Tavian's experiment

[Quixote]

Did I miss something in the description of Tavian Barnes' science project? It appears that he had only a control group. What exactly was being tested? Certainly not, as his mother's narrative suggested, the gullibility of the general public. Who was taken in, and by what? How was the project related to the placebo effect, homeopathy, or spiritual healing?

He does seem to have demonstrated the wide range of responses that can be elicited by apparently identical stimuli. I say apparently identical because, from the narrative, it appears that the beaker was not rinsed and refilled between subjects. Were later subjects smelling the onions on the earlier subjects' lunchtime burger?

 

[Jeff Corey]

True, technically it was not an experiment, since he did not manipulate an independent variable. It was a demonstration.

Similarly, one of the most famous studies in social psychology - Milgram's (1963) study of obedience to authority- was a demonstration, not an experiment.

 

[Quixote]

But what did he demonstrate? His mother, and apparently his teacher, think he demonstrated the existence of gullible 6th graders. What he actually demonstrated was the need for control groups. He also demonstrated that some 6th grade teachers should not be allowed to teach science without some training in the scientific method.

 

[T'ai Chi]

I believe it to be impressive for a 6th grade student even with the obvious flaws.

 

[Jeff Corey]

But what did he demonstrate? His mother, and apparently his teacher, think he demonstrated the existence of gullible 6th graders. What he actually demonstrated was the need for control groups. He also demonstrated that some 6th grade teachers should not be allowed to teach science without some training in the scientific method.

I think you are being overly critical.

My point was that Milgram, a Ph.D. social psychologist at Yale U. did not have a control condition (in a within-subjects design) nor a control group (in a between groups design). He had a demonstration where, in theory, each participant got exactly the same treatment.

Namely, "Push this button to give dangerous shocks to some poor schmuck in the other room."

Surprize! People gave others what they were told were dangerous shocks.
And people were really impressed by this. People follow orders? Apparently these people were not paying close attention to the the Third Reich, the Rape of Nanking and Vlad The Impaler.

So I, personally, would give the kid, the mother, the teacher, and Mr. Randi a break here.

 

[Quixote]

My point was that Milgram, a Ph.D. social psychologist at Yale U. did not have a control condition (in a within-subjects design) nor a control group (in a between groups design).

Right. But for the hypthesis he was testing, the kid had only a control group. I'm not criticizing the kid. He was, after all, only 10. But one of the adults involved should have noticed that his procedure never introduced the thing he was ostensibly measuring, gullibility. The teachers let him tell 40% of the 6th graders that they were more gullible than most and lent their authority to that completely baseless assertion.