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Karate tricks

gnome said:
Later I wound up in a group of students studying Nin-Po (something like Ninjitsu that was not quite the same in a subtle way that eludes my memory)... the instructor's name was David Held, taught a small group out of his home, and I would love to find him again for my kids. He taught simple, practical techniques with moves and countermoves as elegant as a chess game. He promised nothing supernatural, gave sound advice about handling opponents with guns, and was very good with kids.
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As I understand it, Ninjutsu is the name for the whole range of things that went intop a Ninja's training; Taijutsu is the name for the hand-to-hand combat that is part of ninjutsu. I could be wrong, though :)

My brother took a martial arts course that sounds a lot like what you described, though. They focused on real-world situations, like defending against baseball bats, two by fours, knives, guns, and other things you're likely to run into. Seriously, how many times are you going to defend against a sword, kama, tonfa, or bo? Or have one available to defend yourself? He thought it was a good course, and it apparantly taught him something (he's had to defend himself several times, and been very successful so far).

On the other side, he joined an ATA TWD place in Florida, just so he could get into competitions. He didn't mention his other martial arts training (he had a black belt in Kung Fu, in addition to his earlier training), and just went along with the course. He used to laugh about having an orange belt try to correct him on his style. He also mentioned how ATA created a lot of extra belts, to get more money from students. Your next belt is based as much on time as ability, so by creating more belts they get students to stay longer. They had a "camo" belt, for Ed's sake!

He's now in a Special Forces unit in Florida, and was recently offered a position as an instructor for SF courses. He's Guard, though, and the instructor position would've been full-time, so he turned it down.
 
epepke said:
Bricks, tiles, wood with the grain as opposed to against it, and concrete have relatively little tensile strength.

That's how rebar works. If you look at a piece of rebar, it has little ridges on it. Just sticking it into concrete helps a bit. However, to do a real job, you stretch the rebar and cast the concrete around it. Then you let the rebar go. The little ridges compress the concrete just a bit so that moderate strain just relieves compression rather than causing tension.

That's also why quenching, case hardening, and tempering work. They put the material at the surface in compression.
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I'd love to replace the usual softwood boards with boards that have the grain perpendicular to the suspension and see what happens. While I've no doubt that some people could still break a single board this way, those stacks of boards would stay stacks of boards.
 
thaiboxerken said:
I'd like to see them break 2X4's from Lowe's.
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Yeah, especially using short lengths of 2x4. They do do tricks with long 2x4's, though, where they take an 8' 2x4 and whack it over someone's leg or back in a way that breaks it with about 1/2 to 2/3’s of the board breaking off. Oddly enough, I have found that many trees and lampposts have enough chi for me to perform this trick on them. A similar trick is done with carefully selected and marked, thin-handled baseball bats--it looks rather painful but not magical and more of an endorsement of physics than chi. I've also seen similar feats done in one of those Musclemen for God type shows.
 
I may be misremembering this, but don't Hatusme's people claim that 'Ninpo' is the proper name for the art/system, and that 'Ninjutsu' doesn't exist, while Taijutsu refers to the fighting techniques?
 
crimresearch said:
I may be misremembering this, but don't Hatusme's people claim that 'Ninpo' is the proper name for the art/system, and that 'Ninjustsu' doesn't exist, while Taijutsu refers to the fighting techniques?
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That may be it...! Thank you...
 
Here is an old post by the aforementioned Bill Knittle from years gone by. I'm also reminded of a book a magician martial artist described called "Body tricks" or "body magic" which explained how to do tricks like the magnetic girl which he said, with some evidence, were also some good examples of how some internal MA stunts worked.

More Bill exploding bottles
breaking
 
Thanks for the links Wudang

I've got several Kung fu books at home with pictures of 'chi' demonstrations and I've often wondered how they did the selective breaking feat - i.e breaking one brick in a pile.

Now I know!
 
Bill Knittle is awesome, I notice that several believers don't care for his explanations though.
 
crimresearch said:
I may be misremembering this, but don't Hatusme's people claim that 'Ninpo' is the proper name for the art/system, and that 'Ninjutsu' doesn't exist, while Taijutsu refers to the fighting techniques?
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You may well be right. However, considering that both words use the same root (Nin, meaning invisible..or something similar) makes me wonder if the two words aren't really equivalent, perhaps differnt dialects or descriptions. The "jutsu" suffix means "The art of", I wonder if "po" likewise means something like "Way of" or "Life of" or something along those lines. While the phrase "Ninjutsu" might not have been used historically, I don't know that I'd necessarily call it incorrect.

Just my two cents worth (actually, due to depreciation of the Huntsman Mental Currency, it's only about .4 cents worth. But it's all you're getting. Deal with it. :D)
 
The suffixes like 'jutsu' are supposed to be all important to those who buy into the various style rivalries and origination myths.

In the case of the the Ninja craze I quit trying to sort out the competing lineage/authenticity claims around...oh about Andy Adams.

I did enjoy the Glenn Morris book on Martial Arts Madness, and I believe that is where I got the idea that knowing the correct term was ninpo was a litmus test of sorts.
(Again, for those who care).

Of course, the number of 'karate' instructors who think the word means 'empty hand', or the number of Taichi instructors who think that it means 'Ultimate Fist' (or that it has something to do with Chi) is a good buyer beware tool, so there may be something to the ninpo/ninjutsu distinction.
 
The historian, Turnbull, wrote a very nice book on the ninja

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1841765252/ref=pd_sxp_elt_l1/102-9904791-4045715

Which exposed many of the mythic elements of Ninjutsu as creations of the idealized Feudal Period, made popular in plays and writings well after the "reformation".

Hatsume even did a nice forward to the book, saying that "Turnbull knows more about the Japanese than the Japanese do."

True believers think he was just being polite....


Turnbull's other books on Japanese history are excellent as well, BTW.
 
wudang, from the first post you linked too, the coin grab is even better when you first palm a penny, say, and at the same time you take the quarter, you drop the penny in their hand, which they then clench. You've not only grabbed the quarter, you've replaced it with a penny you are that quick. :)
 
As a black belt in Kenpo and Tai Kwon Do, these parnarmal claims always pissed me off. It's similar to Randi and the psychics. If Randi can do the same things without the use or Psi power, then why would you think that the psychics arn't using the same technique. Likewise, if I can knock someone over with (what only appears to be) light force, then why would you believe that Chi is needed.

So far I've read every post on this subject, and you've all pretty much figured it out. Keep in mind that these types of claims go back thousands of years. It was used as a way of intimidating the competition. 90% of all fighting is mental, and being able to get that edge over the compedition is essential. In feudal japan, where your power directly coresponded to the skills of your warriours, it came in very handy to spread rumors of supernatural powers. These claims instilled fear and respect among rivals. It's psychological warefare. These same myths still being used today to talk up senseis. Only difference is, now it's being used to promote a buisness instead of scare off the competition

EXAMPLE: While practicing Kenpo in California our dojo competed in several tournaments, which we did very well in. The tournaments have several different divisions fighting, team fight, forms, showmanship, weapons, etc. My specialty was fighting. Now, I am not very big and many of the matches I won were against people with more skill than I had. The one advantage I had was that I could frighten the apponent. I would growl when I attacked, intentionally knock the apponent out of the ring, stare him down, and smile after receaving his hardest hits. If I could have gotten away with claiming supernatural powers I would have :D. The whole point is to convince someone that you are something more than human. People fear that, and they pay good money to learn it
 
Skep said:
I've also seen similar feats done in one of those Musclemen for God type shows.
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Please, please, tell me you just made that concept up. Fakirs for Jesus?

Please, someone shoot me in the head...
 
sad but true.

They claim that god gives them the power to break chains, wooden bats, and tear phone books in half. Which I might believe if they weighed 110 and had the physique of a 14yr old boy. Instead they tend to look so filled with steroids that the could easily bench press my Ford Explorer.

P.S. there is a trick to tearing the phone books in half, that allows almost anyone to pull it off.
 
I saw these guys featured on some news show, doing their schtick in front of an audience of impressionable kids.

I'd have been more impressed if they were built more like skinny litte Jewish lads from the Middle East....
 
Operaider said:


P.S. there is a trick to tearing the phone books in half, that allows almost anyone to pull it off.
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Would it be an infringement on magician's if you told us how?
 
thaiboxerken said:
Would it be an infringement on magician's if you told us how?
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since i'm not a magician would i be able to explain it without anyone jumping down my throat?
 
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