Cont: The Trials of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito: Part 27

[acbytesla]

You've done it again. Rather than admit that Marriott (or anyone else) did not charter that fight for Knox, you dance around it by claiming that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people, therefore the case has not been proven."
This was a freaking 747, not a small charter jet. Once again, as already stated and cited, a BA employee used his or her employee privileges to secure the seats. Or do you now want to argue that those privileges included chartering an entire 747? Stop embarrassing yourself with this stupidity.

As I and everyone else on this thread knows, you simply will not admit you were wrong.

It's dumber than that. This is a scheduled daily flight. Flight 49 flies every day between Heathrow and Seatac. Also flight 553 flies every day between Rome and London. And this is the day after Amanda had been acquitted. Does anyone with a brain thinks they canceled a flight with 400 plus people sometime in the previous 20 hours so 8 people could fly home to Seattle on a massive jet? Oh and a flight out of Rome with a similar number of people. Imagine needlessly inconveniencing 700 people? Why didn't we hear about that? Also, how did the reporters book the flight on their charter?

Vixen's logic on this is embarrassing. Charting an appropriate jet for 10 people to fly from Rome to Seattle would cost about $30,000. Probably a little less. Whereas the airborne operating cost per hour on a 747 is a hair less than that. Flight time between London and Seattle is about 10 hours so figure $280,000. Marriott might be generous with his money but I doubt he is stupid.

 

[LondonJohn]

You've done it again. Rather than admit that Marriott (or anyone else) did not charter that fight for Knox, you dance around it by claiming that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people, therefore the case has not been proven."
This was a freaking 747, not a small charter jet. Once again, as already stated and cited, a BA employee used his or her employee privileges to secure the seats. Or do you now want to argue that those privileges included chartering an entire 747? Stop embarrassing yourself with this stupidity.

As I and everyone else on this thread knows, you simply will not admit you were wrong.

Not to mention the fact that Vixen's assertion that "There is no anomaly in a scheduled flight being booked as a chartered flight for a whole party of people" is total and utter bollocks. A scheduled flight is a scheduled flight. If a party of people wishes to effectively occupy the entire aircraft, the only way to do that is to buy every single seat on the (scheduled) aircraft. And even if that happens, it's still not a charter flight. It's a scheduled flight.

And on top of this, Vixen was throwing yet more strawman shade onto the actual issue at hand, which was whether Knox and her family had travelled back from Italy to the US via private charter flight(s). Now, it's proven beyond all doubt that Knox travelled from Rome to London on a scheduled BA flight, and from London to Seattle on another scheduled BA flight (on a wide-body long-haul aircraft). And Knox and her travelling party comprised no more than around 7-8 people. We also know for certain that there were plenty of other (regular, fare-paying) passengers on each flight (including members of the media, who'd either been tipped off, or simply taken an educated guess, as to which flight Knox would be taking from London to Seattle, and there was obviously still seat availability on the flight). So Vixen's (incorrect, fatuous) claim about a scheduled flight becoming a charter if a party books out the entire aircraft is, in itself, a million miles from even applying to the Knox situation - which is, remember, the one about which Vixen had originally made the (incorrect, fatuous) claim about her having taken private charter flights back to Seattle.

It truly is amazing and very instructive that Vixen simply refuses to make a hands-up mea culpa apology when she makes a provably false claim. It's happened so, so many times that it's very far from a chance occurrence. It's always an offhand "soz" or "fair enough", or similar. It's amazing. But very much par for the course, unfortunately.

 

[LondonJohn]

It's dumber than that. This is a scheduled daily flight. Flight 49 flies every day between Heathrow and Seatac. And this is the day after Amanda had been acquitted. Does anyone with a brain thinks they canceled a flight with 400 plus people sometime in the previous 20 hours so 8 people could fly home to Seattle on a massive jet? Oh and a flight out of Rome with a similar number of people. Imagine needlessly inconveniencing 700 people? Why didn't we hear about that? Also, how did the reporters book the flight on their charter?

Vixen's logic on this is embarrassing. Charting an appropriate jet for 10 people to fly from Rome to Seattle would cost about $30,000. Probably a little less. Whereas the airborne operating cost per hour on a 747 is a hair less than that. Flight time between London and Seattle is about 10 hours so figure $280,000. Marriott might be generous with his money but I doubt he is stupid.

Completely correct in all aspects. Vixen is provably wrong - and the very fact that she continues trying to finesse things with ever-increasingly-desperate strawmen is indeed embarrassing (but oh so telling).

As you point out, BA049 flies once daily from London to Seattle. I think there may be only one other daily non-stop flight from LHR to Seattle: a Virgin/Delta (codeshare) flight. So for media organisations seeking to place reporters on the flight taking Knox and her family back to Seattle from London, they only had a choice of two. Plus, since they knew that Knox had flown BA from Rome to London, chances already were that Knox would be taking the BA connection from London to Seattle. And that's even before taking into account the (very real) possibility that certain media organisations might have been tipped off (possibly by members of BA staff) about the flight Knox was taking from LHR to SEA.

All that the media organisations had to do - and exactly what they DID do - was buy tickets for their reporters on that BA flight (and since the flight was clearly not fully-booked several hours before departure, they were indeed able to book seats, albeit probably at a relatively high price). Their hope, clearly, was that they'd be able to approach Knox on board the aircraft mid-flight, with the aim of getting some form of exclusive report (hopefully including some element of direct conversation with Knox herself, and/or her close family). Knox and her family, understandably, simply did not want any harassment from those reporters on the aircraft, and in addition it's very likely that the cabin crew did not want the flight disrupted by reporters trying to get to Knox repeatedly. And that is precisely why the airline decided to place Knox and her family on the upper deck, and then to control access to that top deck: it allowed Knox and her family privacy from those hungry reporters aboard the flight, plus it also afforded the other passengers the maximum peace and quiet.

It's hard to point out how many flavours of wrong Vixen is on this issue, and how many times she's desperately tried to move the goalposts.

 

[LondonJohn]

Are we speaking a different language? What does 'fair enough' mean in US parlance?

In England, it is akin to committing harakiri on national tv.

What on Earth are you talking about? Saying "fair enough" simply is not a frank and fulsome admittance of a mistake in England (or, for that matter, in any English-speaking country). Rather, it's a weasel form of semi-apology. And you know that full well, of course.

In England, Vixen, a proper apology consists of words such as: "Sorry, I was wrong". You know that full well also, of course.

 

[Stacyhs]

Once again, Vixen provides the entertainment that keeps pulling us all back here.

 

[acbytesla]

Once again, Vixen provides the entertainment that keeps pulling us all back here.

Its amazing. Its not like this is even remotely relevant to the case. Just for a moment, imagine if British Airways bumped 700 plus people at the last minute so Amanda could fly home on an empty 747? Public Relations disaster.

Just the fact that Vixen won't admit to this, demonstrates her bizarre thinking in this case.

 

[Stacyhs]

Its amazing. Its not like this is even remotely relevant to the case. Just for a moment, imagine if British Airways bumped 700 plus people at the last minute so Amanda could fly home on an empty 747? Public Relations disaster.

Just the fact that Vixen won't admit to this, demonstrates her bizarre thinking in this case.

I don't think Vixen actually believes (any longer) that it was a chartered flight. She just won't admit it. Nor will she correct...cough...anyone else who makes that false claim.

 

[acbytesla]

Completely correct in all aspects. Vixen is provably wrong - and the very fact that she continues trying to finesse things with ever-increasingly-desperate strawmen is indeed embarrassing (but oh so telling).

As you point out, BA049 flies once daily from London to Seattle. I think there may be only one other daily non-stop flight from LHR to Seattle: a Virgin/Delta (codeshare) flight. So for media organisations seeking to place reporters on the flight taking Knox and her family back to Seattle from London, they only had a choice of two. Plus, since they knew that Knox had flown BA from Rome to London, chances already were that Knox would be taking the BA connection from London to Seattle. And that's even before taking into account the (very real) possibility that certain media organisations might have been tipped off (possibly by members of BA staff) about the flight Knox was taking from LHR to SEA.

All that the media organisations had to do - and exactly what they DID do - was buy tickets for their reporters on that BA flight (and since the flight was clearly not fully-booked several hours before departure, they were indeed able to book seats, albeit probably at a relatively high price). Their hope, clearly, was that they'd be able to approach Knox on board the aircraft mid-flight, with the aim of getting some form of exclusive report (hopefully including some element of direct conversation with Knox herself, and/or her close family). Knox and her family, understandably, simply did not want any harassment from those reporters on the aircraft, and in addition it's very likely that the cabin crew did not want the flight disrupted by reporters trying to get to Knox repeatedly. And that is precisely why the airline decided to place Knox and her family on the upper deck, and then to control access to that top deck: it allowed Knox and her family privacy from those hungry reporters aboard the flight, plus it also afforded the other passengers the maximum peace and quiet.

It's hard to point out how many flavours of wrong Vixen is on this issue, and how many times she's desperately tried to move the goalposts.

I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.

 

[acbytesla]

I don't think Vixen actually believes (any longer) that it was a chartered flight. She just won't admit it. Nor will she correct...cough...anyone else who makes that false claim.

I don't think she is that stupid either. I hate being wrong too. But by that, I mean just that, 'being wrong. Not admitting I was wrong. I'd be more embarrassed to have people think I'm stupid and I cant imagine anything that would make people think I'm stupid then for me to cling to something that was obviously wrong.

 

[LondonJohn]

I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.

Of course some of the more moronic pro-guilt commentators would try to argue something along the lines of "Why was Knox running scared from reporters? What did she have to hide? Was she afraid of being asked awkward questions that she couldn't answer?" Because they see absolutely everything through the jaded lens of a blanket anti-Knox sentiment. But of course the actions of Knox and her family in avoiding the media are entirely compatible with a factually-innocent Knox. It's perfectly understandable that Knox would just have wanted privacy and relaxation in the company of her family. It's also possible that Knox's family (or someone such as Marriott) had fixed up exclusive access with a particular media outlet or outlets once Knox was back in Seattle - and this would obviously preclude Knox or her family engaging with other media organisations. But that too is wholly compatible with a factually-innocent Knox, of course.

 

[bagels]

I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.

In Perugia, Mignini reflects that no human can climb 10 feet, which halfway around the world causes a helicopter to take flight in Seattle. The butter-fly effect

 

[Stacyhs]

In Perugia, Mignini reflects that no human can climb 10 feet, which halfway around the world causes a helicopter to take flight in Seattle. The butter-fly effect

Don't forget that only a woman would cover the body. Sherlock Holmes he ain't no matter how much he fancies himself to be.

 

[acbytesla]

Of course some of the more moronic pro-guilt commentators would try to argue something along the lines of "Why was Knox running scared from reporters? What did she have to hide? Was she afraid of being asked awkward questions that she couldn't answer?" Because they see absolutely everything through the jaded lens of a blanket anti-Knox sentiment. But of course the actions of Knox and her family in avoiding the media are entirely compatible with a factually-innocent Knox. It's perfectly understandable that Knox would just have wanted privacy and relaxation in the company of her family. It's also possible that Knox's family (or someone such as Marriott) had fixed up exclusive access with a particular media outlet or outlets once Knox was back in Seattle - and this would obviously preclude Knox or her family engaging with other media organisations. But that too is wholly compatible with a factually-innocent Knox, of course.

That the press followed in helicopters is in itself bizarre. The family knew even better than Amanda the absurd lengths the press would go for a story. But my guess, this escape was all Marriott.

 

[Stacyhs]

That the press followed in helicopters is in itself bizarre. The family knew even better than Amanda the absurd lengths the press would go for a story. But my guess, this escape was all Marriott.

I'm surprised Peggy Ganong wasn't hiding in her bushes.

 

[Bill Williams]

I'm surprised Peggy Ganong wasn't hiding in her bushes.

For the sake of clarity.....

Peggy Ganong, moderator of the now defunct PMF.ORG hate site and resident of West Seattle, never hid in the bushes.

She counted shrubs. Drive-by counting of the at the Mellas residence because even as their vicious opponent, she did not want tham spending money on landscaping.

If she'd discovered more, that would be proof of the millions they had to spend.....

Apologies. I'm in that kind of mood.

 

[Stacyhs]

I stand corrected. (Attention Vixen: this is how it's done by someone who isn't insecure.)
But how odd is it that someone would do such a weird thing?

 

[Bill Williams]

I stand corrected. (Attention Vixen: this is how it's done by someone who isn't insecure.)
But how odd is it that someone would do such a weird thing?

I'm citing that from memory and do not have a proper citation, so take it for what it is worth with that in mind. I could very well be wrong, and could very well owe Ms. Ganong an apology.

Attn Vixen: that's how it's done, aka. being transparent about one's sources.

But if true, yes, how odd someone would go out and count shrubs.

 

[LondonJohn]

I'm citing that from memory and do not have a proper citation, so take it for what it is worth with that in mind. I could very well be wrong, and could very well owe Ms. Ganong an apology.

Attn Vixen: that's how it's done, aka. being transparent about one's sources.

But if true, yes, how odd someone would go out and count shrubs.

Haha yes - and so many of the key pro-guilt commentators are unhinged and nasty in that way. Upon my "hold your nose" visit to TJMK the other day to look at the crap being written about the "private charter", I noted disgusting comments from ballerina-botherer Quennell in respect of the demographic of the neighbourhood where Curt Knox now lives. That man (Quennell) truly is a piece of work (and it's a racing certainty that he took himself to Seattle either primarily or purely to check out/harass the Knox and Mellas families). For such a tiny collective, it's quite a collection of nasty, vindictive nutters that the pro-guilt community has amassed.....

 

[Vixen]

What on Earth are you talking about? Saying "fair enough" simply is not a frank and fulsome admittance of a mistake in England (or, for that matter, in any English-speaking country). Rather, it's a weasel form of semi-apology. And you know that full well, of course.

In England, Vixen, a proper apology consists of words such as: "Sorry, I was wrong". You know that full well also, of course.

LOL Anyone would think it was me who was the convicted criminal. It's a pity you don't expect Raff and Knox to apologise to the Kerchers for their heinous and wicked crime against their dearly beloved daughter, sister, niece, cousin, granddaughter, future aunt.

Your morals are all scrambled up.

 

[Vixen]

I loved how almost a dozen reporters were totally shut out. They never got near Amanda on that flight and then didn't get anything here in Seattle. They planned the arrival in Seattle brilliantly. They had 3 white vans leave the airport through a back access road which made it impossible to follow them by car. And believe it or not, the press followed the vans by helicopter and the vans took different routes to West Seattle. And when they showed up in West Seattle, the family was nowhere to be found. I understand that under a freeway overpass they switched cars and that headed to the Vashon Island Ferry.

Living like a refugee, eh.