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Wages For Housework

I still want to know who's supposed to pay these wages.

Also, what happens once you account for benefits like company housing, company car, meals 100% expensed by the company, and many other benefits of the arrangement?

OR

What if the homemaker doesn't see themselves as a transactional wage slave, in need of a minimum hourly wage, paid breaks, overtime, etc? What if they see themselves as a joint owner/operator with their partner, the two of them keeping the concern going and taking out what profits they can where they can?

We gonna start paying the small business owner a wage for wiping down the surfaces and sweeping the floor after closing up every night?

We gonna start paying the restaurateur overtime, because running the restaurant day to day is a full time job, and managing the business is another full time job, and he sits up half the night settling with suppliers, balancing the budget, and planning cost-effective menus?


That said, it might be fun to try, just to skewer the shambolic corpse of gender role stereotypes.

Put a man in the army, see how quickly it's revealed that men can clean up after themselves just fine. Personally, I take it as a point of pride that there's no piece of housework I cannot, nor should not do, as a man.
 
The question would not have to be asked if workers had been paid according to their increased productivity, instead of having their wages stolen.
 
Thermal said:
Do housewives/homemakers do their cleaning and all as a service to their man (who largely might not care or even notice), or because it's in her personal interests, creating a reflection of high standards, and a source of personal pride? If the latter, does the man get paid for going to the gym? Or to the bar ro socialize, and other activities that reflect his standing in the community?
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Its sanitary? It maintains health? A properly maintained household is a benefit to the community?
 
theprestige said:
Put a man in the army, see how quickly it's revealed that men can clean up after themselves just fine. Personally, I take it as a point of pride that there's no piece of housework I cannot, nor should not do, as a man.
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I would point out that your time in the military is scheduled and your wardrobe and meals are selected for you.
 
The concept of free money from the government is a sweet deal.
Everyone wants some.

Except nobody wants thier demographic to be the one paying in to cover it.
Not even in indirect ways.

It has to fail until some idiot agrees to cover it for everyone.
 
Donal said:
I would point out that your time in the military is scheduled and your wardrobe and meals are selected for you.
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I've been in the military. After basic training, it's not as much like that as you think. And soldiers are very much expected to clean up after themselves and keep their quarters neat and tidy. They're also expected to do their own laundry. All the usual housework. And not on any schedule, either, but in their free time between other obligations. Just like any other responsible adult.

About the most significant factor, which you overlooked, is that their quarters are subject to inspection, and they face real consequences if they shirk. Which, there should be something similar in a loving partnership between responsible adults, but a lot of times there isn't. That's not because men are incapable of doing their own housework, though.
 
Thanks prestige for supporting me in calling for the abolishing of the "nuclear family" for a communal union to does chores and raise children
 
This is an unrealistic idea.

However, I do support a substantial increase in the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC). I would raise the income threshold for the EITC to $60K and would triple the EITC on a sliding scale based on income. A person making $59K would get a smaller EITC payment than a person making $30K, but both would get a payment included in their tax refund.
 
theprestige said:
Haha oh wow. I had no idea you had gone as far as denying the nuclear family.
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you praised the military model of everyone being trained to do all tasks of housework and doing them as needed - not the Nuclear family at all.

of course, the Nuclear Family is based on the model of the Victorian, or even Roman, Household of Husband, Wife, Children .. and a truckload of servants/slaves. It was never meant to apply to anyone but the top 5% of society, and it is putting unreasonable pressure on most families with no access to domestic help trying to emulate it.
 
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The Great Zaganza said:
you praised the military model of everyone being trained to do all tasks of housework and doing them as needed - not the Nuclear family at all.

of course, the Nuclear Family is based on the model of the Victorian, or even Roman, Household of Husband, Wife, Children .. and a truckload of servants/slaves. It was never meant to apply to anyone but the top 5% of society, and it is putting unreasonable pressure on most families with no access to domestic help trying to emulate it.
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Wasn't the more standard model to have 2 or 3 generations living together, or at least in proximity?
 
Donal said:
Wasn't the more standard model to have 2 or 3 generations living together, or at least in proximity?
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It seems to be so today. When my whelps were little, the grandmother and other family members stepped up regularly to help, and we did so for brothers' and sisters' families. Still do. They call me first if they have problems with their houses. We rotate putting up the kids in college when sessions are out. Our nephew stayed with us during college breaks. But I'd still consider us a nuclear model family, just not this isolationist one that seems implied.

Eta: if the nuke model was originally for the wealthy... well, by their standards, aren't we all kind of wealthy now? We have more technology and comforts, and don't starve in gutters. A couple generations ago, a man could support his family on one normal income with a stay at home wife and send his kids to college. That's been torqued a little lately, but in terms of simple housekeeping, it still works.
 
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The Great Zaganza said:
you praised the military model of everyone being trained to do all tasks of housework and doing them as needed - not the Nuclear family at all.
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No. As an aside, I pointed out that men are perfectly capable of doing housework, and gave an example of a context in which it is entirely commonplace. You invented a whole treatise on re-ordering society that was never there.
 
I'll proudly say I can make a toilet bowl sparkle, scrub a broiler pan till it looks new, and edge a crisp neat line on the grass. Been doing my own laundry since i was a teen. Oddly, I have no slaves and even have plenty of extra time to catch a show on Netflix or post on the ISF. Housework just ain't a big deal.
 
Thermal said:
I'll proudly say I can make a toilet bowl sparkle, scrub a broiler pan till it looks new, and edge a crisp neat line on the grass. Been doing my own laundry since i was a teen. Oddly, I have no slaves and even have plenty of extra time to catch a show on Netflix or post on the ISF. Housework just ain't a big deal.
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This. Just do it. No financial compensation required or justified.
 
It occurs to me that the idea of wages for housework comes from a time of much greater inequality between the sexes, in terms of autonomy and individual worth. Feminists and others pushed the idea, as a way to wake people up to the "work that women do". In that context, wages for housework probably wouldn't help much. Women would still be second-class citizens, relegated to homemaking, while the man of the house held down a job, exercised power and authority in society, etc. Most likely, the wage would go into his pocket, and effectively be a live-in maid allowance for married men.

Nowadays, we've elected to solve the problem by recognizing women as equal citizens, who can pick and choose their own careers, and are no more deserving of a housework wage than bachelors are. At this point, wages for housework would be regressive and nonsensical.
 
thepresitge is right. We should skip the pretense and filtering and just go with a UBI
 
Do not obey in advance. Don't do housework without your wife asking.
 
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