Reb, jim, and Gary-
My rambling post generated responses- how ironic... Most of the time when I articulate and want to illicit responses, nobody responds..
Anyway...
Originally posted by Reb
How do you know without scanning for viruses? Not all virsuses/trojans leave visible signs of their presence.
How did you reach that conclusion? What is your definition of spyware?
Originally posted by jimlintott
When simply selecting an email can install a trojan or virus I don't think the user is to blame. The number one cause of viruses are the programmers who write them. Secondary to that are operating systems that have little to no security giving viruses and trojans an environment that they can flourish in.
The system should protect the user. The average person should not have to be an expert to avoid getting infected. Security should be fundamental to the OS not something that is achieved through third party software.
Originally posted by garys_2k
As for the lack of pop-ups, there is only a single explanation -- you haven't gone to any sites that use them. I submit that you visit a very few, select sites and don't browse or surf very much. As for the lack of viruses, what email client are you using? If Outlook, you MUST have set it differently than the default settings. As for spyware, some websites will do "drive by downloads" if you just visit them, if your security settings happen to allow it. Have you set yours to non-default values? Oh, and what browser do you use?
Says who? The experts say the number one cause is allowing Outlook or Office applications runs scripts and macros that are infected -- people (like yourself) who haven't bothered installing a virus checker.
That is a lie, sir. Zone Alarm was never, and is not, spyware of any type. Do you even have a clue what spyware is, or what Zone Alarm is for?
No, but maybe those that never run antivirus programs are.
Perhaps because you have no friends, and are not on anyone's Outlook mailing lists. That seems most probable.
Regarding:
1. Anti-virus programs
In the past I have installed Norton and McAfee anti-virus software, and found that although both provided file scanning ability etc.,
at some point both programs caused either system/office program/3rd party application crashes, and never once found a worm, trojan program, or virus
on any of my computers. Along with the constant need to update the virus definitions, I finally decided to not use either one. Obviously, if something appears to be out of whack on any of my computers, and I identified it to be a virus or worm etc.., running a virus check becomes a possibility...
In the last 7 years, I have consulted, programmed, diagnosed, and repaired or solved hundreds of different computer related problems-mostly for retailers and some personal users, with a large percentage of the trouble caused by a virus, trojan, or worm. In almost every case, these clients did have an anti-virus program installed and running on their system. The lack of updating their virus def files, opening a nasty email attachment, or a lack of proper security, either by a breach in the operating system or by fault of the user were all causes that their anti-virus program did not help and could not stop from happening.
As for who bears responsibility- the user, Microsoft, virus authors, or the computer tech guy, I can't agree with jimlintott's statement of "simply selecting an email can install a trojan or virus I don't think the user is to blame. The number one cause of viruses are the programmers who write them." Right. And the number one cause of automobile crashes are the autoworkers who build the cars. Secondary to that are the freeway and highway systems that have little to no safety giving the automobiles an environment that they can collide in.
The operating system, re: Microsoft Windows, surely has had and still does and always will have security problems. But to say little or no security is not true. Microsoft XP has a built in firewall and if activated, does protect the user. An average user does not have to be an expert to click a check box one time. No matter what Micosoft creates or updates in their system(s), there will always be a need for patches, updates etc.. This is reality. But to expect the system to protect users who blindly surf and click on unknown sites and allow installation of unknown programs in order to view the desired page, open unsolicited email attachments without thought, or do not use the available operating system protections, is an impossible notion.
2. Pop-ups, spyware, Zone Alarm and Outlook/ Office apps
Of course I get nailed occasionally by a few pop-up ads- but I usually do not go back to the sites who overdo it- there is always another site I can obtain whatever I was looking for, one without pop-ups. The pop-ups I was writing of previously are actually be called by another name. Most unprotected users get message pop-ups from port 135 thanks to Microsofts Messenger Spam service. These are harmless, yet annoying and frequent. But eliminated with ease without third party firewalls.
I do browse the Internet frequently, but mostly to sites I have established as safe, and I do customize my security settings in IE. I also do use Micosoft Outlook for my E-mail, which I receive 100's of emails per day on. And, yes some are actually from friends who kindly keep me in their address books.
Zone Alarm- Years ago, when it was first released, I reviewed, then installed Zone Alarm on my system. I cannot speak for the version currently being offered, but I can say as a statement of fact- The version I ran was created, operated and managed by a company named ZoneLabs. On January 11th, 2000, ZoneLabs announced that their "TrueVector" technology had been licensed to Media Metrix, a company that provides "consumer profiling" services to major Internet media users. This "TrueVector" technology also forms the foundation of the ZoneAlarm program, the company's very first application. Believe what you will.
After running the ZoneAlarm program for one day, it caused my system to not boot correctly, and displayed an error message upon boot-up. I traced the error message, went on-line, investigated and then looked for the uninstallation instructions for the Zone Alarm program. There were none to be found with the software! How amazing! I did manage to find detailed, explicit unistall instructions on the web, as well as instructions on how to properly remove certain files from my system placed there by ZoneAlarm. This was no easy task. I did succeed, and learned that the files that needed to be cautiously and manually removed were files that had nothing to do with the operation of the ZoneAlarm firewall program. They were... the files that make up the "TrueVector" technology that the ZoneAlarm program is based on. And what is the purpose of these files? First understand that these files ran as part of Windows upon boot-up and never stopped running while in Windows. These files were nothing other than a storage vault for your computer's activity, your download activity, etc.. and the file size grew quite a bit in just over one day. The information may not have ever been utilized or processed by ZoneLabs, but one thing is for sure- It was being accumalated on my machine- IF THIS WASN'T SPYWARE, THEN NOTHING EVER WAS OR IS.
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