Cont: Greta Thunberg - brave campaigner or deeply disturbed - part 3

[Roger Ramjets]

Given the amount of hot air she produces, the hypothesis is tenable.

This is what it means to be a skeptic. Who cares about about facts and logic when there's an opportunity for sarcasm?

"Global warming is getting worse, therefore Greta Thunberg's activism is ineffective." is a fallacious argument.

The Greta Thunberg Effect: Familiarity with Greta Thunberg predicts intentions to engage in climate activism in the United States

Taken together, our results provide preliminary evidence in support of the “Greta Thunberg Effect.” Those who were more familiar with Greta Thunberg were more likely than those who were less familiar to intend to take collective action to reduce global warming.

Yes, global warming is getting worse. But it would be getting a lot more worse if nobody took action to reduce it. Greta Thunberg is only one voice out of 8 billion, but her influence is far greater than 1 in 8 billion. She's not the only one of course, but her contribution is significant. According to the research above this is a scientifio fact.

But of course that doesn't stop 'skeptics' from ignoring science in favor of throwaway insults to boost their egos.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

What's more deserving of Religious Fervor: Climate Change or the threat of the existence of transgender people?
There is a strong correlation between caring a lot about the latter and not caring about the former.


Tens of thousands of people will die in the commiting month because of heat waves made more severe by global warming.

 

[aniri]

So you disagree with her. Fine. You think she is privileged. So do I, so does she, and she could of course just keep her mouth shut and enjoy that privilege, and have a good time. Instead she speaks out about the things she cares about, trying to speak for those who are not as privileged as she is, and that is what you don't like? Apart from the fact that you think she should speak out about the things you care about, in the way you think would be intelligent. Isn't that your responsibility, not hers? She has picked her battles, the ones that matter to her, and as the saying almost goes; no one can fight every battle but everyone can fight one or two, possibly three. (Four shall not be the number, and five is right out. This has of course been known ever sinece the Holy Hand Grenade Crusade of Antioch)

I’ve already said: I believe their activities will ultimately benefit the forces that aim at destabilizing the western society. And, although the climate change is of course important, I also believe that the more imminent threat to this world is the global polarization and a (nuclear) war disaster. These two factors are interconnected and will affect us all, that’s why I cannot be indifferent to their activities.

I will stop here.

 

[aniri]

You do understand how utterly ludicrous your argument is, right?

You seem to be contending that a protest for one issue is obviated if one does not protest all issues? That is an utterly ridiculous argument? Surely you can see that?

See my previous post. I don't have anhything to add.

 

[arthwollipot]

What's more deserving of Religious Fervor: Climate Change or the threat of the existence of transgender people?

 

[theprestige]

Clean energy just put China’s CO2 emissions into reverse for first time

Thanks for the update.

 

[theprestige]

It's very easy to say that the changes that happened would have happened anyway. It's a bit like claiming that vaccines are unnecessary because hardly anyone gets polio nowadays.

I don't see the similarity at all, but that's okay. We're not talking about vaccines.

Did Thunberg ever claim that she, Greta Thunberg, she alone, could bring about "drastic emissions reductions quickly"? She was talking about the necessity of reducing emissions. And a lot of young people seem to have understood the message.

Everybody understood Greta's message. The point is that nobody acted on it. And of course she never claimed that she alone could bring about this change. That's why she asked for help from world leaders. What's baffling is that everyone celebrates her like she accomplished something, even though she failed at her goal of getting help to accomplish something.

By the way, when did she get "credit for much smaller changes"? I don't remember seeing or hearing anybody claim that China's reduction of CO2 emissions is due to Thunberg, and I think that she herself would be the first to call the idea absurd.

Tell it to Roger Ramjets.

It's a recurring theme: Point out that Thunberg believed immediate, drastic change was necessary, and people change the subject to minor, gradual changes instead. The exact changes that Thunberg said weren't enough.

If you want to see a monumental failure, you should look at the people allegedly making America great again. And they are a whole ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ movement, and one of them is the leader of the USA.

Or people just try to change the subject entirely.

I don't want to see a monumental failure. I just want you to tell me what monumental success(es) Greta Thunberg has had, in terms of real change in the world because of her advocacy. She advocated for real changes to global economic activity and GHG emissions. Those changes didn't happen. She advocated for real changes to the Israeli blockade of Gaza and treatment of Palestinians. Those changes didn't happen.

As far as I can tell, the two real changes she's made in the world have been a change in air travel behavior among Swedes, and a change in school attendance - a change for the worse - among minor children. Am I missing anything? Has she changed the situation in Ukraine? Made a dent in homophobia?

 

[Hercules56]

Bringing more attention to the IDFascist inhumane and cruel food embargo upon Gaza is ALWAYS a good thing.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

Bringing more attention to the IDFascist inhumane and cruel food embargo upon Gaza is ALWAYS a good thing.

Yeah, that's really worked out well.

 

[Hercules56]

Yeah, that's really worked out well.

It brought more attention, mission accomplished.

 

[theprestige]

Bringing more attention to the IDFascist inhumane and cruel food embargo upon Gaza is ALWAYS a good thing.

It brought more attention, mission accomplished.

If anyone wonders what I mean by "cargo cult activism", this is a good example.

 

[Hercules56]

If anyone wonders what I mean by "cargo cult activism", this is a good example.

"There is no such thing as bad publicity"

 

[theprestige]

"There is no such thing as bad publicity"

This is what cargo cult activists actually believe. Meanwhile you can't point to a single significant change in the world, that is attributed to Thunberg and her publicity.

But at least she's not vandalizing the commons. Yet.

 

[Hercules56]

This is what cargo cult activists actually believe. Meanwhile you can't point to a single significant change in the world, that is attributed to Thunberg and her publicity....

Is that how we measure the value of a public act or statement, whether it has changed the world or not??

 

[theprestige]

Is that how we measure the value of a public act or statement, whether it has changed the world or not??

If its stated goal is to change the world, then yes.

Measuring the quality of an effort by how successful it is in achieving its stated goal is pretty basic, critical thinking 101 type stuff, in my opinion.

How do you judge the quality of Greta's attention-seeking, if not in terms of whether it makes a difference?

I mean, look: Greta wanted to change the world. She did everything in her power to change the world. She had unprecedented access to the global power elites, and she made the absolute most of that access.

Her efforts were for naught, but she sure tried her hardest. Good on her for trying. No shame in that game.

But shame on you for celebrating her failure as if it were some kind of success. Shame on her fan club, for turning her valiant effort into a mere validation of cargo cult activism.

And, coming full circle, shame on her for embracing the cargo cult, instead of turning her efforts towards things that could actually make a change.

Gazans have a surfeit of publicity. The last thing they need is more publicity. What they need is aid. And peace. But Greta and her fan club have no idea how to contribute to those things. So they settle for making a spectacle, and patting themselves on the back for having "done something".

 

[jt512]

As far as I can tell, the two real changes she's made in the world have been a change in air travel behavior among Swedes, and a change in school attendance - a change for the worse - among minor children. Am I missing anything? Has she changed the situation in Ukraine? Made a dent in homophobia?

Or a dent in climate change? No.

 

[theprestige]

Or a dent in climate change? No.

I know, right?

But to hear Greta's fan club tell it, China changed their emissions profile because the Deeply Disturbed Brave Campaigner told them to.

 

[arthwollipot]

Once again using the words of the misogynistic far-right shock jock bigot.

 

[jt512]

I know, right?

But to hear Greta's fan club tell it, China changed their emissions profile because the Deeply Disturbed Brave Campaigner told them to.

Perhaps they can show us the point on this chart where she had that influence on China.

 

[Matthew Best]

Perhaps
they can show us the point on this chart where she had that influence on China.

Who's "they"?