IndoctriNATION movie

Slowvehicle said:
Whereas, of course, unsupported (and undefined) calumnies such as "leftist", "liberal", and "sexual pervert" are examples of the divine love taught by your MJ. I guess...



No, sir, I don't "say" you altered anything.

You misquoted me. Do not do it again.
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Fixed it for you.
 
logger said:
Slowvehicle there really is no point.
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What, in your idiosyncratic opinion, is a "liberal"?

What, in your idiosyncratic opinion, is a "leftist"?

Which, according to history, would have most closely described any one of the 1st Century C.E apocalyptic rabble-rousers (of which your HJ would have been one)?

Why do you think "sexual perversion" is a property of the "left"?

What about your MJ's confusion about the time of his "return"?

How, had it happened, would the crucifiction not have been "political"?

Why do you preach the MJ, but depend more upon the words attributed to "Paul", who never met him?

You could start there, or you could pull a Black Knight...

Same result.
 
logger said:
Fixed it for you.
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No, sweetie, you did not "fix" anything; you altered my words to flatter yourself. At least you were honest about it, this time...

In what way have you earned a title? Are you of the peerage? Have you your K?

It is interesting that you continue to avoid actual questions.
 
logger said:
Lol

Because your questions are stupid and a waste of time.
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What, in your idiosyncratic opinion, is a "liberal"?

What, in your idiosyncratic opinion, is a "leftist"?

Which, according to history, would have most closely described any one of the 1st Century C.E apocalyptic rabble-rousers (of which your HJ would have been one)?

Why do you think "sexual perversion" is a property of the "left"?

What about your MJ's confusion about the time of his "return"?

How, had it happened, would the crucifiction not have been "political"?

Why do you preach the MJ, but depend more upon the words attributed to "Paul", who never met him?

You could start there, or you could pull a Black Knight...

Same result.
 
Please remember to be civil and polite as well as to talk about the subject, not each other. A cleanout of this thread would not be enjoyable for anyone. Your adherence to the Membership Agreement is appreciated.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Loss Leader
 
logger said:
So what is the point then?
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The "point" would be to find out why (in movies such as the OP, in popular media, and from the pulpit) so many xians are so vocal about the "indoctrination" of not being able to force their superstitions upon others. As with other kinds of privilege, understanding why xians are so aggrieved is an important step in explaining to them why they do not get to impose their ways upon society at large.

It is important to keep perspective: no one in the USA is being forced NOT to be xian; NOT to practice xianity, or NOT to believe in (or practice) the tenets of their faith (whichever xian splinter sect it is). OTH, no one in the USA should be forced to pander to xians, to adopt xianity, or to be bound by the "rules" xians put in the mouth of their 'god'.

How very odd it is to realize that preparing students in public schools to deal with observable reality is considered "indoctrination" by groups who no longer have free rein to impose their own brands of "faith".
 
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logger said:
Yes, there won't be any excuse when you meet him.
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Christian reasoning always amazes me.

If I were to decide to follow in your God's footsteps and become a torturer, and I tortured myself first, would my victims then "have no excuse" when they meet me?

Um, I'm not going to be tortured.
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Your Christian doctrine says you deserve to be tortured, because your flawed design causes you to do things God doesn't like.

But you were let off the hook on a non sequitur technicality. Your status therefore looks pretty shaky to me. What if God, at some point in the coming eternity of looking at you and listening to your songs of praise, changes His mind about the sufficiency of your atonement by Jesus-torture?

After all, we both know it doesn't really make any sense, the way you got off the hook.

His timing not yours.
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It isn't His timing. Off by two millenia is off by two millenia. He was mythically talking to us when He said He'd be right back. A really smart God would have used our notion of time when talking to us about timing.

Nevermind the fact that the Messiah prophesy said nothing about Him going anywhere in the first place, or being tortured to death or anything. The Messiah was just going to kick ass, take names, and take over. That's why the Jews, whose religion it actually is, aren't buying the whole Jesus=Messiah thing.

Your response is an example of standard believer dodge 1A. The believer reasons that his God is way different from us and can do whatever He damn well pleases. Therefore it doesn't matter if anything the God purportedly said, promised, or did actually meshes with reality or not, because there wouldn't even be any reality if not for the mythical God. So there.

If anything does happen, by sheer chance, to stick to the reality wall, a great fanfare is made of the apparent truthiness of the God's Infallible Word. But all the other stuff that didn't stick to the reality wall is simply chalked up to His Divine All-Rightiness.

But, of course, unbelievers are held to an entirely different standard.
 
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logger said:
No, I'll continue to be a witness for Christ, you'll just have to deal with it. ;)
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You didn't witness anything. You read a weird story and found it compelling. That's not the same thing as witnessing something. Now , you're just telling us about the story and a god you invented by cherry picking certain parts, even though said god is logically inconsistent.
 
logger said:
There is only one reason for his sacrifice and that is because the penalty for sin is death.
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What sin did Jesus commit that earned him a death penalty?

Or was it your God, himself, that had sinned? Perhaps Jesus wasn't sacrificed for mankind. Perhaps he was sacrificed to mankind.
 
logger said:
Rogue, first of all, if you don't believe in his sacrifice, I not sure you're really a Christian.

The reason for Jesus's sacrifice is the central part of the Bible and is laid out in many ways. From the beginning to the end it tells about his coming with the culmination of his final sacrifice to atone for mans sin. Not covering sin with animal sacrifice, but true complete forgiveness.

There is only one reason for his sacrifice and that is because the penalty for sin is death.
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Under whose law? Who gave their consent to be governed under this rule? I certainly didn't. By what authority is this law enforced?
 
Craig4 said:
Under whose law? Who gave their consent to be governed under this rule? I certainly didn't. By what authority is this law enforced?
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The creator can make any rules He wants your consent is not needed just your abject, groveling worship. You should be glad He even notices a wretch like you and be grateful for any attention you get even if He sends you to hell because He loves you so much, you just want to ignore Gods' rules and indulge in all those evil desires like porn and homosex and drunkeness and sex parties with naked bodies entwining and coiling doing unspeakable things....excuse me, be right back./fundie off.
 
tsig said:
The creator can make any rules He wants your consent is not needed just your abject, groveling worship. You should be glad He even notices a wretch like you and be grateful for any attention you get even if He sends you to hell because He loves you so much, you just want to ignore Gods' rules and indulge in all those evil desires like porn and homosex and drunkeness and sex parties with naked bodies entwining and coiling doing unspeakable things....excuse me, be right back./fundie off.
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Not to turn this into a "Monty Python" sketch but I didn't vote for him. He can't even claim some watery tart threw a scimitar at him.
 
One premise the IndotriNATION movie relies on is that belief can be instilled into children by way of instruction.That we choose which worldview/moral system we want to impose and align education with it. So it's school as an extension of basic enculturation.

In a sense I think the move gets that right. But it also falls down a bit by insisting on a kind of evil agenda in play. The failure as I see it, is in thinking that not pressing for a system you think better is the same as pressing for a negative/evil position. Also, they only provide evidence (of a sort) where kids go wrong morally while still children. It would be a stronger case if they showed that society at large were going wrong because of all the kids we've run through the secular system - the majority have long ago become adults and able to operate in a larger arena.

From the evangelical Christian's point of view, has society slid down the slippery slope of immorality and licentiousness? Perhaps. Gay marriage and abortion might be touchstones here. I just don't see these moral choices as recent phenomena. If the evils from secularized education are what the movie claims, they've been with us for many decades.
 
Toontown said:
Christian reasoning always amazes me.
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Isn't it obvious, even by reading the comments of the relatively few believers in this thread, that Christianity is not a single religion?

Not all Christianities embrace the "Christ died for your sins" tenet. Maybe most of them do, at least as a matter of policy. It never made sense to me. Also it never made sense that God would want most people to burn in hell forever.

The word "Christian" in general U.S. usage has come to represent a certain spectrum within the vast range of beliefs and practices that fall broadly under the term "Christianity." Unfortunately the term Christian has (IMO) become a code word for "narrow minded."
 
marplots said:
From the evangelical Christian's point of view, has society slid down the slippery slope of immorality and licentiousness?
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From Cal Thomas's point of view, definitely. But he's felt that way forever.
 
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