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Ed The Miracles Continue ...

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Emre_1974tr said:
No, quite the contrary. My List is confirmed.
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That is a bald faced lie and I think you know it.

JayUtah said:
You're just repeating your claims and ignoring the corrections. You don't actually have any intelligent answer for them, do you?
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Clearly Emre_1974tr does not. (S)he has yet to demonstrate an understand of their claims beyond what one would expect of a parrot quoting the same material. (S)he might as well be posting "Polly want a cracker!" Doing so would have no demonstrable negative impact on the quality of their arguments.
 
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Emre_1974tr said:
So;

IN QURAN

the singular “day” (yewm) is mentioned 365 times

Its plural (eyyam, yewmeyn) is used 30 times

The word “a month” (shehr) is also mentioned 12 times.
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This has been repeated numerous times. What is the significance supposed to mean even if it were true (which I doubt)? I am completely at a loss why this could have any importance or relevance to anything.
 
halleyscomet said:
(S)he might as well be posting "Polly want a cracker!" Doing so would have no demonstrable negative impact on the quality of their arguments.
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Indeed. (Emre is a masculine name in Turkish, so I'm sticking with masculine pronouns.) It's sad because he keeps referring to his articles in Turkish. I gather he really does want to be seen as a notable Islamic exegeticist, but the knowledge just isn't there. He seems to be quoting extremist apologetics sites, cargo-cult fashion, without really seeming to understand the arguments they make, and somehow hoping it makes him look wise. His Twitter is frankly sad. It's just a vox clamantis in deserto of tweet-length versions of these same offerings, with little if any feedback.
 
MEequalsIxR said:
What is the significance supposed to mean even if it were true (which I doubt)? I am completely at a loss why this could have any importance or relevance to anything.
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It's supposed to prove the Qur'an is from God. The exact line of reasoning is kind of murky, but the gist of all the OP's contributions in this thread is that the Qur'an either describes or embodies occurrences that have no natural explanation, or were somehow prescient of modern concepts, and could therefore only have a supernatural explanation. It's mostly a lot of hype trying to show that the Qur'an cannot have been simply a product of its known time and place of origin.

Here we're supposed to believe a line of reasoning akin to saying that buying thirty-two candles and arranging them on the birthday cake to spell out the numerals 32 is somehow a feat only a god could accomplish. The number of times the word "day" appears is equal to the number of days in the year.

1. Properly counted in the Qur'an, the number of mentions of some cardinal time measurements roughly correlates to the cardinality itself.
2. ???
3. Therefore, God.

How could it possibly be any clearer? :D
 
Scorpion said:
I am not wrong about the Quran , it is evil lies, and I believe most of what I say that you write off as tosh is the probable truth.

For example, the spirit teach there is no devil and no hellfire, and there will be no judgement day. I think you would agree with all of that, and it entirely contradicts the Quran which claims all these things to be true.
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No problem about the stuff you don't believe in it's the stuff you do believe in that's a worry.

It's always amusing to the atheist however, to sit back and watch theists of different persuasions trade blows.
 
Thank you. I sort of thought that might be the case but then by the time the Koran was written the days/months/year thing was pretty well known even if the calendars in use were legacies still off a little.

Besides, there are actually 365.2422 days usually rounded to 365.25 and that gets into the leap years thing.

The 30 days in a month is a little off as well. But then I suppose it's not likely 0.42 parts of a word would be used.
 
JayUtah said:
(Emre is a masculine name in Turkish, so I'm sticking with masculine pronouns.)
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This is someone who claims James Bond is real and responds to debunking of their claims by repeating their claims and insisting they're always right. This is a person who has dismissed atheist critics as Christian missionaries. I think assuming they chose a male sounding name due to it matching their gender identity is an overly generous assumption.

If Emre_1974tr says they identify as male then I'll use male pronouns. Until then, the poster's history discourages me from making any assumptions.
 
MEequalsIxR said:
This has been repeated numerous times. What is the significance supposed to mean even if it were true (which I doubt)? I am completely at a loss why this could have any importance or relevance to anything.
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In the Quran, the word "day" is 365 times, the word "days" is 30 times, and the word "month" repeats 12 times and does not mean anything to you?

To look at the number of Other word repetations:

http://www.quranmiracles.com/category/mathematics/
 
Emre_1974tr said:
In the Quran, the word "day" is 365 times, the word "days" is 30 times, and the word "month" repeats 12 times and does not mean anything to you?

To look at the number of Other word repetations:

http://www.quranmiracles.com/category/mathematics/
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It means nothing because it is not true. And even if it were true it means nothing.

For example, did you know there are 365 days in every calendar printed on Earth? Except for leap years, when there are 366? Amazing coincidence!
 
Emre_1974tr said:
In the Quran, the word "day" is 365 times, the word "days" is 30 times, and the word "month" repeats 12 times and does not mean anything to you?
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You're begging the question. First, you've been challenged on the facts of these claims, and you don't have the knowledge to refute those challenges. You just keep repeating the debunked claims as if nothing happened. Do you undersatnd how proof works? Do you understand that merely stating something doesn't establish it as true?

Second, how does numerology somehow equate to a miracle? If some human author decided he wanted his book to exhibit this trait, he can just go back and rig his diction to make it true. This is not a miracle any more than acrostic poems are miracles, or the stunt where you make the first letter of each line spell something out. This is the same sort of bibliotheistic idolatry we sometimes see in Christianity, such with the so-called "Bible code." You're hunting for random magical traits, even if you have to fudge the math.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
BLACKHOLES IN QURAN
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No. The Qur'an doesn't talk about black holes. The Qur'an dribbles some pseudo-astronomical gibberish that a commentator has decided "must" refer to black holes and other astronomical phenomena. Then he marvels about how the Qur'an authors could possibly have known about that ahead of time. Hint: they didn't. Please learn the difference between supposition and fact.

Also, you haven't addressed the effective rebuttals of your calendrical numerology. You just repeated your claims over and over. Is this how you convince yourself that you're always right? You just ignore everything that isn't you?
 
Emre_1974tr said:
In the Quran, the word "day" is 365 times, the word "days" is 30 times, and the word "month" repeats 12 times and does not mean anything to you?

To look at the number of Other word repetations:

http://www.quranmiracles.com/category/mathematics/
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No means nothing at all. Might be a coincidence or it might be someone wanted that when they wrote it as JayUtah said in post #1230. Or it could be some liberties were taken to make the numbers come out as presented. How many times does the word for week appear? How many times does the word season pop up? The word for second, minute, or hour?

Besides, the year is NOT 365 days it is (rounded off) 365.25 days and the average month is a little more than 30 days. 30 times 12 is 360 so that leaves 5 extra days to distribute by either an extra month five days long or some months get an extra day.

The Egyptians knew the year was 365 days by the Bronze age and had a calendar fixed to that number and had a later calendar with leap years every four years - the Julian calendar adopted that idea. So the numbers were well know in antiquity and certainly well known among the Arabs who were excellent mathematicians. So no, I see no significance to your numbers whatsoever.

You can use a lunar calendar, or a solar calendar or a lunisolar calendar but the three are not the same and must be corrected to each other or something goes out of sync with something else. There is also a sidereal year which is a little different than the solar year by a few minutes.

How do you explain why these are not all the same? Why is the year not 360 days?
 
Emre_1974tr said:
BLACKHOLES IN QURAN

Quran 56:75- So, I swear by the place where the stars fall.(56- The Inevitable, 75)

http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/black-holesmighty-oath/

[Quran 86.1-3] And the heaven and the "Knocker" (Tarek in Arabic طارق) How could you know about the "Knocker"? The piercing star (Thakeb in Arabic).
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Quran surah 8
8.1 By the heaven and the morning star
8.2 Ah, what will tell you what the morning star is !
8.3 The piercing star !
8.4 No human soul but has a guardian over it.
8.5 So let man consider from what he is created.
8.6 He is created from a gushing fluid.
8.7 That issued from between the loins and the ribs.

Correct me if I am wrong but I think the star that is commonly referred to as the morning star is the planet Jupiter. It is certainly not a black hole, as they are invisible.

Then the surah goes on to show that Muhammad did not know sperm comes from the testicles. He thought it came from between the loins and the ribs.
 
Yea thanks, its Venus not Jupiter. Also I made another mistake calling surah 86 surah 8 in post 1234
But the verses remain the same, and I used the M.M. Pickthall translation.

As for verse 56.75 the Yusuf Ali translation is as follows = ' Furthermore I call to witness the setting of the stars' Nothing about black holes there.
 
Scorpion said:
Quran surah 86
86.1 By the heaven and the morning star
86.2 Ah, what will tell you what the morning star is !
86.3 The piercing star !
86.4 No human soul but has a guardian over it.
86.5 So let man consider from what he is created.
86.6 He is created from a gushing fluid.
86.7 That issued from between the loins and the ribs.
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Since its to late to edit my post I am correcting the quote.
Also the morning star is the planet Venus, not a black hole.
 
Emre_1974tr said:
BLACKHOLES IN QURAN

Quran 56:75- So, I swear by the place where the stars fall.(56- The Inevitable, 75)

http://www.quranmiracles.com/2011/03/black-holesmighty-oath/

[Quran 86.1-3] And the heaven and the "Knocker" (Tarek in Arabic طارق) How could you know about the "Knocker"? The piercing star (Thakeb in Arabic).
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Don't change the subject, Emre.
Guys- don't let him do this.
Emre: you made this ridiculous claim about days,months and years. You can't just run away from it once you realise you're losing the argument. Acknowledge you were wrong, and then we can move on.
 
JayUtah said:
No. You didn't address my argument, you just repeated your wrong belief. You don't actually read Arabic, do you? The article is not a separate word. The article is a prefix. The proto-Semitic article was hal, written as a prefix to the words it applied to. It devolved in Hebrew into ha, and into Arabic as al. The Arabic al-yawm is not two words. It is one word, with an articulated prefix.

But more importantly, al-yawm refers to a different idea. In Arabic (and Hebrew, for that matter, since it uses a parallel construct), it's understood idiomatically to mean what we in English have a word for: "today." There are not 365 todays in a Gregorian year. There is ever only one today. Therefore your insistence that al-yawm should be included in the list of generic references to "day" is as wrong as it can possibly be. In this unique case, the article changes the meaning of the word.

Kindly do not respond to me if you are unable to talk about the actual language and my actual arguments in as much detail as I present them in. I'm not interested in endless recitations of your ignorant edicts.
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Unlike some idiot, I do understand what you're saying and I appreciate it.
I know he doesn't know anything about the Arabic language, and his English is not good enough to come here and debate anything.
He's not at a level in anything to answer you.
 
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