Swiss Man Legally Changes Gender to Retire Earlier
- Thread starter Tippit
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bruto
Penultimate Amazing
For those not willing to dive all the way down this rabbit hole, it seems from this article that Swiss law has relaxed about sex change, and the diligent diggers of important news have discovered that a Swiss person has changed gender from a him to a her. As a result this person can now retire earlier. ONE year earlier.
Despite the headline and the heading of this post, this single example in the entire country of 8.7 million, who is not named, is also not, at least in the text of the article, quoted, nor her employer quoted, nor is there any suggestion other than the headline that the motivation for the sex change was "to retire earlier."
It's possible, of course, that one person in the entire nation of Switzerland has found a way to game the system at the cost of changing gender. As a result of this scandalous skulduggery, this system-gaming person will gain one whole additional year of pension in an amount slightly higher than the official United States poverty level (assuming a household of one).
I mean, wouldn't you change your gender for that? Wouldn't everybody?
One probably need not say it, but in case one wonders, yes this site is pro-Russian, anti-liberal, anti-vax, anti-gay, etc.
The article cited concludes:
Despite the headline and the heading of this post, this single example in the entire country of 8.7 million, who is not named, is also not, at least in the text of the article, quoted, nor her employer quoted, nor is there any suggestion other than the headline that the motivation for the sex change was "to retire earlier."
It's possible, of course, that one person in the entire nation of Switzerland has found a way to game the system at the cost of changing gender. As a result of this scandalous skulduggery, this system-gaming person will gain one whole additional year of pension in an amount slightly higher than the official United States poverty level (assuming a household of one).
I mean, wouldn't you change your gender for that? Wouldn't everybody?
One probably need not say it, but in case one wonders, yes this site is pro-Russian, anti-liberal, anti-vax, anti-gay, etc.
The article cited concludes:
I don't think they looked for absurdity in quite the right place.
Well one extra year of pension is a big deal if all you have to do is self id.
There is a 75 franc fee, and a confirmation phone interview too! I suppose one year's worth of pension, plus the ability to show your friends your new driver's license is worth it.
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena, Pronouns: he/him
Meanwhile, do we have any evidence that this unidentified person changed gender in order to qualify for early retirement? Or is that an invention of this far-right, conspiracy-laden website?
Wow. Hitmen kill for less.
I can speak from experience as someone over retirement age (but not yet retired). 30k makes a huge difference to a retiree.
Unless you are being sarcastic. It’s hard to tell.
Ah, the ol' argument from incredulity fallacy
Zerohedge is a pretty poor source of information. It's happy to treat conspiracy theories as the truth and has a very lax approach to fact checking and so on. Before accepting what is published on there I'd personally want independent verification of the story, in particular the assertion that the person changed their gender in order to retire earlier - as opposed to changing their gender because they identify as another gender.
In hindsight my money is on sarcasm.
Not that long ago in Australia women were eligible for the pension at 60 and men at 65. If that was the rule now, I reckon our pension people would be dealing with hundreds of old age gender reassignments.
Not that long ago in Australia women were eligible for the pension at 60 and men at 65. If that was the rule now, I reckon our pension people would be dealing with hundreds of old age gender reassignments.
No it isn't.Ah, the ol' argument from incredulity fallacy
There are plenty of Swiss sources for the story. My suspicion is that this was done to highlight the hole in the law. Publicly admitting to having done this would effectively be admitting to fraud, so you have to wonder how this got into the newspapers.
I confirm it was sarcasm.
Honestly, the amount of fraud that goes on in the payment of welfare etc for far less money involving declarations that are demonstrably untrue is ridiculous. Unless the Swiss are a people of scrupulous honesty, I have a very hard time believing that people wouldn't scam far larger sums at far less risk given the opportunity.
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
If you are not actually a person likely to otherwise change gender, doing so sure seems like you'll be risking a lot of humiliation and embarrassment from skeptical family and friends just to retire ONE year early.
Also, the fact that the person gets a civil pension of between 13,990 CHF and 27,981 CHF does not mean they will gain anything. The average wage in Switzerland is 60,847 CHF, the average minimum wage (its different in different Cantons) is 20.08 CHF/hr (41,766 CHF). Also, if the person is unemployed, that benefit is 70% (or if they have dependent children 80%) of the average wage (about 45,000 CHF) so this person might be able to retire a year earlier, but it will almost certainly cost them financially.
Also, the fact that the person gets a civil pension of between 13,990 CHF and 27,981 CHF does not mean they will gain anything. The average wage in Switzerland is 60,847 CHF, the average minimum wage (its different in different Cantons) is 20.08 CHF/hr (41,766 CHF). Also, if the person is unemployed, that benefit is 70% (or if they have dependent children 80%) of the average wage (about 45,000 CHF) so this person might be able to retire a year earlier, but it will almost certainly cost them financially.
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For the gender change, or the gender change to claim a pension a year earlier ?
Possibly, but the more parsimonious explanation was that the gender change was because the individual wanted to change gender.
The kind of person who would changed gender to highlight a hole in the law is the sort of person who would be very explicit about why they were doing it.
Why would ones family take that view about changing your gender to scam the government? I agree some families would disapprove of this, but there are definitely communities where they would think you were smart for answering "yes" to "would you like $30k?" and would feel like you'd robbed your family if you declined. It's not like they have to wear a dress, or even shave. £75 and a 10 minute phone call. They probably don't even have to be the one to make the phone call.
For no reason in particular, this case came to my mind:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-11347134
There are plenty of people happy to scam the government.
So this is the kind of thing that only people at the margins of society taking cash under the table would be able to take advantage of? If Switzerland is anything like where I live, the rates of transgenderism in the Albanian community is going to start going up.
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Both. Whether the claim of fraud is true seems impossible to know, partly because it's impossible to prove unless the fraudster decides to publicly name themself.
The honest answer for the moment is that we can't say for sure one way or the other. People seem to commit every other type of fraud. I don't see what is so unique about this particular fraud that criminals would turn down $30k.
They are explicit about why they are doing it. What they don't do is publish their name when they are admitting fraud.
https://www.sott.net/article/463800-Man-declares-himself-woman-to-retire-early
The Curious Case of Sergio/a, the Argentinian Pensioner (Forbes, May 27, 2018)
TurkeysGhost
Penultimate Amazing
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The most eyebrow raising thing in that article is that the Swiss have different retirements ages for men and women, though 1 year seems like pretty small potatoes.
If there's any government policy that needs to be changed by this abuse of the system, it's the discriminatory retirement age, though the pettiness of this scheme doesn't seem to demand any urgent action.
If there's any government policy that needs to be changed by this abuse of the system, it's the discriminatory retirement age, though the pettiness of this scheme doesn't seem to demand any urgent action.
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In the UK - it used to be there was a 5 year difference with the longer living females getting to retire 5 years earlier than the shorter living males, only been regularised for the last couple of years.