User dissatisfied with Mozilla

[Iconoclast]

IE is only in its overarching position because it comes embedded into Windows (so much so now that I believe it's unremovable).

That's correct, the Windows Desktop is an instance of IE.

 

[wayrad]

I've been running Mozilla 1.4 for about 3 weeks on my Windows XP system without crashing problems (except once when I had my mail account set up wrong - creating a new profile fixed it). There have been a few minor weirdnesses, but I was able to get help quickly in the user forums. Have you tried MozillaNews or MozillaZine?

 

[shanek]

Me, I like cheap and simple. Mozilla never, ever crashes on me. Not once. Three different computers (win 2K or later), no problem. I would suspect you have some lousy plug-in stuck in it that's causing the problems. Of course, I don't leave things animating, or allow flash plug-ins, and map ad servers to localhost in my hosts file, even though I have a broadband connection. That eliminates 90+% of the garbage that might cause problems for me.

Every time Mozilla has purportedly crashed on me, it's actually been Java that's crashed. Java 1.4.1 seems to be better about this, but still it may be an idea just to not install Java and not have to deal with the pages that run it.

 

[shanek]

That's correct, the Windows Desktop is an instance of IE.

Only if you're running Active Desktop. Turn off Active Desktop in the Display settings and a lot of your Windows problems will just go away!

 

[Iconoclast]

Only if you're running Active Desktop. Turn off Active Desktop in the Display settings and a lot of your Windows problems will just go away!

I could be wrong, but I thought the Desktop was still an IE instance, even with Activew Desktop switched off. I'd have to check my MSDN, but I thought AD was simply a "mode" of the WebControl ActiveX object. In any case, when I used to run Win98SE, whenever my Browser crashed it took the desktop with it.

And speaking of which, did anyone ever actually download and use an Active Desktop item from another web site, say a Stock Ticker? I never have and I can't say anyone I've met ever has either, it all seemed to me like a solution waiting for a problem.

 

[uneasy]

The "desired action" of the bank software was to pop up a sub-window with some handy-dandy stuff in it (stuff I WANTED to see!). IE allowed that to happen, but Firebird simply "did nothing", no error messages. This is how it silently blots out popups anyway, hence my suspicion this is the case.

Incidentally, not only did IE pop up my bank window, it also popped up a dozen or more [casino|prescription|prize-draw|scam] windows as well. *sigh* It never rains but it pours....

More from the Uneasy Mozilla Help desk...

If a web site feature doesn't work because it wants a popup, in Mozilla/Firebird settings you can add specific web sites to allow popups. This has fixed this problem for me. I've gotten Mozilla/Firebird to work for everything (unless the site blocks me by browser type).

And Paltalk. I just didn't feel like trying that day, so I used IE like it wanted.

 

[arcticpenguin]

I know at least one site that uses Javascript (or maybe it's Java, I don't really know) that does not work properly with Mozilla, but does work with MozillaFirebird.

 

[Psi Baba]

The "desired action" of the bank software was to pop up a sub-window with some handy-dandy stuff in it (stuff I WANTED to see!). IE allowed that to happen, but Firebird simply "did nothing", no error messages. This is how it silently blots out popups anyway, hence my suspicion this is the case.

Incidentally, not only did IE pop up my bank window, it also popped up a dozen or more [casino|prescription|prize-draw|scam] windows as well. *sigh* It never rains but it pours....

Opera 7 offers four different preference settings for pop-ups:
1) Accept pop-ups
2) Refuse pop-ups
3) Open pop-up windows in background
4) Open requested pop-up windows only.

I always use option 4. That means that if you click on a link that is javascripted to open a pop-up window, it will work. The ones that would normally pop up without your consent are blocked.

 

[ChrisH]

Firebird is good, but Opera is excellent. MSIE is grossly over-weight, and has serious rendering problems.

Opera 7.20, fully-featured download is 3.2Mb
Firebird is over 6Mb.
MSIE is somewhere over 86 Mb! It contains old Mosaic code long abandoned by the other main browser manufacturers and is a constant source of problems for desigers trying to write standards-compliant sites. ..

Development has ceased on MSIE - what you have now is what you'll be using for years to come, I'm afraid.

 

[Occasional Chemist]

(

Opera 7 offers four different preference settings for pop-ups:
1) Accept pop-ups
2) Refuse pop-ups
3) Open pop-up windows in background
4) Open requested pop-up windows only.

I always use option 4. That means that if you click on a link that is javascripted to open a pop-up window, it will work. The ones that would normally pop up without your consent are blocked.

Mozilla's popup blocking seems to be functionally equivalent to 4 above. It's called "Block unrequested pop-up windows".

I still have trouble with one particular application with Mozilla (and Opera, last time I tried it) - Microsoft's Outlook Web Access. I'm not surprised in the slightest that it doesn't play nice with other browsers.

(The solution under Mozilla is to add the OWA server to the sites that are allowed to pop up unrequested windows. I didn't test Opera any further, as Mozilla suits my needs fine otherwise.)

 

[Zep]

Firebird is good, but Opera is excellent. MSIE is grossly over-weight, and has serious rendering problems.

Opera 7.20, fully-featured download is 3.2Mb
Firebird is over 6Mb.
MSIE is somewhere over 86 Mb! It contains old Mosaic code long abandoned by the other main browser manufacturers and is a constant source of problems for desigers trying to write standards-compliant sites. ..

Development has ceased on MSIE - what you have now is what you'll be using for years to come, I'm afraid.

I agree - Opera is a very good product, and I actually used it for some time. The problem for me personally came when Opera started to sell it rather than free download and use other methods of income generation (yes, I understand all the development has to be paid for).

Not that Opera was expensive, just that the alternatives were free, and worked almost as well.

And I'm a reknown skinflint...I admit it!

 

[shanek]

I could be wrong, but I thought the Desktop was still an IE instance, even with Activew Desktop switched off. I'd have to check my MSDN, but I thought AD was simply a "mode" of the WebControl ActiveX object. In any case, when I used to run Win98SE, whenever my Browser crashed it took the desktop with it.

That's because the desktop and the browser both depend on explorer.exe, so if one of them crashes it takes the other (along with everything else in explorer.exe) along with it.

it all seemed to me like a solution waiting for a problem.

Actually, it was Microsoft "proving" that the browser was integrated with the desktop.

 

[shanek]

I always use option 4. That means that if you click on a link that is javascripted to open a pop-up window, it will work. The ones that would normally pop up without your consent are blocked.

That's Mozilla's operating standard. It always opens popups that you request directly. I don't think there's any way you can turn that off in Mozilla.

 

[shanek]

Re: (

Mozilla's popup blocking seems to be functionally equivalent to 4 above. It's called "Block unrequested pop-up windows".

I still have trouble with one particular application with Mozilla (and Opera, last time I tried it) - Microsoft's Outlook Web Access. I'm not surprised in the slightest that it doesn't play nice with other browsers.

(The solution under Mozilla is to add the OWA server to the sites that are allowed to pop up unrequested windows. I didn't test Opera any further, as Mozilla suits my needs fine otherwise.)

It's just the way the web page was written. Instead of a direct popup, it triggers an event which runs a script which calls another script which pops up the link, and by the time it goes through all of that Mozilla has lost track of the fact that you actually asked for it.

 

[Segnosaur]

And remember: IE is the original alternative browser. Netscape/Mozilla was the monopolistic monster once upon a time, but due to lack of innovation, they lost market share until finally this one-time monopoly was completely marginalized by the now-superior IE.

Although I do believe IE has currently won the browser war, I don't agree with your reasons...

When IE started to take market share from Netscape, IE was considered inferior; they basically started getting users by packaging IE with Windows, and doing their best to prevent Netscape from having their software given by manufacturers.

Now, I don't know whether netscape would have fallen behind IE had they retained their market share. However, its not easy to spend money improving products when you're frozen out of markets.

 

[NoZed Avenger]

Although I do believe IE has currently won the browser war, I don't agree with your reasons...

When IE started to take market share from Netscape, IE was considered inferior; they basically started getting users by packaging IE with Windows, and doing their best to prevent Netscape from having their software given by manufacturers.

Now, I don't know whether netscape would have fallen behind IE had they retained their market share. However, its not easy to spend money improving products when you're frozen out of markets.

I believe that this had an effect. It also seems that in every field, MS put out a so-so product and then simply emulated the functionality of the primary competitor until they finally overtook them. Word vs. WordPerfect, Excel, IE, plus a few other examples. (Windows itself, perhaps?)

Word was far inferior to WordPerfect (IMO) until approximately 1997 - when they ended up having almost the precise same functionality. Similarly, Netscape was far superior to ie until somewhere around v4 or 5 -- when ie ended up looking a little like Netscape.

So the competition innovates and MS sits back and simply picks the things that people like and then emulates the function -- not copying the code or anything like that, but simply adding in the function that they let the competitor work out first.

Conservative, but designed for long-term expansion -- much like a large python that takes its time in coiling around a faster competitor. If they were a stand-alone company putting out just a browser, they probably could not survive that way. But MS has the real advantage of bundling their software as noted above. Over the course of 10-15 years, with their OS and money to prop the programs up short term, how can they lose?

N/A

 

[Cain]

I used to use Opera (with a cracked registration key to avoid that banner) but it loaded images too slowly. Someone suggested Mozilla and I finally switched. The mouse gestures for Mozilla probably aren't as good as Opera, but it works for me. It's also blazing fast and never ever crashes. Finally, I forget the correct term, but I like how you can search websites in the address bar. So, for instance, if I want to find something on google, I type "g find something" in the address bar and it tracks it down. Going to Google's website and then typing "find something" is a real chore. It's sort of like having a watch that tells both NY and LA time so I'm not burdened with adding three. I type "e find something" and it searches www.everything2.com/ Opera had a similar feature but it wasn't customizable after one of their silly updates. I hated those updates.

 

[shanek]

I used to use Opera (with a cracked registration key to avoid that banner) but it loaded images too slowly. Someone suggested Mozilla and I finally switched. The mouse gestures for Mozilla probably aren't as good as Opera, but it works for me. It's also blazing fast and never ever crashes. Finally, I forget the correct term, but I like how you can search websites in the address bar. So, for instance, if I want to find something on google, I type "g find something" in the address bar and it tracks it down. Going to Google's website and then typing "find something" is a real chore. It's sort of like having a watch that tells both NY and LA time so I'm not burdened with adding three. I type "e find something" and it searches www.everything2.com/ Opera had a similar feature but it wasn't customizable after one of their silly updates. I hated those updates.

I have a similar thing I do in Moz as well. Make a bookmark to this link:

http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=%s

The link itself won't do anything special. But make a bookmark to it, call it whatever you want, and in the Keyword field type: "lookup" (sans quotes).

Now, just go into your address bar and type "lookup antidisestablishmentarianism" or whatever word you like (again, sans quotes) and you will automatically be taken to the dictionary.com definition for that word.

Mozilla replaces the "%s" with the argument you put in the address bar. It'll work with any URL you like, and your argument can even have spaces (e.g., "lookup a priori" gives you the definition for "a priori").

 

[Cain]

Exactly. Dictionary.com is bookmarked for me too. But the whole purpose of keyword searches is to make the word really short. A person should use "d" instead of typing out "lookup."

"d antidisestablishmentarianism" (searches dictionary.com)

"e antidisestablishmentarianism" (searches everything2.com)

"g antidisestablishmentarianism" (searches google)

Or any popular site: amazon, imdb, ebay.

It's incredible how MS has completely failed to incorporate this handy feature into IE. Well, IE can do this... but it's difficult.