Question about racial purity

[Bearguin]

So, do we accept the melting pot or do we make an attempt to keep some diversity in culture.

Canada is less of a melting pot than the US, with minorities clearly clumping together and being visible. There seems to be a push to integrate others into the general "Canadian" society, but this is resisted to a large extent. Or is it simply that we have so many new immigrants and their children will be more integrated (I think this is the case) and do we lose something in this?

In Vancouver area there are large Sihk communities that do appear to operate primarily within itself. To a large extent, they do business in "their" community, and tend to continue to marry within that community. IS this neccesarily "bad" for Canada? Or is it a good thing to continue to maintain the cultre? Now I don't think the worldwide Sihk community is in danger of disappearing, but we have lost a lot of distinct cultures do to world globalization.

 

[EGarrett]

It seems understandable at first. However...as people have correctly pointed out...it's very hard to define what you're seeking. There is no such thing as a true Scotsman.

And "what is it?" isn't the only question...but "where does it stop?" also.

You have to closely examine what ideas are behind the statement "It would be nice if there were some true Scotsmen around." Are you saying that you'd prefer that? Or are you saying that it would be better over all? Or better for society?

Even if you mean it in the most harmless way possible...it will be inevitably misinterpreted because it's such a confusing statement. Xenophobia is also a powerful instinct...and you don't want to start suggesting to someone that it'd be "better" if they marry a Scotsman. It's just far too easy to create problems.

There's no way to implement the thought into society in any useful way...it should just remain undefinable wishful thinking instead of some idea that's being spread.

Now...if you want cultural ideas to remain for future generations...that's a different story. It's also one of the great uses for books...

 

[Wrath of the Swarm]

It seems understandable at first. However...as people have correctly pointed out...it's very hard to define what you're seeking. There is no such thing as a true Scotsman.

Incorrect argument. We can judge whether a person is a Scotsman or not. Therefore there is a set of standards that defines "Scotsman". Therefore there is such a thing as a "true Scotsman".

 

[LFTKBS]

Re: Re: Question about racial purity

Roman's lost their sense of civic duty. We have lost our sense of national pride. The Romans degenerated into pleasure seeking society with little thought toward self sacrifice. The same can be said for us. Roman absorbed ideas that were foreign to their founding fathers. We have done the same. Rome lost control of their borders and were overwhelmed by barbarians. The same can be said for us. The newcomers were of a different culture and had no use for the ideas that made Rome great. The same can be said for our new immigrant. The Roman newcomers lacked the ability to maintain the infrastructure of the Empire. The same thing is happing to America. When Rome fell, Europe collapsed into a dark age that last 1,000 years. The same thing will happen to the world when we collapse

You realize that all this stuff happened after Rome switched over to Christianity, right? Just saying.

For others: how many "races" are there? Three? Sixty? What race is Tiger Woods? What race is someone born to an English father and an Agentinian mother? Are Australian aborigines black even though they're more distant from "black" Americans than "black" Americans are from "white" Americans?

"The Muslim are making demands on our school system to conform to their religious beliefs. If Christians made any one of those demand, the ACLU would be up in arms."

What country do you live in, Outcast? As far as I can tell, it's Christians who fight to get their creation story taught as science, not Muslims. It's Christians who try to put "thou shalt have no other gods before me" in the courts, not Muslims.

"Anti-Catholic films and filthy and blasphemous anti-Christian art are the deliberate insults of a triumphant pagan and secularist faith."

And yet Mel Gibson's "Passion of the Christ" is the #1 movie in America.

I mean, when you're quoting Buchanan, you know know your argument is bunk.

Finally, to jj: so did you kill the guy or what?

Oh, finally, part 2: Remember when the Irish weren't considered white? Or Italians? Race isn't simple.

 

[Suezoled]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

That is exactly the roblem. Prior to the 1965 Immigration Act, most of our immigrants came from Europe. After 1965 they came primarily from Latin America and Asia. Proper to 1965 we were a melting pot of European Nations with English as a common language and a common culture going back to the Greeks and Romans. The new immigrants don't want to assimilate. They want to bring their language and culture with them and turn America into what they left behind. Look at the crime, poverty and corruption that is rampant in Latin America. That is our future in the next 50 years. In the next 10 years I can see Southwestern United States becoming like Quebec in Canada is. There is going to be a push to make some states Spanish only. If the people coming into this country can't run their own countries, how can they run this one? It was one of the problems that Rome faced.

The Muslim are making demands on our school system to conform to their religious beliefs. If Christians made any one of those demand, the ACLU would be up in arms.

I don't like the term "racial purity." I like the term racial identity better. Which race do you identify with? Who do you feel comfortable with? Where do you fit in?

When does "family tradition" overlap and conflict with the requisite to "fit in" with society? What is it so wrong with wanting to find the familiar in an unfamiliar world where the language and culture of the people varies wildly and confusingly? What is so terrible with adults who have been raised one way and are familiar with things stick to those things? In 50 years things will be full of crime? In 50 years those adult immigrants will be old. Their children might have children, and having been raised in a US society, will be acclimated better; they will be natural born americans. Then again anyone can make an area full of crime regardless of ethnicity.

Even first generation immigrants, if brought over, still make an effort to acclimate for the most part.

A melting pot like the US changes with the people and cultures added.

Spanish-only states? Are you projecting some sort of pseudo-racial superiority that you think immigrants have just because you might?

 

[DrMatt]

Does anyone care about racial purity?

Check with the geneticists. See what they can tell you about "race". You may be in for a surprise.

 

[EGarrett]

Incorrect argument. We can judge whether a person is a Scotsman or not. Therefore there is a set of standards that defines "Scotsman". Therefore there is such a thing as a "true Scotsman". [/B]

What set of standards do you want to use?

 

[dmarker]

Re: Re: Question about racial purity

And the collapse of Rome took place a mere forty years after the Empire proclaimed Christianity as their state religion. Not that I blame Christianity for bringing down the Roman Empire. Many different factors went into the collapse.

I doubt that having more immigrants will lead to decline. The US will change but that's the beauty of the US. Our country is made to change, that's our strength and we should keep it.

I guess I'll jump in and get labled a racist. I agree alot is begining lost here in America. Lets do a rough comparision to America and Rome. Both were the biggest kids on the block. Both were the most advanced. Both used their military might to force peace, law and order on the rest of the world. The languge and culture of both was adopted by the world.

Roman's lost their sense of civic duty. We have lost our sense of national pride. The Romans degenerated into pleasure seeking society with little thought toward self sacrifice. The same can be said for us. Roman absorbed ideas that were foreign to their founding fathers. We have done the same. Rome lost control of their borders and were overwhelmed by barbarians. The same can be said for us. The newcomers were of a different culture and had no use for the ideas that made Rome great. The same can be said for our new immigrant. The Roman newcomers lacked the ability to maintain the infrastructure of the Empire. The same thing is happing to America. When Rome fell, Europe collapsed into a dark age that last 1,000 years. The same thing will happen to the world when we collapse

 

[Outcast]

Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

And the collapse of Rome took place a mere forty years after the Empire proclaimed Christianity as their state religion. Not that I blame Christianity for bringing down the Roman Empire. Many different factors went into the collapse.

I doubt that having more immigrants will lead to decline. The US will change but that's the beauty of the US. Our country is made to change, that's our strength and we should keep it.

Christianity was one of those foreign ideas when introduced removed, the divinity of the Emperor. Before Christianity Rome was very tolerant of foreign gods. One could believe and practice what they wished as long as they worshiped the Emperor. I am not sure if Christianity was part of the problem or a symptom of the problem.

It is not so much the quantity of the immigrants, but their ethnic makeup that is the problem. In another 50 years we will more like South America with all the problems it has.

 

[Suezoled]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

(snipped)

It is not so much the quantity of the immigrants, but their ethnic makeup that is the problem. In another 50 years we will more like South America with all the problems it has.

Confusicated. Very, very confusicated.

 

[LFTKBS]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

It is not so much the quantity of the immigrants, but their ethnic makeup that is the problem. In another 50 years we will more like South America with all the problems it has.

Waiting for answers on my questions upthread, Outcast.

 

[Outcast]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

When does "family tradition" overlap and conflict with the requisite to "fit in" with society? What is it so wrong with wanting to find the familiar in an unfamiliar world where the language and culture of the people varies wildly and confusingly? What is so terrible with adults who have been raised one way and are familiar with things stick to those things? In 50 years things will be full of crime? In 50 years those adult immigrants will be old. Their children might have children, and having been raised in a US society, will be acclimated better; they will be natural born americans. Then again anyone can make an area full of crime regardless of ethnicity.

Even first generation immigrants, if brought over, still make an effort to acclimate for the most part.

A melting pot like the US changes with the people and cultures added.

Spanish-only states? Are you projecting some sort of pseudo-racial superiority that you think immigrants have just because you might?

Do you consider this racist?

The Spiritual Plan of the Aryans

In the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal "brown" invasion of our territories, we, the Aryan inhabitants and civilizers of the northern land of America from whence came our forefathers, reclaiming the land of their birth and consecrating the determination of our people of the sun, declare that the call of our blood is our power, our responsibility, and our inevitable destiny.

We are free and sovereign to determine those tasks which are justly called for by our house, our land, the sweat of our brows, and by our hearts. America belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Latinos. We do not recognize capricious frontiers on the white continent

Brotherhood unites us, and love for our brothers makes us a people whose time has come and who struggles against the foreigner "Ausländer" who exploits our riches and destroys our culture. With our heart in our hands and our hands in the soil, we declare the independence of our pure nation. We are a White people with a white culture. Before the world, before all of North America, before all our brothers in the white continent, we are a nation, we are a union of free states, we are Aryan.

For the Race to do. Outside the Race nothing.
Für das Rennen zum Tun. Außerhalb des Rennens nichts.

Program

The Spiritual Plan of the Aryans sets the theme that the Aryans (The White Race) must use their nationalism as the key or common denominator for mass mobilization and organization. Once we are committed to the idea and philosophy of The Spiritual Plan of the Aryans , we can only conclude that social, economic, cultural, and political independence is the only road to total liberation from oppression, exploitation, and racism. Our struggle then must be for the control of our streets, neighborhoods, cities, lands, our economy, our culture, and our political life. The Plan commits all levels of Aryan society - the worker, the craftsman, the farmer, the writer, the teacher, the worker, the professional - to The Cause!

Nationalism

Nationalism as the key to organization transcends all religious, political, class, and economic factions or boundaries. Nationalism is the common denominator that all members of The Race can agree upon.

 

[LFTKBS]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

Do you consider this racist?

Yes.

 

[Suezoled]

What LFTKBS said.

 

[Chanileslie]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

Christianity was one of those foreign ideas when introduced removed, the divinity of the Emperor. Before Christianity Rome was very tolerant of foreign gods. One could believe and practice what they wished as long as they worshiped the Emperor. I am not sure if Christianity was part of the problem or a symptom of the problem.

It is not so much the quantity of the immigrants, but their ethnic makeup that is the problem. In another 50 years we will more like South America with all the problems it has.

Would you say Spain or Portugal have high crime rates? How about Germany? The peoples of South America are blends of both the aboriginal peoples and peoples who came from Europe.

I actually think the problem in South America could be brought down to poverty and the high level there of. We fortunately do not suffer from that level of poverty and therefore are not as prone to the problems that arise in some South American countries.

Also, many of the problems in some of the South American countries rise from unstable political ground, and although we may have our differences, our government is fairly stable (not including the current fool we have in the office of the president who does not appear to be stable to me.)

If we (The USA) fails as a country, it won't be because of our people and where their ancestors may have originated, but from something more insidious and less visible rather like the Romans whose political system became entrenched and bloated and unusable and who were being poisoned by lead pipes.

 

[Chanileslie]

Race is a made up concept that is all to often used to repress one section of the population due to the color of their skin or their cultural behaviors.

We are all the same race, the Human race.

 

[DrMatt]

Back in high school a million years ago, I trained for the 600 yard dash. But I never trained for hurdles or cross-country. So I guess that made me a racial purist...

 

[Suezoled]

Back in high school a million years ago, I trained for the 600 yard dash. But I never trained for hurdles or cross-country. So I guess that made me a racial purist...

It takes a strong man to admit your prejudice DrMatt.*


*I almost spewed my tea all over my screen after I read DrMatt's post. Hee hee

 

[Suezoled]

Race is a made up concept that is all to often used to repress one section of the population due to the color of their skin or their cultural behaviors.

We are all the same race, the Human race.

You're just trying to make that excuse so you don't have to admit your daughter's pink hair is non-racially related. Or something garbled that made more sense in my head than it does on print. *sighs* I think I just messed this up.

 

[Outcast]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Question about racial purity

Yes.

Good, so do I. The problem that is the world our grand children will be living in, but it won't be Aryan.

El Plan Espiritual de Aztlán

In the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal "gringo" invasion of our territories, we, the Chicano inhabitants and civilizers of the northern land of Aztlán from whence came our forefathers, reclaiming the land of their birth and consecrating the determination of our people of the sun, declare that the call of our blood is our power, our responsibility, and our inevitable destiny.

We are free and sovereign to determine those tasks which are justly called for by our house, our land, the sweat of our brows, and by our hearts. Aztlán belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Europeans. We do not recognize capricious frontiers on the bronze continent

Brotherhood unites us, and love for our brothers makes us a people whose time has come and who struggles against the foreigner "gabacho" who exploits our riches and destroys our culture. With our heart in our hands and our hands in the soil, we declare the independence of our mestizo nation. We are a bronze people with a bronze culture. Before the world, before all of North America, before all our brothers in the bronze continent, we are a nation, we are a union of free pueblos, we are Aztlán.

Por La Raza todo. Fuera de La Raza nada. (For the Race to do. Outside the Race nothing.)

Program
El Plan Espiritual de Aztlán sets the theme that the Chicanos (La Raza de Bronze) must use their nationalism as the key or common denominator for mass mobilization and organization. Once we are committed to the idea and philosophy of El Plan de Aztlán, we can only conclude that social, economic, cultural, and political independence is the only road to total liberation from oppression, exploitation, and racism. Our struggle then must be for the control of our barrios, campos, pueblos, lands, our economy, our culture, and our political life. El Plan commits all levels of Chicano society - the barrio, the campo, the ranchero, the writer, the teacher, the worker, the professional - to La Causa.

Nationalism

Nationalism as the key to organization transcends all religious, political, class, and economic factions or boundaries. Nationalism is the common denominator that all members of La Raza can agree upon.

What is the meaning of the word Aztlan?

In Chicano folklore, Aztlan is often appropriated as the name for that portion of Mexico that was taken over by the United States after the Mexican-American War of 1846, on the belief that this greater area represents the point of parting of the Aztec migrations.