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My "ESP" experiences

Stereolab said:
How can you tell me that I am jumping to conclusions, which I'm not, when you are jumping to conclusions about me based on things I haven't said?
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Because of the mere fact that you have rejected every mundane explanation given to you without a logical reason to. The very basis of your "knowing" those couple of events would happen is an emotional one. You have no idea if you actually "knew" anything, you only think you do and feel threatened when your recollection of the event is questioned. You emotionally reject coincidence because "it just doesn't makes sense".

Like Clancie, you didn't make a claim.. but you still believe it.
 
Darwin'sGoat said:


Yep, I never stop. I am assuming that I have somehow missed his post where he said he had more than 2 experiences. All I saw was the Wizard of Oz story, the phone call story, and a list of things he said were, to him, obviously coincidences. Am I somehow reading this post incorrectly, or is the rest of the world?
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Well, this is a long thread, so I forgive you. But from the original statement:

I have had roughly 15 "ESP" experiences during my lifetime. I am going to explain the two most "powerful" in some detail. I will be happy to share others if there is any interest.
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I think I got the 17 from the next paragraph and misremembered it as 15 to 17. So he only has to be between 75 and 150 years old. But that's an object lesson as to how tricky and confabulatory memory is. It was just a couple of days ago, and I could have sworn he said 15 to 17.

But still, 15 is 15, and roughly 15 is still probably 12 to 18, almost certainly more than 2. So maybe he's between 60 and 180. Still not a great range for having a good memory.
 
thaiboxerken said:


Because of the mere fact that you have rejected every mundane explanation given to you without a logical reason to. The very basis of your "knowing" those couple of events would happen is an emotional one. You have no idea if you actually "knew" anything, you only think you do and feel threatened when your recollection of the event is questioned. You emotionally reject coincidence because "it just doesn't makes sense".

Like Clancie, you didn't make a claim.. but you still believe it.
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Listen to how sure you are that you have all the answers, and I don't. Please, keep telling me what I "believe."

I have rejected the "false memory" explanation because it's simply not true. I probably have emails saved, sent minutes after the "phone call" incident, that "prove" this, at least to me. I have rejected the "coincidence" explanation, because I am not one to think coincidences are ESP. I tried to explain this. It is "possible" that they were coincidences, but it's about as likely as winning the Lotto five times in five attempts, as I also explained. Finally, I am looking into the possibility of the Wheel of Fortune episode being a rerun, and also the possibility that "THE LAND OF OZ" was perhaps announced as a "Fictional Place," not simply a "Place." If those turn out to be real possibilities, I have no problem AT ALL saying "hey, that probably wasn't ESP after all." You act like I am so sure in my beliefs about what happened, when I have been trying to tell you all along that I am not...that is why I started this topic! If I was sure it was ESP, believe me, I would have had no reason to post on here.
 
Stereolab said:


Listen to how sure you are that you have all the answers, and I don't. Please, keep telling me what I "believe."

I have rejected the "false memory" explanation because it's simply not true. I probably have emails saved, sent minutes after the "phone call" incident, that "prove" this, at least to me. I have rejected the "coincidence" explanation, because I am not one to think coincidences are ESP. I tried to explain this. It is "possible" that they were coincidences, but it's about as likely as winning the Lotto five times in five attempts, as I also explained. Finally, I am looking into the possibility of the Wheel of Fortune episode being a rerun, and also the possibility that "THE LAND OF OZ" was perhaps announced as a "Fictional Place," not simply a "Place." If those turn out to be real possibilities, I have no problem AT ALL saying "hey, that probably wasn't ESP after all." You act like I am so sure in my beliefs about what happened, when I have been trying to tell you all along that I am not...that is why I started this topic! If I was sure it was ESP, believe me, I would have had no reason to post on here.
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After the incident, which means your brain had time to recognise this has one heck of an unlikely event and, possibly, over-emphasising the level of certainty.

"I am not one to think coincidences are ESP." because you've experienced coincidences and non-coincidences and don't remember them as having the same level of certainty. It's been pointed out that KNOWING and knowing is subjective and that psychological studies indicate people can't actually tell the difference, and you don't seem to be accepting that.

From what you've written so far it seems to me these "actual" coincidences were magnitudes below your "five Lotto wins" events, while the "I can't explain them" events were extremely unlikely. Knowing they were so unlikely singles them out, and would influence your memory of them, possibly making you surer you KNEW that time. If you'd acknowledge this possibility you'd see that they are not that unlikely when you look at 30 years of experience, and 6 billion other humans.

You say you're looking for proof it could be other than ESP, and that we act like you're so sure, but although you've acknowledged the "rerun" and "fictional place" theories for the Wheel of Fortune incident, you've shown no understanding of the arguments presented regarding coincidences, human memory and perception. And this despite accepting that it just may have been 'fictional place'.

Human memories are not created real time, they are created after the fact, and they are likely to change slightly with each recollection. As you continue to reject what appears to outside observers to be reasonable explanations, without actually refuting them, you seem more and more like a true believer.
 
Hmm...

I've reviewed this thread, which is pretty long by the standards of this forum.

I haven't seen evidence of Stereolab's responding to any of the responses that did not fight him.

Perhaps I am missing something, so I ask: can anyone think of a reason not to put Stereolab into the category of mindless creduloid schmucks who just come here to pick a fight?
 
Stereolab said:
It is "possible" that they were coincidences, but it's about as likely as winning the Lotto five times in five attempts...
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Not as such. More like youve 'won the lotto' about 15 times in a your lifetime. But the Lotto (life) is played every second of every day. At $1 per second, you're not really on a winning streak.

Worst analogy ever! :D
 
Undodog said:

Not as such. More like youve 'won the lotto' about 15 times in a your lifetime. But the Lotto (life) is played every second of every day. At $1 per second, you're not really on a winning streak.

Worst analogy ever! :D
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I pointed this out earlier but Stereolab ignored me and repeated the assertion that s/he had only entered 5 lottos.

A bit like ‘only remembering the hits’ Stereolab doesn’t remember the posts that prove her/him wrong. Don’t be surprised if s/he repeats the 5 lotto claim later.
 
Undodog said:
Worst analogy ever! :D
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No, it isn't. It says exactly what I want it to say. I may be playing the coincidence lottery every second of every day, but that appears to be a different lottery.
 
epepke said:

I haven't seen evidence of Stereolab's responding to any of the responses that did not fight him.

Perhaps I am missing something, so I ask: can anyone think of a reason not to put Stereolab into the category of mindless creduloid schmucks who just come here to pick a fight?
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Go right ahead. That's what everyone seems so eager to do.

Do you not expect me to respond to posts that fight me?

I'm glad that you consider someone who doesn't necessarily accept your opinions a "mindless schmuck." However, I personally believe the mindless schmucks are those that, over and over, are insisting this is just coincidence (despite there being a few other "mundane" explanations being thrown around). Over and over and over, people are trying to prove themselves Skeptic of the Year or something, by mindlessly throwing out the same crap again and again. Look, you believe it's coincidence, and I don't, and it will just have to stay like that. But keep in mind that it's *me* that this all happened to. It's quite presumptuous of you all to think you can psychoanalyze me based on a few message board posts that people don't understand anyway.
 
Stereolab said:
I'm glad that you consider someone who doesn't necessarily accept your opinions a "mindless schmuck." However, I personally believe the mindless schmucks are those that, over and over, are insisting this is just coincidence (despite there being a few other "mundane" explanations being thrown around). Over and over and over, people are trying to prove themselves Skeptic of the Year or something, by mindlessly throwing out the same crap again and again. Look, you believe it's coincidence, and I don't, and it will just have to stay like that. But keep in mind that it's *me* that this all happened to. It's quite presumptuous of you all to think you can psychoanalyze me based on a few message board posts that people don't understand anyway.
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I certainly wouldn't call you a mindless schmuck. But by rejecting the most likely explanations (by a LARGE degree), you certainly don't appear to be a skeptic. The fact is, none of us, including you, can KNOW what happened because there is insufficient evidence and no more will ever be forthcoming.

Therefore, we have two ways we can deal with it.

(1) We can assume that there is a perfectly mundane, everyday explanation for what happened (e.g. imperfect memory, coincidence, you saw the show, etc.) or

(2) We can assume that somehow your brain received some sort of "ESP" communication from a pre-taped show broadcast over the electromagnetic spectrum, an event unprecedented in human history.

Which option would a real skeptic choose? The answer's pretty clear.
 
Ipecac said:
Which option would a real skeptic choose? The answer's pretty clear.
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Why are my alternatives limited to assumptions? I would think a real skeptic would investigate the explanations, even the mundane ones, which is exactly what I am doing...as I mentioned previously.
 
I would think a real skeptic would investigate the explanations.
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How would you sugget we investigate a story about you guessing a puzzle on wheel of fortune 17 damn years ago? It was a lucky guess or a coincidence - to spend time investigating any other explanation is a violation of Occam's razor and a waste of time.
 
I am looking into the possibility of the show being a re-run, and also the possibility of the category being "Fictional Place" rather than place. I don't suggest thatyou do anything. Kindly read the whole thread before responding.
 
By the way, I found an archived email sent five minutes after the phone call incident, (11/19/1999), that explains the occurence exactly as I've described it here. So, while I'm certainly aware that the human mind is imperfect, this is not a case of me remembering things incorrectly years later.
 
Stereolab said:
Why are my alternatives limited to assumptions? I would think a real skeptic would investigate the explanations, even the mundane ones, which is exactly what I am doing...as I mentioned previously.
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What Starrman said.

Finding out whether or not the show was a rerun or they said "fictional place" won't prove anything. If it gives you closure, great.

There is no way of obtaining conclusive evidence. All we can do is speculate and make assumptions. Given the nature of your claim, extraordinary evidence would be required.
 
Stereolab said:
By the way, I found an archived email sent five minutes after the phone call incident, (11/19/1999), that explains the occurence exactly as I've described it here. So, while I'm certainly aware that the human mind is imperfect, this is not a case of me remembering things incorrectly years later.
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Assuming (since we have no facts other than your word) that you accurately reported the event, you're right. It's not a case of misremembering. In this case it's you counting the hits but not the misses.

Other possible explanations. Did your phone have a display window on it? Maybe you glimpsed the person's name or number. You say that this person only calls you two or three times a year. So, maybe it was time. Maybe you hadn't heard from him in a long time so you were expecting a call. Maybe that report was due or overdue. Maybe he had e-mailed to tell you he was calling and you forgot. There are many mundane explanations.

This event is so obviously not paranormal I can't believe you give any credence to this at all.
 
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