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What Penn and Teller Do

Kiless

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I'm prompted to do this because of a rather good question:

'Are Penn and Teller merely entertainers?'

And what sources would you cite to indicate otherwise? If indeed, you thought they were more than entertainers?

I have on another computer, several essays by Penn that illustrate more than just a whimsical 'bad boy' comedian, I know of the Cato institute and will go poking around there today to see what they have to say directly about the pair; I collect the 'Bull&*^t' DVDs and watch them, I've been to TAM3 and heard them speak..... where else would one go if you were indeed, thinking of demonstrating their contributions beyond sheer entertainment? I know that their books 'Play With Food', et al, are also excellent in demonstrating the thinking behind what they do. I'm also considering citing their videos too.... ah, their movie is a good one too, I think.
 
I'm utterly ashamed to admit it, but I've never seen any of Penn and Teller's acts, movies, etc. Never.

OTOH, I didn't know anything much about them until I came here to JREF, so now I have no real excuse. :D
 
jmercer said:
I'm utterly ashamed to admit it, but I've never seen any of Penn and Teller's acts, movies, etc. Never.

OTOH, I didn't know anything much about them until I came here to JREF, so now I have no real excuse. :D
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Cool! Then this'll be good for you too! :)
 
"Is Kiless merely a teacher?"

Yes, P&T are entertainers. Technically, so is Randi, even though he rarely performs anymore.

But are they interested in social issues? Yes. What they have to say goes beyond who they are or who they know.

I have seen some specials by P&T and they were both thoroughly entertaining. They 'showed' how they did the tricks, which was cool. I think they had a thing about critical thinking from the beginning. "See! We're fooling you! We just did. And others can, too. SO WAKE UP!"


Just my thoughts.
 
Last thing of theirs I saw was the "Magical Mystery Tour" which was them going around the world and showing different types of magic....and then shots of them in the hotel room complaining about the food. :p

We've known about them forever, but I have yet to see a Bull---- episode. :(
 
clarsct said:
"Is Kiless merely a teacher?"

Yes, P&T are entertainers. Technically, so is Randi, even though he rarely performs anymore.

But are they interested in social issues? Yes. What they have to say goes beyond who they are or who they know.

I have seen some specials by P&T and they were both thoroughly entertaining. They 'showed' how they did the tricks, which was cool. I think they had a thing about critical thinking from the beginning. "See! We're fooling you! We just did. And others can, too. SO WAKE UP!"


Just my thoughts.
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Yeah, that's my thought. I'm trying to see if I can find some definite resources, however. I should go dig out my articles and find the resulting links to them online, for a start.
 
Well, can you cite where you're more than just a teacher?



I'm not sure what you're asking for here....
 
clarsct said:
Well, can you cite where you're more than just a teacher?

I'm not sure what you're asking for here....
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ARgh! It's not about ME, it's about Penn and Teller! :)

What contributions have they made to society beyond sheer entertainment value, in your mind? If the claim is 'they're just comedians / entertainers', then is that all that can be said? Or even, that they are not even reasonably qualified, in fact, to challenge people's thinking? Should possibly stay out anything that isn't for only entertainment value? Seems like a firm statement to me.

I'll go get my links for the next time I post, in my defence against this claim.
 
Kilted_Canuck said:
Last thing of theirs I saw was the "Magical Mystery Tour" which was them going around the world and showing different types of magic....and then shots of them in the hotel room complaining about the food. :p

We've known about them forever, but I have yet to see a Bull---- episode. :(
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LOL! I'd like to see that, Teller wrote a bit about it on their site, I believe. Not seen BS? Oh, come on, you really should! :(
 
Kiless said:
ARgh! It's not about ME, it's about Penn and Teller! :)


AHHH, yes. But by turning the question back on you, I am making you think. *BIGGRIN* And that is what >I< do.

What contributions have they made to society beyond sheer entertainment value, in your mind? If the claim is 'they're just comedians / entertainers', then is that all that can be said? Or even, that they are not even reasonably qualified, in fact, to challenge people's thinking? Should possibly stay out anything that isn't for only entertainment value? Seems like a firm statement to me.

I'll go get my links for the next time I post, in my defence against this claim.
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Well, how does one get 'qualified' to challenge people's thinking? Is there a course? Were Socrates and Thomas Paine 'qualified'?

Sound slike an elitist argument to me. 'Why should be believe P&T? They're JUST Entertainers....'

With a sneer on that last word. It dismisses them without having to answer their arguments. Have you had problems with someone who has been using a variant on the above?

Anyone can and ought to challenge thought. Ideas should not become sacred cows.

At the very least, I would point to the 'poisoning the well' fallacy.
 
My opinion, but I know that if it weren't for Penn and Teller, I'd never be here and I would still think that man didn't really land on the moon. (not from their episode about it), but from the first season, where I wanted to know what this "Amazing Randi" was all about.

Bullsh** is an amazing show. It's died down a bit, admittedly, but it took to the front a lot of things I had been mulling over, and after careful research, they were (for the most part) right.

I always liked P&T... They made magic fun for a kid who got sick of David Copperfield and the ilk... Penn also was the voice of the early Comedy Central (which helped me get into MST3K, thank whomever...)

In any case, I feel that Penn & Teller are doing a fine job of bringing skeptecism to the masses, if even in a beat-you-over-the-head way... It gets the job done, and for me, it really helped a guy out... Thanks, guys...
 
clarsct said:
Yes, P&T are entertainers. Technically, so is Randi, even though he rarely performs anymore.
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But the question was "'Are Penn and Teller merely entertainers?"

Is it your position that anyone who is, or ever has been, an entertainer will always be "merely" an entertainer?

Paul Winchell (the ventriloquist) was an entertainer. He was also an inventer who held several dozen patents including a patent for one of the first artifical hearts. Ronald Reagan was an entertainer who was also elected president. There's a long list of entertainers who went on to be many other things.

Are they all to be known as just entertainers? And even if they are, why should they be known as entertainers and not as whatever else they've been in addition?
 
Why do you say 'mere' entertainers?
Lots of people can do magic tricks well (or play guitar, or sing, or dance), but very few people can make all the right moves to reach and keep an international audience.

Even among magicians, P&T were standouts... with their wry 'spin' on the traditional conjurer and assistant cliche.

To then parlay that into the skeptical and critical thinking venues they have popularized takes them well out of the realm of 'mere' anything.

I mean other than being a mere writer, did Asimov ever do anything?:p
 
Penn & Teller are the type of guys that always have some kinda gag going. I don't doubt that when they go home at night they probably quiet down & all but the rest of the time they are nut cases.

I think they are awesome. They are really clever guys. My heroes, really. :)
 
P & T Lead me here. I caught an episode of BS, the one about offensive language, and then bought the first season. Watched the interview with Randi, and here I am.
 
Wow. I had no idea so many people were here because of P&T.

I bought the first season of BS because I heard about it here.

I just recently bought the second season.
 
I guess that was kind of the point of the show.. reach out to people who wouldn't otherwise find this society.
 
Perhaps one thing to site that would indicate otherwise is the amount of people they brought over here (myself included.) I was always a P&T fan, unfortunately, I never got to see too much of there stuff before I went to Vegas and caught their show. They brought my wife on stage so we became big fans of theirs.

I also dislike the argument of dismissing them because of their being entertainers rather than on the content of their message. I think the most important thing they've done is to challenge many things that no other single show will touch. I've seen a few posters here dismiss them because they think they are "blinded by their ideology" because they're libertarians. Even if it's true that they are biased (which they freely admit) name one other show that has made as many controversial episodes and at least challenged some of these quacks and frauds (have only watched one "Mythbusters" but I don't think they delve as much into psuedoscience, could be wrong though.) Anyway, I love the show and am very glad that I came to this site through them which in turn turned me on to Snopes, Quackwatch, Bad Astronomer, etc... which have all been a source of very good information and entertainment.
 
I wonder what was up with the episode with hair. Were they running out of ideas or needed an episode filler?

I don't trust P&T 100%, they actually make me skeptical about skepticism sometimes :D.
 
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