Should sanctuary cities be tolerated?

None necessary.
obviously it is.
the POINT of Due Process is to make a judicial - not executive, decision on what rules to apply.
The Trump Admin has on multiple occasions applied the wrong laws because they believed that they knew what the relevant laws were when they didn't - or ignored them deliberately.
What you would condemn Israel doing, you are happy Trump is.
 
That is a lie. I do not support deporting people because they are crime victims.
They are being deported for coming to the attention of the police who enforce immigration law, and thus end up being deported. You are failing to see the connection between cause and effect. They are not being deported because they are victims, but because they decided to report the crime against them to people who deport them like police who enforce immigration laws.
 
They are being deported for coming to the attention of the police who enforce immigration law, and thus end up being deported. You are failing to see the connection between cause and effect. They are not being deported because they are victims, but because they decided to report the crime against them to people who deport them like police who enforce immigration laws.
Same reason those working (or used to work in the case of some US MAGA states lol) in undeclared low paying jobs don't report ''employers' who significantly underpay them, often in poor and even unsafe working conditions- lodging an official complaint is a good way to get deported....

So those scumbag employers get to keep underpaying and injuring/killing them for a pittance....
 
They are being deported for coming to the attention of the police who enforce immigration law, and thus end up being deported. You are failing to see the connection between cause and effect. They are not being deported because they are victims, but because they decided to report the crime against them to people who deport them like police who enforce immigration laws.
So illegal aliens are getting deported after coming to the police to report a crime?
 
Same reason those working (or used to work in the case of some US MAGA states lol) in undeclared low paying jobs don't report ''employers' who significantly underpay them, often in poor and even unsafe working conditions- lodging an official complaint is a good way to get deported....

So those scumbag employers get to keep underpaying and injuring/killing them for a pittance....
They chose that life.
 
And why OSHA is a garbage institution. If you think your workplace is unsafe work somewhere else.
Most of us do. Because most of us are here legally and have plenty of options for good workplaces. Some of us, however, choose to come here illegally, and live with the consequences of that choice. People aren't entitled to a decent job in America just because they exist.
 
Most of us do. Because most of us are here legally and have plenty of options for good workplaces. Some of us, however, choose to come here illegally, and live with the consequences of that choice. People aren't entitled to a decent job in America just because they exist.
And when a mine owner cuts corners and kills his workers, it is their fault for working there. They should have known better.
 
And when a mine owner cuts corners and kills his workers, it is their fault for working there. They should have known better.
If they are illegal workers, they share the blame. Illegal workers enable bad people to create bad work environments.
 
That's a stupid thing to say.
That's why it's called reductio ad absurdum. If a claim necessarily implies an absurdity, it may not be a good claim.

Immigration violations are malum prohibitum. That is, they are actionable only because we say they are. We say that someone who is present in the United States without having competed certain formalities is liable to a certain set of responses, generally limited to removal. But only because we say so, because that's how we've decided we want our country to work.

Safety violations are malum in se. They are inherently bad because they are based on the proposition that no human should be treated that way. Yes, we codify what is allowable treatment in formal language. But the motivation is basic human worth. Having a piece of paper that says someone has given you permission to be where you are isn't a comment on your worth as a human being.

Sanctuary jurisdictions have decided to respect this difference, and enjoy the protection of the U.S. Constitution to do so.
 
I suspect it all depends on what folks mean why they say sanctuary city. IIRC, it mostly started by various cities saying, if come report a crime, we won't send you to immigration if you don't happen to be here legally. Which is quite reasonable, and law and order types should be on board with. There have been a few notable examples of sanctuary cities not turning over known criminals who were also illegal immigrants. A lot harder to justify really and doesn't do much to help the majority of immigrants legal or illegal.

In most cases this is purely practical. States and municipalities usually have limited detention facilities. Unless Congress provides funding for such detainment, Congress may not generally demand that state and local facilities expend their own funds to detain those wanted for federal law purposes.


Since the 10th Amendment guarantees their right to do so, what do you think?

Or maybe they want to preserve the state's authority under Federalism, for the sake of political accountability. The legal doctrine of a sanctuary city is not people putting compassion before the rule of law. It's governments putting the rule of law first.


That may be the message you are receiving. The sanctuary city doctrine is a principle of constitutional law. It's disingenuous to insinuate that states are ignoring laws or acting unlawfully.

They did.


That's exactly how it is handled. States are not obliged to implement or enforce federal environmental law unless Congress appropriates to them funds to do so, and the states agree to cooperate in exchange for those funds.

At first you tell us that the sanctuary doctrine merely creates a bad image. Now you imply that a punishment is in order for a state that exercises its right under the Constitution. That escalated quickly.


Current funding law does not allow the withholding of funds unconnected with the policy, or contrary to the Constitution.
First highlight, how so? Immigration is pretty clearly a federal issue. Can cities, IDK, decide to allow counterfeiting?

Second highlight, I'm curious where the sanctuary city is a principle in constitutional law. Where is that noted in the constitution?

Third highlight, that's almost certainly how Trump will handle it. Hey, that's a nice federal grant you've got there, it would be a shame if something happens to it, so why don't you drop this sanctuary city thing huh?
 
I suspect it all depends on what folks mean why they say sanctuary city. IIRC, it mostly started by various cities saying, if come report a crime, we won't send you to immigration if you don't happen to be here legally.
It consist simply in not asking the citizenship status of someone who reports that they have been the victim of a crime.

There have been a few notable examples of sanctuary cities not turning over known criminals who were also illegal immigrants. A lot harder to justify really and doesn't do much to help the majority of immigrants legal or illegal.
I covered some of those previously. It's never as simple as stated. It frequently involves janky pseudo-legal stunts such as bogus warrants. The jurisdictions properly reject these, because it's necessary to do so in order to preserve the claim that the sanctuary jurisdiction is operating faithfully according to law, not out of discretion. But of course these occurrences can be spun to argue that it is naked obstruction.

In other cases, the jurisdiction argues that handing over criminals or alleged criminals for immigration proceedings would deprive the criminal justice system of its corrective power. If someone is charged and convicted of, say, rape, but is then lawfully deported before a criminal sentence can be served, then it can be argued that the state's right to justice in criminal matters has been undermined.

First highlight, how so? Immigration is pretty clearly a federal issue. Can cities, IDK, decide to allow counterfeiting?
No, but that's a straw man. The issue is cooperation in enforcing federal law, not attempts to decriminalize or ignore federal law. As matter of fact, my local police force does not investigate violations of federal counterfeit law, and cannot be compelled by the federal government to do so on its behalf.

Second highlight, I'm curious where the sanctuary city is a principle in constitutional law. Where is that noted in the constitution?
The 10th amendment, as interpreted in New York v. United States (506 U.S. 144 [1992]) and Printz v. United States (521 U.S. 898 [1997]). The 10th amendment is the source for the doctrine of state sovereignty. Being a sovereign generally means no other government can tell you what to do.

Third highlight, that's almost certainly how Trump will handle it. Hey, that's a nice federal grant you've got there, it would be a shame if something happens to it, so why don't you drop this sanctuary city thing huh?
In general, current precedent remains that grants of assistance from the federal government cannot be conditioned on behavior unconnected with the purpose of the grant. And "unfunded mandates" similarly remain unconstitutional. The difficulty in enforcing a court decision upon a lawless executive remains a point of discussion.
 
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There is a case in Iowa where the AG is suing a county sheriff for...something. Not licking ICE's boots enough or something.

In response, the Sheriff stated that the county has fully complied with everything they have been required to do. The AG agreed with the Sheriff, that the county has complied with everything they have been required to do. He even removed the Facebook post that offended the AG.

But there was still a lawsuit.
 
It consist simply in not asking the citizenship status of someone who reports that they have been the victim of a crime.


I covered some of those previously. It's never as simple as stated. It frequently involves janky pseudo-legal stunts such as bogus warrants. The jurisdictions properly reject these, because it's necessary to do so in order to preserve the claim that the sanctuary jurisdiction is operating faithfully according to law, not out of discretion. But of course these occurrences can be spun to argue that it is naked obstruction.

In other cases, the jurisdiction argues that handing over criminals or alleged criminals for immigration proceedings would deprive the criminal justice system of its corrective power. If someone is charged and convicted of, say, rape, but is then lawfully deported before a criminal sentence can be served, then it can be argued that the state's right to justice in criminal matters has been undermined.


No, but that's a straw man. The issue is cooperation in enforcing federal law, not attempts to decriminalize or ignore federal law. As matter of fact, my local police force does not investigate violations of federal counterfeit law, and cannot be compelled by the federal government to do so on its behalf.


The 10th amendment, as interpreted in New York v. United States (506 U.S. 144 [1992]) and Printz v. United States (521 U.S. 898 [1997]). The 10th amendment is the source for the doctrine of state sovereignty. Being a sovereign generally means no other government can tell you what to do...
Meh, the SCOTUS has ruled the 10th Amendment is null & void over and over again.
 

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