great deal of technical knowledge. Explaining things to people without that knowledge is a good skill for us to develop as well.

Never stop asking questions.
 
I also would like to add this: DebunkThisPls, don't stop asking questions, despite what anyone else here says. Asking questions is the way you learn new things and that's objectively a Good Thing. Additionally, a lot of the posters here are... well, older than you, and have a great deal of technical knowledge. Explaining things to people without that knowledge is a good skill for us to develop as well.

Never stop asking questions.

That said, there are ways of asking questions so that they can be answered sensibly, there are places in which some questions are better asked than others (like some basic electronics questions or things about memory), then there are ways of asking follow up questions rather than blanket dismissals of something because you don't like it/it doesn't conform to some preconception and then you might like to consider the whole history of folk "just asking questions", especially on sceptical forums and the like, which most of us have experienced many times over.

Oh, yeah, and some of us spent our entire working lives working with children and teenagers...
 
DebunkThisPls, I noticed you mentioned that a lot of your anxiety started when you learned about simulation theory. Could you tell us a little bit more about that?

Welcome to the forum, by the way! :)
 
Oh. How did you actually time that?

Mmm, whatever, so what? You now claim your clocks are sometimes going out in .. quick .. and sometimes not.

Or, what?

Hans

I used a stop watch as well as I could and unplugged the clocks. I started the time when the plug was out and stopped when the clock went out
 
That's unlikely. Most houses are equipped with circuit breakers that prevent random power surges from overloading the circuit. But the room seeming brighter has a possible explanation. How long were the lights off? If it was more than a few seconds, your eyes will have started to adjust to the lower light level. Your pupils will have started to dilate to let in more of what little light there is. Then, when the light came back to its normal level, it seemed brighter. It's the same reason why you have to squint when you move from a dark room to bright sunlight. Your eyes take a little time to adjust.

I also would like to add this: DebunkThisPls, don't stop asking questions, despite what anyone else here says. Asking questions is the way you learn new things and that's objectively a Good Thing. Additionally, a lot of the posters here are... well, older than you, and have a great deal of technical knowledge. Explaining things to people without that knowledge is a good skill for us to develop as well.

Never stop asking questions.

The lights were out for no more than 0.1 or 0.2 seconds, it was just a flicker. Also, I worded this terribly. It was before the flicker that my room appeared brighter
 
Regarding that timing method: it's way inaccurate to be represented so finely, and I don't think milliseconds were the correct unit anyway.

As Butter! asked, do you think these incidents, and the other threads, are examples of 'glitch in the Matrix' stuff?
 
So I checked, our clock does not have battery backup or any batteries in it. It also still appears to be going out almost instantly when I unplug it

The lights were out for no more than 0.1 or 0.2 seconds, it was just a flicker.

I suspect you'll have trouble telling the difference between "almost instantly" and "just a flicker" accurately enough even to know which one is a shorter time interval.

Dave
 
I suspect you'll have trouble telling the difference between "almost instantly" and "just a flicker" accurately enough even to know which one is a shorter time interval.

Dave

Thats fair, but at the very least it appears to go out when the TV and other appliances do when unplugged, and all those other appliances went out during this
 
Regarding that timing method: it's way inaccurate to be represented so finely, and I don't think milliseconds were the correct unit anyway.

As Butter! asked, do you think these incidents, and the other threads, are examples of 'glitch in the Matrix' stuff?

I don't believe we live in a simulation, there's just weird things I cant explain sometimes that hurts my anxiety badly. Like today, I had a Santa hat over by the kitchen table when I wad on the couch. About 20 minutes after I had last gotten up, I noticed the hat was on the other side of the couch. I got up several times and walked towards that area, but it was still 5 or 6 feet out of my way, so I wouldve had to have walked to the right a little bit, pick up the hat, walk it over to the couch and forget about it
 
I'm starting to think your apartment is mainly in need of a competent electrician more than a skeptical spitballing
 
I don't believe we live in a simulation, there's just weird things I cant explain sometimes that hurts my anxiety badly. Like today, I had a Santa hat over by the kitchen table when I wad on the couch. About 20 minutes after I had last gotten up, I noticed the hat was on the other side of the couch. I got up several times and walked towards that area, but it was still 5 or 6 feet out of my way, so I wouldve had to have walked to the right a little bit, pick up the hat, walk it over to the couch and forget about it

Yes, people do things absentmindedly literally all the time. My wife carries things around and sets them down, then seconds later is asking me if I saw the item.

You're going to really hate getting old.
 
Yeah, there's way too much Unreliable Narrator going on here to really bother trying to make sense of what's being reported. Occam's Razor says nothing unusual is going on, and that the anxiety should probably be getting proper medical treatment.
 
Yeah, there's way too much Unreliable Narrator going on here to really bother trying to make sense of what's being reported. Occam's Razor says nothing unusual is going on, and that the anxiety should probably be getting proper medical treatment.

Agreed. The common denominator in all these threads seems to be free-floating anxiety.

OP, have you discussed these feelings with people more aligned with wellness rather than household electronics?
 

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