LDS

[bruto]

This thread is to present and explain LDS beliefs, teachings and doctrines, not to abuse and denigrate them. No one has, or is, being forced to participate in this LDS thread.

Repeating is not explaining. If you cannot disarm criticism you are not explaining very well.

 

[joobz]

But they recognize--and honor--the existence of Deity.

if what you say is true, then you are claiming that lds isn't the one true faith and in fact is just as valid as what an animist believes or a new age crystal worshiper.
the details of all these religions are so vastly different that they can't possibly be the same thing. If they are, then none of it matters.

 

[tsig]

LDS, Joshua's Long Day, Part III

http://www.mormonprophecy.com

Part Three of a documentary adventure into ancient history, prophecy and the Restored Gospel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYleXHRZ2Cw

From the first link:

The teachings of the prophet, Joseph Smith, the concepts presented in modern revelation, the enigmatic metaphors employed by the prophets when describing their visions, as well as the symbolism and ritual found in temples, ancient and modern, all become plain to the understanding and rich in meaning when considered in light of this novel view of ancient planetary history and cutting edge science as they relate to the Restored Gospel. No other interpretation even comes close. Embracing these ideas opens the door to profound truths and an enhanced understanding and appreciation for the Restoration that is otherwise denied us. It enlarges the soul, enlightens the mind and uplifts the spirit of all who experience it.


That last sentence sounds like being puffed up with pride.


That site also touts the Electric Universe and that alone would consign it to woo.

 

[RandFan]

This thread is to present and explain LDS beliefs, teachings and doctrines, not to abuse and denigrate them. No one has, or is, being forced to participate in this LDS thread.

This isn't a propaganda forum. It's a skeptics forum. Our purpose is to abuse and denigrate con men and schemes in a civil manner.

 

[showmevegas]

JS throws a couple rocks in a hat and translates whatever kind of Egyptian stuff makes his wife transcribe behind a curtain and that is not mysticism....???? Ok

You're welcome.



To a faithful Latter-day Saint, the Church isn't simply "someone else."



But they recognize--and honor--the existence of Deity.



That isn't what I claimed. I said that because human beings are limited to a finite number of senses (sight, sound, touch, smell, taste) it is arrogant for them to believe they can know everything that exists in the universe. I wasn't referring specifically to you but to humankind in general. I made no claim about having "mystical knowledge" you don't have.

 

[Olowkow]

I have never heard of a "miracle" that violates physical laws, nor any miracle that cannot be accounted for by natural explanations such as a claimed cure resulting from spontaneous remission. There are no miraculous limbs regrown, or congenital blindness cured.

I am certain that we at JREF are all eager to hear of accounts of even one single miracle that could not possibly have resulted from purely natural means.

Well that's an embarrassingly odd statement. Of course I've "heard of" such miracles, like Fatima etc. But most of us understand what the sun dancing around is all about. The hour was late.

 

[Akhenaten]

JS throws a couple rocks in a hat and translates whatever kind of Egyptian stuff makes his wife transcribe behind a curtain and that is not mysticism....???? Ok

You want fries with that?​

 

[skyrider44]

Correct, It's a collection of someone elses. Someone else just means a person other than you
So why would you need a person other than you to interpret the truth?
How do you decide whom you would trust to do the interpreting?
If I were to offer to be your interpreter, would you accept, and if not, why not?

No offense intended, but you ask a question that those not familiar with the concept of "keys" in the Church are prone to ask (and understandably so). Note the following:

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

 

[showmevegas]

Please, with some Mason's secret special sacred sauce.


o

[qimg]http://www.yvonneclaireadams.com/HostedStuff/MaccasGlyph3.jpg[/qimg]
You want fries with that?​

 

[Olowkow]

No offense intended, but you ask a question that those not familiar with the concept of "keys" in the Church are prone to ask (and understandably so). Note the following:

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

And who holds the women and children's keys?

 

[Akhenaten]

No offense intended, but you ask a question that those not familiar with the concept of "keys" in the Church are prone to ask (and understandably so). Note the following:

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

Grand Master Luke Skywalker​

"Jedi are the guardians of peace in the galaxy. Jedi use their powers to defend and to protect. Jedi respect all life, in any form. Jedi serve others rather than ruling over them, for the good of the galaxy. Jedi seek to improve themselves through knowledge and training." - Wookieepedia​

Makes at least as much sense. Probably more.

 

[Slowvehicle]

No offense intended, but you ask a question that those not familiar with the concept of "keys" in the Church are prone to ask (and understandably so). Note the following:

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

Shall we discuss "arrogance"?

 

[joobz]

But they recognize--and honor--the existence of Deity.

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

Do you not see the inherent inconsistency between these two statements?

You previously said it didn't matter which religion one followed. Now you say that ONLY the LDS church holds the keys to salvation.

How do you resolve this contradiction?

 

[skyrider44]

Do you not see the inherent inconsistency between these two statements?

You previously said it didn't matter which religion one followed. Now you say that ONLY the LDS church holds the keys to salvation.

How do you resolve this contradiction?

I did not say "it didn't matter which religion one followed." That aside, Latter-day Saints believe there is good in all religions, but they also believe that the keys to salvation are held by the president of the LDS Church.

 

[joobz]

Many contributors to this forum believe that science has all the answers to challenging questions. Some believe it's just a matter of time when there will be no need for religion. Science will have replaced God.

No one has claimed that science has all the answers or that it will answer all questions. Only that it is the only process that has consistently answered questions that has increased our understanding of the universe.

Science doesn't and won't replace god. Just like science doesn't and won't replace astrology or Santa Claus.

 

[showmevegas]

Kind of selfish with the "Key" I guess Xenu,Buddah,Yaweh,Thor,FSM and many others are locked out. I am not a believer in any faith. One really thinks this is true....but not, volcanos and operating ThetansIII

No offense intended, but you ask a question that those not familiar with the concept of "keys" in the Church are prone to ask (and understandably so). Note the following:

"The President of The LDS Church holds the keys of salvation for all men now living because he is the only one by whose authorization the sealing power of the priesthood can be used to seal men up to salvation and exaltation in the kingdom of God." --D&C 132:7

 

[skyrider44]

Shall we discuss "arrogance"?

Shall we discuss revelation?

 

[Cleon]

I am well acquainted with problems in LDS historicity, having read extensively in anti-LDS literature--from the illegal sacking of the Nauvoo Expositor to the current claims that Joseph Smith's BA is a fraud based on an analysis of some recovered papyrus he used in the claimed translation that makes no mention whatever of Abraham. The critics posit that circumstance casts doubt on the authenticity of the BoM itself and of Joseph Smith's claim to be a prophet.

I think many LDS are disturbed by the BA development, as well as by DNA findings involving "Lamanites." You (and others) seek a direct, forthright answer from me re. the BA. My answer is simply this: I don't know. To my knowledge, the Church has not issued a statement re. the BA, and I am not inclined to second-guess the Church.

Well, that's an honest answer, and I appreciate that.

However - do you realize how it comes across to non-Mormons? You're basically telling us that you realize the evidence against the BoA/BoM, but you simply choose not to question the Church.

One could take that attitude about anything -

"I mean, sure, I know the Xenu story seems utterly ridiculous, but I am not inclined to second-guess the Church."

"Yeah, Pastor Haggart may have a thing for crystal meth and male prostitutes, but I am not inclined to second-guess the Church."

"The Chairman may have taken things a bit too far, but I am not inclined to second-guess the Party."


If that works for you, great, but it's not exactly a convincing argument for Mormon beliefs. It just tells us that you're willing to ignore facts when they contradict what your leaders tell you. Many people throughout history have done the same, and the results have rarely been pretty.

 

[joobz]

I did not say "it didn't matter which religion one followed." That aside, Latter-day Saints believe there is good in all religions, but they also believe that the keys to salvation are held by the president of the LDS Church.

You used your witnessing of miracles as evidence of the truth behind lds.
I pointed out that others claim to see miracles.
You then went on to state that it didn't matter which religion it was as they all worship a deity.
I pointed out the contradiction with this view and your use of miracles as suggesting lds was special.
This is inherently inconsistent.

If miracles exist for all faiths, then you can't use it as somehow justification of lds. You can't use it in defense of BoA. You can't claim it isn't a fraud.

 

[Slowvehicle]

Shall we discuss revelation?

You mean, the opinion you have adopted because of the demonstrably fraudulent superstitions of your sect?

You may actually believe that some 'god' has 'revealed' to you that you have its license to be arrogant about being "saved" ("saved" from what?--from what your 'god' will do to you if you don't let him "save" you...), but it is definitionally arrogant to make the bald claim that your "revelation" is the only valid revelation...without admitting that you decided to "become faithless" to Banka-Mundi, Priapus, and Mene-Nuuntet...

The fact that you want to call it "revelation" does not make your arrogation less arrogant, but more.