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Missing our Troofs

Derek Johnson said:
Nope, I'm here to learn how that WTC roofline dropped SOOO fast and how that, what others claim was, molten steel showed up in the cleanup after the fact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4p6UuGE0plk&feature=player_embedded


Please help me get those squared away. Thanks.
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There are no first-hand eyewitness reports of molten steel on the pile at WTC. All the reports are second-hand.

There is no physical evidence for molten steel on the pile.

There is no science that would show how the temperatures needed to maintain molten steel were created and maintained for weeks.

Given that there is no evidence and no science, we can dismiss the second-hand stories as hyperbole.
 
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BigAl said:
...
Given that there is no evidence and no science, we can dismiss the second-hand stories as hyperbole.
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Even if there had been molten steel metal anything under the rubble days or week after the collapse, that would not by a long shot translate into molten structural steel while the building was still standing.

The reason why CTers feel that the collapse must have been a CD is the fact that it looks like a CD, and by this they mean: All of the structural elements must have been severed at once, in a synchronized, controlled fashion. They can't believe that a failure in one critical column would so rapidly propagate that the upper part of the fassade would fall in basically one piece.

They would therefore need a theory, whereby many columns (and/or other structural element) would be severed within a few seconds at most. The whole therm_te theory rests on the assumption that you could melt columns through within a short and controlled time, or melt enough of a cross-section for it to fail completely.
I count 81 columns in WTC7.
You can calculate how much total heat energy you need to melt a cross-section of each of the columns.
I am fairly certain that would already amount to a major amount of thermite, given the fact that thermite is not particularly high in Joules per kg.

So would conspirators use so much steel-melting thermite that you would get such great pools of metal they would stay liquid for weeks? Or would thermite keep on burning for weeks?

Nonsense.
 
AZCat said:
Hey, Derek - I see you were going to take the P.E. in 2009. How did that go for you?
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TBPE didn't let me take it in 09, I didn't work for a PE until 06 and they didn't count my undergrad or post-grad work experience when I didn't work under a PE. I'll take it this October, if TBPE doesn't object.
 
Derek Johnson said:
TBPE didn't let me take it in 09, I didn't work for a PE until 06 and they didn't count my undergrad or post-grad work experience when I didn't work under a PE. I'll take it this October, if TBPE doesn't object.
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You can't take it a year early? Most states are adding that option.

Do you guys take the NCEES test?
 
Derek Johnson said:
I'm right here, how can I be of service?
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Welcome to the forum Derek. I was glad to see you joined after seeing your "invitation" thread.

As you well know...there are many different "camps" in the Truth Movement. We would welcome a thread started by you explaining what you believed happened on the morning of 9/11.

Thank you.
 
Derek:

You are trained using math. Please show us those numbers that prove WTC7 was a cd. Incredulity doesn't fly here. And as far as your presentation. I listened to about 3 minutes of it. Listening to someone who just likes to hear themselves talk without making valid points is tiresome.

Try to frame your presentations in the manner this guy uses.

http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Physics/8-01Physics-IFall1999/VideoLectures/detail/embed07.htm

This lecture explores weight, perceived gravity, weightlessness, free fall, zero perceived gravity in orbit.

 
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What I would be more interested in, is having Derek explain to us, in technical terms, how the scientists and engineers at NIST got the collapse mechanism of WTC7 wrong.

Trust us Derek, most of us can follow along, and if there is something that I or others don't understand, we are real quick to ask.

TAM:)
 
Macgyver1968 said:
Welcome to the forum Derek. I was glad to see you joined after seeing your "invitation" thread.

As you well know...there are many different "camps" in the Truth Movement. We would welcome a thread started by you explaining what you believed happened on the morning of 9/11.

Thank you.
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Some hope,none of the other truthers here ever have.
 
I know this is going to be an unpopular response, but sadly, i don't think the JREF is a very "friendly" environment for truthers or anyone who believes strongly in any conspiracy theory.. While I understand, wholeheartedly, the frustration in dealing with loud mouth truthers, I've always been disappointed at some JREF's member's approach to them. Yes, it's funny and fun to make fun of people over the internet, but I don't feel the JREF forums should so commonly be the place for it. If these conversations were taking place in real life, I'd be surprised if some hecklers carried on to the extent they do on the forums.. This thread epitomizes it. So is it any wonder they rarely stop by for a "friendly" discussion.

That said, I will note that truther forums are far worse.. myself having been banned from Prison Planet for doing nothing more than debating the notion that AGW is not some massive scale conspiracy/hoax.. The moderator that calls himself "Sane" moved my thread, and retitled it "Why won't you believe my troll droppings about Global Warming??" and then banned me..
 
Molten steel like a foundry- like lave from a volcano

BigAl said:
There are no first-hand eyewitness reports of molten steel on the pile at WTC.
All the reports are second-hand.
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These firemen are giving direct eyewitness testimony that contradicts your statements BigAl.
Are you questioning the eyewitnesses' sanity, veracity or integrity BigAl ?



There is no physical evidence for molten steel on the pile.
Click to expand...

Satellite thermal infrared images disproves that statement as does the GZ
LIDAR infrared images.

There is no science that would show how the temperatures needed to maintain molten steel
were created and maintained for weeks.
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NO The exact source of the intense heat needed to create those pools of molten steel found
under the rubble piles of the three destroyed WTC skyscrapers has yet to be determined.
--Only the absurd theory that concludes that the short lived fires from aviation kerosene caused the
concrete reinforced steel cores to melt to a degree that caused a global symmetrical infrastructure
to fail has been completely eliminated.


Given that there is no evidence and no science,
we can dismiss the second-hand stories as hyperbole.
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EXACTLY what John Gross of the NIST does eh ?
Deny the molten pools of steel slag
were even present DESPITE all of the contrary evidence eh BigAl .
 
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Macgyver1968 said:
Where have all our truthers gone? Bill Smith has been gone for a month...Jamonious is AWOL...everyone else has been banned. Where will our stundies come from?
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I have no idea, but then I have them all on ignore anyway, so I wouldn't actually notice if they all left.
 
Fonebone said:

--Only the absurd theory that concludes that the short lived fires from aviation kerosene caused the
concrete reinforced steel cores to melt to a degree that caused a global symmetrical infrastructure
to fail has been completely eliminated.
[/b]
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No concrete reinforcement on the steel, but carry on.
 
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