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Sell me Linux

Squeegee Beckenheim

Penultimate Amazing
Joined
Dec 29, 2010
Messages
32,124
For a while I've been toying with the idea of moving to Linux. I like the idea of it, I like the idea of the customisability, and I have plenty of niggles with Windows. AIUI, lack of compatibility with certain Windows programs (I'm a heavy user of Sony Vegas, Cubase, and Photoshop, for example) isn't much of a problem as WINE can emulate Windows fine.

But the more I look in to Linux, the less appealing it actually seems. For example, here is an article giving 20 reasons why you should switch to Linux yet I go through that list and many of the points it's listing as a plus I either don't care about or see as an active minus. I also question some of the points - for example it says that the key reason for lack of malware on Linux is that the software repositories mean that all software is vetted first. But doesn't that rather assume that the main vector of infection is downloaded software? I don't think that's a safe assumption.

Seems like the best idea is to get input from actual human beings. So here I am, doing just that. So...if you're a fan of Linux, can you explain to me why?
 
WINE (which is not an emulator) works with a fair number of Windows programs, but I wouldn't assume it'll deal with everything you throw at it. You might consider a virtual machine (I use VirtualBox) for software it doesn't play well with.

If you want a platform which is stable, moderately secure and can utilize a wide variety of hardware use a Linux distribution.
 
WINE (which is not an emulator) works with a fair number of Windows programs, but I wouldn't assume it'll deal with everything you throw at it. You might consider a virtual machine (I use VirtualBox) for software it doesn't play well with.

Given that some of the stuff I do is quite CPU intensive, I might do better just to have a duel boot.

If you want a platform which is stable, moderately secure and can utilize a wide variety of hardware use a Linux distribution.

Well, I only use the 1 machine, so the hardware isn't really an issue, and the rest of what you say applies to my current Windows 7 install.
 
I like Linux as it's stable, powerful, well documented and free. If you have hardware that is a little too old or underpowered to run the current versions of Windows effectively. there will be a Linux distro that will run fine on that hardware. On the other hand if you have the latest greatest hardware then Linux will make full use of it (with the possible exception of cutting-edge graphics cards).

If you like Windows and you're not particularly interested in learning a new operating system then you should stick with what you already know.

If you have some favourite application(s) that is/are designed to run on the Windows platform, that is another good reason for sticking with Windows.

The best advice used to be that, if you're interested, install both with a dual boot. But Microsoft with their latest offerings seem to be doing their utmost to discourage dual booting from the same hard drive, so if you want to try Linux out and you have Windows 8 or later, then you're best advised to fit a second, or external hard drive, or boot Linux from a USB stick or DVD.

It is possible to install Linux alongside a pre-installed Windows 8 on the same HD, and I've done it, but it's tricky to keep it stable for major upgrades of either Operating System, so I don't recommend it. Fit a second HD or use an external one and you're fine.
 
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Or first install some free virtualization software, like VMware Player (https://my.vmware.com/web/vmware/free#desktop_end_user_computing/vmware_player/6_0), which allows you to try out a Linux distribution without first having to set up dual boot etc, and if you do not like it, you can just uninstall.

(Yup, the free VMware Player allows you to install a new virtual machine, it's just not as comfortable as VMware Workstation because some options are missing - but for a VM with just one hard disk and one network card, it's fine).
 
I second jbm's recommendation of trying out Linux under Windows using VMware. Many people perfer Linux Mint ("the better Ubuntu"), and with a bit of searching you can find pre-built VMware images for it and many other Linux distributions.

I'm a big fan of Linux because there are things I can do with it that simply can't be done with Windows, or can't be done without searching for all kinds of add-on software. But most of those things are on the extreme side of geek and are of little use to the day to day user.

Another reason I like Linux is the source code being available means troubleshooting is more exact. If you have a weird error on Windows, searching the web for a solution often turns up forum after forum of people guessing at what the problem is and offering cures similar to those offered for warts. That is, stuff that seemed to work for them but with no guarantee it will work for you. I remember one time I was looking for the definition of a Windows error 0x80010004 (or something like that), and could not find a canonical reference from Microsoft saying what the error actually means. All I got was a load of speculation and possible fixes.
 
Another reason I like Linux is the source code being available means troubleshooting is more exact. If you have a weird error on Windows, searching the web for a solution often turns up forum after forum of people guessing at what the problem is and offering cures similar to those offered for warts. That is, stuff that seemed to work for them but with no guarantee it will work for you. I remember one time I was looking for the definition of a Windows error 0x80010004 (or something like that), and could not find a canonical reference from Microsoft saying what the error actually means. All I got was a load of speculation and possible fixes.

See, now, that sounds very useful. I don't often get errors, but when I do it's a nightmare trying to figure out what's actually going wrong and how to fix it.
 
Just on Photoshop alone: stay on Windows (or go Mac.)

I'm a 10+ year Linux user and I love it. I still say: if you are suffering under Windows then you will suffer even more to run software that has to be fooled into thinking it's on Windows.

Go to Linux if:
You can switch to native apps: Gimp, Krita, others (there are some commercial pixel-pushers out too.)

That's it.

All the other pros are just words. Looking through source code for errors! Please. If you have a brain the size of a room and a way to stop time, go ahead. :)
(Also, any closed code - like Photoshop, if it ran on Linux at all - would not be available for such inspection anyway.)

Security? Sure, it's a little better. Some bugs, some recent trust flaws. There's no reason, in my view, to think it's any better than Windows or Mac. If bad code runs and trashes my user directory then I lose everything that counts to me. I don't care if root is secure. So what?

Really, Linux distros are secure in inverse proportion to the number of users.

If you are coding (in just about any language) or doing web development (graphics, to css to back-end, to databases) then Linux is a great fit. Get in, set it up and just produce.

If you are doing specialized graphics and such, then you are really in a software ecosystem like Adobe or one of those few monopolies - play by their rules, don't bother trying to leave the dark side.

There are some nice audio apps here too, and some commercial ones, but you'd have to do a lot more research before swapping to Linux.

Oh, you can also get most of the apps you'd use on Linux for Windows right now. Gimp, KDE & its apps (I think), Blender 3D, Inkscape and so on.

Try them out. Feel the pain :) Then decide where you want to struggle, the coal mines or the sweat shops! :D

One last thing, dual booting. I never did get it. You spend your time in an O/S. When are you gonna find time to shut down, reboot, hit a key, swap to another O/S and then expect to get anything done in this strange part-time alien environment?

Nah. Dual booting is half-pregnant; it doesn't work. Spin-up a VM in Windows and install a few distros there. If you have time, play with them. It's better than booting.

Distro I use: Ubuntu. It really just works. Lots of rough edges, but, let's face it, what software lacks those?
 
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I'm a heavy user of Sony Vegas, Cubase, and Photoshop, for example
Then I doubt I can sell Linux to you. Multimedia software on Linux has a long way to go before it is as useful as what you can buy from microsoft. Even then you have to be sort of a geek to get the most out of it. (Gimp seems to be a notable exception though).

OTOH you could "wet your feet" a little by downloading a Puppy Linux ISO (http://puppylinux.org/main/Overview and Getting Started.htm), burning a CD or memory stick and booting off that. The speed with which you can do standard stuff like Email, web browsing, word processing or spread sheets will impress you so much that you may wish to learn more about this stuff.
 
I've got both GIMP and Inkscape. I've not really had time to sit down with Inkscape so don't really know how good or how not good it is, but there are things that GIMP does that I like better than Photoshop, and there are things that Photoshop does that I like better than GIMP. But I couldn't replace Photoshop with GIMP, that's for sure.
 
But I couldn't replace Photoshop with GIMP, that's for sure.

Then your goose is nuked. Linux it ain't!

I hear Photoshop is moving ever-more online and now runs on Chrome (browser - and this on most platforms) and that's a possible future.

Inkscape is pretty great - but is not as good as what I remember Freehand and even Corel 7 being. That was when I left Windowville. It's a great app to have and I use it often, but you can't use symbols or links to other files - so there's a lot of manual re-do labour in certain projects. It's also bloody slow when the number of nodes gets high.

I have some hope that the latest version will finally have symbols and linking. We shall see.
 
But the more I look in to Linux, the less appealing it actually seems. For example, here is an article giving 20 reasons why you should switch to Linux yet I go through that list and many of the points it's listing as a plus I either don't care about or see as an active minus.

Yes. Some of the points are valid and some are not.

In the following, I use the word Linux in its most general sense as an operating system that uses the Linux kernel. RMS would want me to say Gnu/Linux everywhere, but the Gnu user land is not the whole of a modern Linux distro.

Linux is free - as in beer

It's only free if your time has no value. Windows also has a cost, in time but the actual operating system is likely to have been bundled with the PC you bought. Yes, there's lots of free software you can run on Linux, but quite a lot of it is also available on PCs.

Software repositories

This one makes me smile. Each distributor tends to have a software repository. You don't have to use them, but if you do, your life is easier, and if you are not an expert, you are effectively locked i to what the distributor thinks you should want. The same people who extol the virtues of software repos on Linux also often bemoan the alleged lock in from the Mac App store.

Live CDs

Are rubbish.

Except for dipping a toe in the water except that they don't really give you a representative view of a properly installed OS. They are, however, very useful for recovering borked Linux installs such as the one I had to recover when our sys admin used the wrong editor on the config file for the password access module.

Rapid evolution

This is not necessarily a good thing. You just get used to the user interface and, in the next release, they change it. The article jokes about upside down menus, but things like this (but usually less extreme) do happen occasionally with Linux distros. People don't like change for change's sake and why should they?

Linux is free - as in speech.

Undeniably good - if you are a programmer. If you don't know how to write code and don't have the resources to pay somebody to write code, it's hard to see what tangible advantages Linux has over Windows and OS X.

Powerful shell

I believe there is a free powerful shell for Windows too, if you need it. The most common option for a powerful shell for Linux (there are several, which is a Good Thing) turned out to have an itsy bits massive security hole.

Multiple desktops

Yes, this is good. I believe Windows 10 is finally going to have a feature that's been in Linux for ages and OS X for at least five years.

Independent distributions

Interesting language in this one:

Software evolves because the distros only include what they feel is the best or most appropriate.

This means "the independent distributors know what's best for you!" Hmmm.

Drivers included

The fact that it is the driver vendors and not Microsoft who write drivers for Windows has no bearing on the fact that more hardware is supported for Windows.

Runs on any platform

What do you care about that? As long as it runs on your PC.

No commercial deadlines

Really? Red Hat and Ubuntu don't have commercial deadlines? Hmmm

Interoperability

This one is mostly true as long as you are not talking about things like MS Office or Photoshop or most games.

Community support

Isn't all it's cracked up to be. Sometimes you get good support, sometimes you get a snotty answer like "go read the code". On the other hand, you might have a mate down the street who can fix your Windows problems.

Any colour you like, except brown

That's an outrageous lie. Of course you can have brown.

Security

Windows security is not bolted on afterwards. The NT kernel was designed from the ground up with security in mind and its security model is superior to that of Linux. The Linux security model is pretty much the same as the original Unix model which was considered agricultural when it was new. Sure, it's possible to bolt on some modern features like ACLs afterwards...

There have also been some fairly major security problems in Free Software recently. The recently discovered Shellshock vulnerability, the previous Heartbleed bug. If you want an example of how the Linux distro model can foul things up, look at the Debian SSL bug caused by a distro maintainer making changes to software he didn't understand.

Lack of malware

This is true, although, as with OS X it is probably a function of the OS's relative lack of popularity.

Thousands of programs included

This is true.

No reinstallations

This might be true. I've never kept a distro around long enough to find out.
 
One advantage is that it's very rare that Linux needs to restart to install upgrades - Windows seems to do that all the time - sometimes multiple restarts for a 'single' upgrade.
 
So here I am, doing just that. So...if you're a fan of Linux, can you explain to me why?
I actually switched from Linux back to Windows for a singular reason: incompatibility with the latest NVidia graphics cards. Despite being a huge nerd and a power user, I struggled for days to install compatible drivers, tweaking settings deep in Linux config files and even the BIOS on my motherboard, but failed in the most spectacularly frustrating way possible.


Despite that, I actually really like Linux for a few reasons:

1) If you're a frugal person or a college kid, Linux is great because we all like free things ^_^

Years ago, I bought a machine with Vista pre-installed. Later, I upgraded my Vista with a copy of Windows 7 Ultimate for $200. Everything was great for a long time, until I swapped my old hard drive with a much faster replacement. I could not install my copy of Windows 7 on my replacement drive without paying Microsoft $100 for another serial key, because Windows licenses are per drive and cannot be transferred between drives. Sads.

2) Being able to update my entire system and apps in a single operation, without rebooting. Its a small feature, but makes a huge difference in the day-to-day user experience.

3) Unity + Ubuntu is probably the most user-friendly, aesthetically pleasing desktop environment out of the box.

4) But if you don't like Unity, Linux has tons of hot-swappable desktop and windowing managers for years.

You can really narrowly tailor your user experience to exactly the set of features you want. My dad really likes Unity, but I'm a big fan of xmonad.
 
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I installed Ubuntu on my son's laptop so he can watch Youtube and play a few Steam games. I have Ubuntu on an old desktop for word processing and printing. What was cool was that I plugged my peripherals in (laser printer, wacom pad, scanner, graphics card) and they all worked straight away. The scanner doesn't even work on my Windows computer anymore since there's no Windows 7 driver for it.

There are a few downsides. There were some specific issues that required arcane command line inputs to resolve (e.g. where third part software is required like getting DVD players to work properly), which is not a user-friendly experience. Some websites like Netflix won't work. I'm also still need my Windows desktop for serious gaming.
 
While I live where Netflix does not wander, I have heard that Chrome can now do the job on Ubuntu.
 
Lately I've been playing around with Mint burned to a USB. I like it, but the Linux file system takes some getting used to.
I've got another distro called Porteus that only takes up about 270MB. My laptop (Win7) is pretty cheap and doesn't play back videos very smoothly (HD is nearly unwatchable.) But Porteus takes up so little resources that I can play HD videos on it.

Steve S
 
The absolute best reason to switch to linux is also extremely ironic:

Increasingly, it just works.

Linux used to be the demnesne of config file hell. If you wanted your computer to zig instead of zag, you always had to open up /etc/dev/w/e/movement and change line 14 to "direction=zig," and people you'd ask for help online would insult your intelligence instead of actually helping, whereas Windows didn't have that problem because, well, frankly, if it wanted to zag that's all it would do. Yet today, more and more technical problems are as crappy as they ever were on Windows, but on Linux, specifically Linux Mint, they just work.

For example: at my workplace, we have the usual smattering of Macs and various Windows distros. I'm the most prominent Linux user, and I've been saddled with a reputation as The Guy Who Fixes Your External Backup Drives. If they're windows, if they're mac, if they're unformatted, doesn't matter, gparted can see them and I can do whatever needs to be done, whereas both Windows and Macs have their quirks as to what they're willing to recognize and write to, and what they aren't.
 

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