Miggins
Thinker
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That`s not so bad I suppose, no need to take the kiddies along with you really though is there?
Not much meat on a squirrel I would`ve thought.
Not much meat on a squirrel I would`ve thought.
Actually, yes. It was a great bonding experience to go out and shoot paper targets with my dad. Those are memories I still cherish to this day. What's wrong with that?
I never hunted, but had friends that did. And yes, I have eaten some squirrel that they brought back. Tastes like chicken.
Mephisto
Philosopher
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I agree completely, and although I was raised and taught by hunters, I was never taught to kill indiscriminately. Hunting for my entire family (uncles, cousins, etc.) wasn't so much a sport as a method of feeding several families for a year.
Although I don't hunt any more (too many uncomfortable meat associations), I can understand the need to pass on especially those traditions which have ensured mankind's survival, but I'm against most "hunting traditions" in this country and those include BS traditions like Buffalo Bill, or making murderous outlaws "western legends." I also don't care much for rich men with expensive weapons and optics who travel abroad to pay some local "boy" money to shoot a big beautiful animal. To me, they're the same thing as the local rednecks with a pile of dead bunnies guffawing over their "skills."
billydkid
Illuminator
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When I was a kid wild game was regularly part of our table fare. Now, I suspect I would have a tough time choking down squirrel or rabbit and even venison if it is at all gamey.
bob_kark
Person of Hench
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It seems to me that so much time is wasted between the pro-gun control and anti-gun control sides. Guns simply will not go away in America in our lifetime. Personally, I don't have a problem with a mature, responsible citizen carrying a gun. But, the clear fact is that illegal gun use takes more lives than civillian gun use saves.
There has to be a common ground here and I think it would be as easy as simply enacting and enforcing stricter laws on illegal gun use. If you are in possession of a functional gun without a permit, manditory 5 year sentence. If you are caught in the act of using a gun in the process of committing a crime, manditory 20 year sentence added on to your sentence. If you sell guns illegally, manditory 5 year sentence per offense. These are all examples, but I believe they convey my point.
I know that this won't solve every problem surrounding gun violence. For example, domestic violence involving gun use would most likely stay the same, disgruntled employees would still be able to lose it and go on a shooting spree. However, these are situations where the criminal would most likely still commit these crimes with an alternative weapon. Anyway, it may not solve the problem, however, I think its at least heading down the right path.
There has to be a common ground here and I think it would be as easy as simply enacting and enforcing stricter laws on illegal gun use. If you are in possession of a functional gun without a permit, manditory 5 year sentence. If you are caught in the act of using a gun in the process of committing a crime, manditory 20 year sentence added on to your sentence. If you sell guns illegally, manditory 5 year sentence per offense. These are all examples, but I believe they convey my point.
I know that this won't solve every problem surrounding gun violence. For example, domestic violence involving gun use would most likely stay the same, disgruntled employees would still be able to lose it and go on a shooting spree. However, these are situations where the criminal would most likely still commit these crimes with an alternative weapon. Anyway, it may not solve the problem, however, I think its at least heading down the right path.
billydkid
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I might add, for all the high falutin talk about passing on tradition and so on, that hunting is fun and it is in our bones. There I have said it, it is fun to track down animals and it is fun to shoot at them. I haven't hunted for many years, but when I did, it was very exciting. It's great to make a good shot. It's cool to be able to trick a deer or to have your patience and stealth rewarded with a sack full of squirrels. I do have to admit, as a kid, I would often feel guilty and bad after I shot a little bunny or a duck, but, you know, killing is part of life and the fact is that everything that lives, lives off the death of other life.
ImaginalDisc
Penultimate Amazing
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While I agree with your premisies, I don't think there's any evidence that stricter penalties for illegal gun possesion will have a dramatic impact on violent crime. As you point out, there will still be plenty of crimes involving legally purchased guns, and in your scanerio a person who commits a crime with a legally registered gun faces less jail time than a person with an illegal gun. Ergo, if I want to commit violent crimes, it's to my benefit to buy a gun legally. That seems pretty odd.
Miggins
Thinker
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Remind me not to leave my cats with you when I go on holiday.
Those deer, I tells ya, despite having a brain the size of a peanut it`s dead cool to trick `em. I bet no pesky varmint squirrel would get the better of you in a game of chess either ! dagnabbitt!
Those deer, I tells ya, despite having a brain the size of a peanut it`s dead cool to trick `em. I bet no pesky varmint squirrel would get the better of you in a game of chess either ! dagnabbitt!
billydkid
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You've never hunted so you don't have a clue, yet you presume you do. The vast majority of deer hunters never bag a deer in their entire lives.
Seconded
bob_kark
Person of Hench
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Do you have any evidence stating that it won't make a dramatic impact? I won't claim to know that it would definately make a dramatic impact. However, it seems to be a better idea than continuing to argue that we need a handgun ban when it just won't happen or continuing to follow the status quo and just hope things improve. It certainly doesn't appear that it would hurt.
And as I also pointed out, these crimes are likely to still occur through other means.
As I said, there should be a 20 year manditory sentence added on to the sentence of a party found guilty of committing a crime while in using a gun, legal or otherwise.
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ImaginalDisc
Penultimate Amazing
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The anti-death penalty crowd has shown that the DP is no deterrent to crime. Increasing penalties for the use of a gun in crime, in the form of popular 10-20-Life systems has a lot of support. If you claim it'll help, please provide evidence. You're right, in that it certainly won't hurt, however.
And by the way, I never favored an outright ban on firearms. I pointed out that only some weapons, such as military hardware and automatic-fire weapons should be banned. A thirty-ought-six does just as good, or better, a job at shooting deer than an AK-47.
Miggins
Thinker
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Must admit, never felt the need to outwit a deer and fail.
Great...you just admitted that you jumped in and started blabbing your opinions on a topic you know nothing about. What's your next trick?
Miggins
Thinker
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Let me get this right, then, I have to actually have been a hunter to express my opinion that killing animals for fun isn`t nice, is that it?
Ergo- I must experience every single thing on the whole forum to have a thought, or a `blab` about it? is this what you mean?
And I do know a little bit about it because I was one of those spoilsport hunt protesters in this country who helped to get fox hunting banned.
Ergo- I must experience every single thing on the whole forum to have a thought, or a `blab` about it? is this what you mean?
And I do know a little bit about it because I was one of those spoilsport hunt protesters in this country who helped to get fox hunting banned.
bob_kark
Person of Hench
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Ok, make me do all the hard work...
From http://www.dcjs.virginia.gov/exile/?menuLevel=5
40% does seem pretty dramatic.
Have you ever been any other race than your own?
Have you ever been addicted to heroin?
Have you ever been on death row?
Have you ever committed suicide?
Have you ever talked to dead people?
No to all of these?
Then you can't speak out on racial issues, drug issues, penal issues, psychological issues, or paranormal issues.
Right?
Evidence?
I totally disagree with your last premise (what alternative weapon is a criminal using a gun going to otherwise use? A knife? A tire iron? In most cases that's hardly realistic) and might "tweak" some of your other ideas, but generally an excellent post.
It is handguns (and ridiculous things like uzis, etc) we need to focus on and tighten up on a GREAT deal IMO. Let hunters keep the rifles and such, negating that argument. Anyone saying "criminals could still use those" is technically correct, but it would still cut down on crimes/deaths/etc a lot, as they are not exactly easily concealed or as easy to just grab and bang away with.
Perfect solution? Hardly. But there is no such thing.
What drives me nuts are the reasons staunch anti-handgun control people use, like the my-Constitutional-right bit, or some absurd paranoia about the military taking over the country etc. Yeah right. Just admit you're into guns and the power trip that goes with it, and so want the right to own em whether you have a good reason or not. yeesh
No, you need to have actually had some exerience with shooting with a parent to state whether or not it is a good experience for parents and children to share. You are speaking from ignorance. Because YOU don't like guns, you think it is not a good experience for parents and kids to go shooting together. But you don't know what you are talking about, do you?