• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Library Interent Filters

King of the Americas

Banned
K
Joined
Nov 15, 2001
Messages
6,513
Library Internet Filters

Okay, so I am working my shift Saturday afternoon at the Library, when a patron (a woman in her 60's) approached the circulation desk ti file a complaint:

"That boy over there in the maroon shirt is looking at naked women.", she announced in a not so quiet voice.

I smiled (unshocked by the notion that a teenager would be using the interent to look at naked women), and said, "Mrs. Roger (not her real name), the public library is a dangerous place, you might be offended by any number of items here. If you do not wish to be offended by other people's reading or view habits, it would be best for you to keep your eyes on your own research."

Well, she was none too happy with my response. The more I tried to get her to understand the nature of the Interent, and our policy NOT to filter it only led to her greater disgust at me and the library.

"You think it is okay for him to be looking at that stuff!?"

"No Mame, nor do I believe it is wrong for him to do so. That decision is to be made by his parents, and I am neither of them. After his mother signed the permission slip to be online, it is out of my hands. My only purpose here is to help people gain access to the information they seek, NOT to judge the material for its acceptability."

I have been at the library for almost 2 years, and this is the first such complaint that we have received.

The patron called my boss, the Director at home, to complain about how I handled the situation. She left before she saw me write the young man up, for an internet policy violation.

Because of this sungular complaint, my Director is ready to install filters...

ONE person complains in 5 years, and they are ready to take away full and complete interent access to almost 100 other patrons.

Oh, how I hate living in small towns that see nothing wrong with trampling upon minority rights with its moral majority rules.

---

When I first started this job, I made a suggestion to the board, that we should immediately buy privacy screens for all of our interent computers.

I said that our first priority as Public Library was to provide free and confidential access to information, and that by not putting privacy screens on our computers we were setting ourselves up for future problems. Cost concerns overrode patron's privacy worries.

I am posting here now, because I think you guys would be on my side of this issue, but also because I need some solid arguments to present to the board tonight.

What should be said about filters and privacy screens?

*Oh, and if you know someone who has a bunch of privacy screens that they are trying to get rid of, please drop me a line!?
 
Last edited:
I don't know the people involved, of course. But you might consider approaching the matter emotionally instead of logically. Something like patriotic, proud American, Constitution and freedom of speech versus Evil Chinese Commies who restrict internet access and Hate Our Freedoms. Or a slippery slope to Islamic terrorists who want to ban all female skin from public view.

I realise the JREFs mission is to promote critical thinking and as such to avoid logical fallacies, but for some people fallacies are more effective to convince them. Just an idea.
 
My greatest fear is that logic won't win the day, here in my small German-Catholic Texas town.

I have written, an article I will present to the local paper, if the Board sides with my filter-happy Director.

MY biggest beef, is that ONE person complained in 5 years, now suddenly we have to restrict EVERYONE's access.

Here is a site with a good hold on both arguments:

http://informatics.buffalo.edu/org/lsj/articles/gottschalk_2006_9_internet.php

---

"Are we pinko commies, or Freedom-Loving Americans?"

God I love that argument...
 
Well, I have to admit, I would have handled the situation differently.

[disclaimer] In order to retain our federal funding, we do have Internet filters. People over 18 can request that we bypass them, and we do upon request. However, we do have an Internet policy that prohibits pornography and we do enforce it. [/disclaimer]

Instead of calling the library a dangerous place, I prefer to point out it is a haven of safety to different points of view. I would have assured her that I understood her feelings, while explaining the policy and making sure that the policy was not being violated.

I would also have handed her one of our patron comment cards, which our director actually does read and act upon.

I don't think it's fair to alienate one patron in favor of another.

Just my 2 cents after taxes. :)
 
As much as I dislike emotional arguments, I second the suggestion of pointing out that content filtering is an action taken by dictatorships and communist governments that has no place in a country that values personal freedom.
 
As I noted, the patron WAS indeed peeved that I didn't hang the boy up by his toes right there and then.

However, I tried to follow our procedural manual, and I did indeed give the kid his one written warning which I also had him sign.

Our policy, that EVERYONE is forced to sign before getting online, says that you can't view inapproperaite images containing nudity, graphic violence, or profanity.

That said, I believe that this woman infringed on the rights on another patron by looking over his shoulder and invading his privacy.

The boy didn't ask her to look at his screen, nor was he trying to show it to her in an overt manner. Once she made the complaint he hit the door running. I actually had to call him at his house to get himt o come back up to the library.

---

You get federal funding FOR having filters???

I figured it would be the other way around...

Have you had problems with your filter over- or under- blocking site?

---

I don't think it is fair for this ONE patron to ruin the Interent for the 100 other patrons who DO use it regularly.

This woman is not familiar with the Interent, and could not grasp the notion of an unfiltered Internet and that 'I' didn't have total control over what someone else looks at.

We are not parents at the library, nor do we wish to act like one.

I am there to protect your right to access the information you seek, and to provide that access confidentially.

So I guess you are not a Library Bill of Rights gal, huh?

http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/statementspols/statementsif/librarybillrights.htm
 
King of the Americas said:
"You think it is okay for him to be looking at that stuff!?"
Click to expand...

Clearly there is nothing good about the female body. He has no business seeing one until his wedding night (and perhaps not even then if he chooses to marry a "lights off" kind of girl). Was this porn, or was it a woman without clothes?

BTW - A teenager in a library? I didn't think that happened anymore! Of course, they didn't have porn there when I was a kid. That certainly would have increased participation amongst my peers at that time.
 
King of the Americas said:
As I noted, the patron WAS indeed peeved that I didn't hang the boy up by his toes right there and then.

However, I tried to follow our procedural manual, and I did indeed give the kid his one written warning which I also had him sign.

Our policy, that EVERYONE is forced to sign before getting online, says that you can't view inapproperaite images containing nudity, graphic violence, or profanity.

That said, I believe that this woman infringed on the rights on another patron by looking over his shoulder and invading his privacy.

The boy didn't ask her to look at his screen, nor was he trying to show it to her in an overt manner. Once she made the complaint he hit the door running. I actually had to call him at his house to get himt o come back up to the library.

---

You get federal funding FOR having filters???

I figured it would be the other way around...

Have you had problems with your filter over- or under- blocking site?

---

I don't think it is fair for this ONE patron to ruin the Interent for the 100 other patrons who DO use it regularly.

This woman is not familiar with the Interent, and could not grasp the notion of an unfiltered Internet and that 'I' didn't have total control over what someone else looks at.

We are not parents at the library, nor do we wish to act like one.

I am there to protect your right to access the information you seek, and to provide that access confidentially.

So I guess you are not a Library Bill of Rights gal, huh?

http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/statementspols/statementsif/librarybillrights.htm
Click to expand...


Oh, dear, I must have expressed myself badly. I'm sorry.

I was more concerned that it sounded like you were rude to a patron. I was pointing out that it's her library too.

That being said, I am indeed a Library Bill of Rights gal. In order to keep federal funding which we already had, we had to agree to follow CIPA. Believe me, the debate here goes on. As to the Patriot Act....well, I won't even go there.

Our problem with privacy screens here is that they are so stealable. :mad:

In the department I manage, I constantly walk the thin line of trying to make everyone comfortable, except of course the really crazies who interfere with others, and provide information for all.

I do feel that you attacked me before I could clarify what I meant. As a fellow librarian, we need to stick together. :)
 
LibraryLady said:
I do feel that you attacked me before I could clarify what I meant. As a fellow librarian, we need to stick together. :)
Click to expand...
With library paste, and now that this is on the table, could you post photos after you two arrange this sticking to each other event? :cool:

DR
 
Well admittedly, when the patron made the complaint to me, I smiled.

An old woman is offended by what a teenaged boy was looking at on the Internet...SHOCKING.

In my head, I wanted to say, "Mind your own business you old bag!"

I didn't.

Instead, I tried to calmly tell her that I would handle the situation in accordance with our policy, but that there was nothing I could do to keep her from being offended, if she was going to continue to review what other people were talking about or looking at in the library.

It may very well be her Library, but no more than it is anyone else's, and moreover she does not have the right to say what other people can or should look at.

The last thing I said was something like, "If you do't think he should be looking at that, then you should really go tell his mom. I can only give him a warning, and then if he does it again, I can boot him out. His mother gave him permission to be online here. I think your complaint will cary mor eweight with her..."

She left shortly thereafter, refusing to read our Library's Internet Policy, and deaf to anything else I had to say.
 
Must resist urge to go on the computers next to her the next time she is in the library and display the most graphic gay BDSM plushy slash hardcore porn I can find.
 
I think you might be being more than a bit disingenuous here.

Saying that the old woman shouldn't have been looking is unfair and downright silly. People would have to wear blinkers and allowed only to look at the ground in front of them.

Library Lady is the voice of wisdom, experience and expertise here and what she's said is right - the library is for all. If not an old woman, what about kids? How are you going to enforce them not to look at stuff in open view?

Fair's fair, I'd be the last person to say there's anything wrong with naked women, but the public library is not the place to be studying them. Your attitude in having the first thought of "nosy old bag" suggests to me that librarian is not your best long-term career option.
 
King of the Americas said:
Because of this sungular complaint, my Director is ready to install filters...
Click to expand...

Let them filter away, they don't work. Folks use proxy sites to gain access to blocked websites, when the proxy site is discovered and blocked another one takes it's place and everyone finds out in 10 minutes.
 
King of the Americas said:
Instead, I tried to calmly tell her that I would handle the situation in accordance with our policy, but that there was nothing I could do to keep her from being offended, if she was going to continue to review what other people were talking about or looking at in the library.
Click to expand...
In hindsight it would have been better for you to act shocked after she told you, start a sermon about 'kids these days" (those have been popular among old folks since Roman times), and promise her to take the appropriate steps. (the ones in the darkened staircase she'll be taking) Then walk up to the boy, tell him the old hag complained, to minimize his browser and look guilty and punished until she's gone. Oh, and not to jerk off because it will leave such a mess.

;)
 
I guess I should mention that I have been doing this since 1977. October will be my 30th anniversary!

I wonder, since I'm in my 50s, am I an "old bag?" Or do I qualify for "hagdom?"
:boxedin:
 
LibraryLady said:
I guess I should mention that I have been doing this since 1977. October will be my 30th anniversary!

I wonder, since I'm in my 50s, am I an "old bag?" Or do I qualify for "hagdom?"
:boxedin:
Click to expand...

Depends. In Libary College what grade did you get in "Shhhh! 101"?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom