Why the Persistent Disassociation?

[Radrook]

Why are whites so hell-bent on totally disassociating themselves genetically from Obama by repeatedly and invariably referring to him as black and an Afro American? Please forgive my question if it comes across as offensive. It isn't meant to be that way.
I'm simply interested in your explanations.

BTW

He's the product of TWO not one. Shunting him aside like that as if his white side doesn't exist can come accross as an insult. Not that race is the important thing. But if it indeed isn't-then let's at least be fair and decent about it and take what his true feelings might be into consideration by putting ourselves in his place.

 

[Tailgater]

What?

 

[Madalch]

The way I see it, his skin colour or ancestry does not determine who he is. I don't care who his ancestors were. I feel no more or less kinship with him than I do Yul Brenner, or George W. Bush, or Adolph Hitler.

The thing is, fifty years ago, his skin colour would have completely precluded him from being elected president, or even using the same drinking fountains as other citizens of his country (in some parts of said country, anyway). People of his skin colour were lynched for wanting to go to schools that contained kids with other skin colour.

The important thing is not that he is black, but that the USA has changed so much in fifty years. When I was in high school, Jesse Jackson was attempting to run for president, and we dismissed the idea as laughable- everyone "knew" that the USA was too racist to elect a black man as president, and didn't expect that to change.

We were wrong, and I tip my hat to the country.

 

[Jimbo07]

Why are whites so hell-bent on totally disassociating themselves genetically from Obama by repeatedly and invariably referring to him as black and an Afro American?

The idea of race is stupid.

Scientific discoveries have taken centuries to overcome pre-conceived notions about interrelationships. Using the term "genetic" actually distorts what science is discovering. It's a last gasp (though perhaps not the last) of ancient ideologies, verses technical understanding.

We ALL came from one cell

 

[jj]

What?

For once, we agree on something.

 

[Professor Yaffle]

I don't necessarily think that it is white people who are pgeon holing him as "black". In my experience, most mixed race (white/afro caribbean in the case of people I have known) people define themselves as black. They see the black population as a population they can identify with more, having the same experience of being a minority.

 

[gtc]

Why are whites so hell-bent on totally disassociating themselves genetically from Obama by repeatedly and invariably referring to him as black and an Afro American? Please forgive my question if it comes across as offensive. It isn't meant to be that way.
I'm simply interested in your explanations.

BTW

He's the product of TWO not one. Shunting him aside like that as if his white side doesn't exist can come accross as an insult. Not that race is the important thing. But if it indeed isn't-then let's at least be fair and decent about it and take what his true feelings might be into consideration by putting ourselves in his place.

I don't think it is done because whites want to disassociate themselves from him. I just think that facts (like the fact that his mother is of European origin and his father is Kenyan and apparently neither side of his family had anything to do with American slavery and the ultimate fact that race is an artificial construct) have no bearing on American racial politics. I think America is still suffering the effects of slavery and segregation in that regards. It is quite confusing to a foreigner.

 

[Tailgater]

For once, we agree on something.

Happy Days. The broken clock theory working its magic. I'm sure there is something else to agree on.

To the op:

I'd like to see where this disassociation idea is coming from. People are rallying around the fact he's the first person who's even half black becoming president and it's a great thing. For a bunch of whites to come and argue he's not black enough is just a buzzkill. Other whites who don't like that he's black are in the minority, which would make your blanketing of whites wrong. Of course, I might not understand what the OP is all about, but that would be my thoughts.

 

[gdnp]

Why are whites so hell-bent on totally disassociating themselves genetically from Obama by repeatedly and invariably referring to him as black and an Afro American?

Maybe because this is how he refers to himself?

 

[dudalb]

Hey, if Obama has any Irish blood in his veins, (I think he does) on March the 17th this year he will be claimed as an Irishman and as a smart politician from Chicago, he will go along....

 

[Undesired Walrus]

The way I see it, his skin colour or ancestry does not determine who he is. I don't care who his ancestors were. I feel no more or less kinship with him than I do Yul Brenner, or George W. Bush, or Adolph Hitler.

The thing is, fifty years ago, his skin colour would have completely precluded him from being elected president, or even using the same drinking fountains as other citizens of his country (in some parts of said country, anyway). People of his skin colour were lynched for wanting to go to schools that contained kids with other skin colour.

The important thing is not that he is black, but that the USA has changed so much in fifty years. When I was in high school, Jesse Jackson was attempting to run for president, and we dismissed the idea as laughable- everyone "knew" that the USA was too racist to elect a black man as president, and didn't expect that to change.

We were wrong, and I tip my hat to the country.

And I tip my hat to you. Everything I wanted to say.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Why are whites so hell-bent on totally disassociating themselves genetically from Obama by repeatedly and invariably referring to him as black and an Afro American?

The same way you are hell-bent on disassociating yourself from poor Articulette by repeatedly and invariably referring to her as a girl and a woman.

We recently went through the Civil Rights years in English class. It was appalling, as appalling as when we went through it in my school in Houston. I simply cannot understand the hate behind it. Racism, I get. Burning down someone's house or killing them, less so.

I am so incredibly happy we're past that stage now, and I'm saddened by the fact that the people of old - racists and civil rights supporters alike, cannot be somehow teleported here to see this. Martin Luther King Jr. would've been particularly thrilled.

 

[Radrook]

Happy Days. The broken clock theory working its magic. I'm sure there is something else to agree on.

To the op:

I'd like to see where this disassociation idea is coming from.

The disassociation idea is coming from the observation that his white ancestry is being totally ignored. It's not just Obama. American whites do the same to anyone else who is half white and half black, They completely reject the whiteness and classify the person as totally black. If that's not disassociation-then what is it? Association? To be honest, such an attitude comes across as racist. A type of snobbery to be exact. It also harkens back to the time that one drop of black blood could get you thrown into chains.

People are rallying around the fact he's the first person who's even half black becoming president and it's a great thing. For a bunch of whites to come and argue he's not black enough is just a buzzkill.

I didn't say it isn't a great thing and I didn't say people aren't rallying around him, Neither did I say they shouldn't.

BTW
I don't know what you mean by "buzz kill." Do you mean kill the buzz about his being all black and no white?

Other whites who don't like that he's black are in the minority, which would make your blanketing of whites wrong.

I didn't say that all whites or that the majority of whites are offended because he is
colored. What I clearly stated is what I wrote. Read it again please.

BTW
I would appreciate that you stop creating strawman arguments.

Of course, I might not understand what the OP is all about, but that would be my thoughts.

The OP is about what it says it's about. What do you think it's really about?

 

[quarky]

Perhaps people are less comfortable with the notion of mixed race than they are with black.
Could be subtle racism. Obama's genetics imply that a black man had sex with a white woman, which could be more troubling to racists than just black.

I get your point, I think, and I somewhat wish we were willing to refer to him as the mix he is. If we have a blacker president, Obama's name will end up having an asterix, as per the first black president.

 

[GeeMack]

The disassociation idea is coming from the observation that his white ancestry is being totally ignored.

Obviously his ancestry isn't being completely ignored. Darn near everyone, even you, who admit to being woefully uninformed about the details surrounding this election, are aware of it. So to put it as succinctly as possible, you're wrong.

The OP is about what it says it's about. What do you think it's really about?

Maybe it's about a strawman you've constructed?

 

[Radrook]

Obviously his ancestry isn't being completely ignored. Darn near everyone, even you, who admit to being woefully uninformed about the details surrounding this election, are aware of it. So to put it as succinctly as possible, you're wrong.




Maybe it's about a strawman you've constructed?

Maybe it was a mistake for me to post this question. You have my apologies.

 

[Flo]

The disassociation idea is coming from the observation that his white ancestry is being totally ignored. It's not just Obama. American whites do the same to anyone else who is half white and half black, They completely reject the whiteness and classify the person as totally black. If that's not disassociation-then what is it? Association? To be honest, such an attitude comes across as racist. A type of snobbery to be exact. It also harkens back to the time that one drop of black blood could get you thrown into chains.

It isn't particular to the USA. The same goes in most countries (including Africa) for any mixed individual: here in France and Switzerland, I am referred as black, even though my mother is white and I'm relatively light-skinned (although racists who know me and my family personnally will go out of their way to tell me that they haven't got anything against me personnally since I'm light-skinned, my mom is white, and I've been living here all my life ). Africans will either call me, derogatively, white whenever I will not indulge in Europe/USA/Jews bashing, or black when they want to enroll me in something (or borrow money).

The main reason why I'm sure there's no difference between various populations and skin colors is the absolutely similar distribution of stupidity ...

 

[gdnp]

Barack Obama's ancestry and upbringing have been more thoroughly discussed than any other Presidential candidate in recent history. I have heard about his parents and grandparents on both sides, his grandmother, his aunt in Boston, his half sisters. How much do you know about McCain's ancestry in compariston? Kerry or Gore? Not a whole lot.

We think of Obama as black because he looks black and has identified with the black community: he married a black woman. At the same time, I suspect a large majority of the population knows that his mother's side of the family is white.

I guess it comes down to race being more than a genetic thing. It has strong cultural components. This is not unique to the black community. Judaism is both a religion and a culture--there are secular Jews and Jews that have converted to Christianity who are still racially and/or culturally "Jewish". At least the Nazis thought so.

So let me know whether you think Tiger Woods is black, and why we aren't having the same discussion about him.

 

[quarky]

Never mind Tiger, what's Michael Jackson?

 

[slingblade]

Disturbed.