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Genetics and Genesis

The Thrasher

New Blood
T
Joined
Jun 22, 2003
Messages
14
Recently I was pondering the book of Genesis in the bilble and I stumbled upon an intersting question. The book states that all of humanity decended from Adam and Eve. It is my understanding that children of sibilings tend to have severe birth defects.
So, isn't this yet another whole in the creationist myth? If you tried to produce humanity from only two people via sexual reproduction wouldn't the group eventually die as a result of birth defects?
 
Not necessarily.

If you're going to go with the Genesis story, you could probably also assume that Adam and Eve were genetically perfect, and that any genetic defects came later.
 
Who says all of humanity would have had to descend from Adam and Eve?

See: http://www.besse.at/sms/descent.html (from the book: Science made Stupid)

Actually, the same problem can also be applied to animals that Noah brought onto the Ark. (If he brought 2 of everything, then all animal species would have had to have their offspring breed.)
 
Segnosaur said:
Who says all of humanity would have had to descend from Adam and Eve?

See: http://www.besse.at/sms/descent.html (from the book: Science made Stupid)

Actually, the same problem can also be applied to animals that Noah brought onto the Ark. (If he brought 2 of everything, then all animal species would have had to have their offspring breed.)
Click to expand...

Great site link...:D
 
As much as it would be nice, I don't think that you're going to get anywhere with the idea.

First, believers will believe.

Second, there is some evidence that not-quite-inbreeding actually doesn't hurt a species and to some extent helps it.

Finally, if we're to hypothesize adam and eve in the first place, why not hypothesize that they're perfect, and that everything since then is the act of satan?

No, I don't buy that, but you're not trying to convince me on this one.
 
Actually there is the missing text in Genesis, the account of the eight day where god made Juan Carlos the greens keeper and Larry, Adams golf partner. Most apoligests don't like to talk about it but this is where the extra genetic meterial came from. Evedently Eve wanted more then a bite of one apple.
 
If we were all related, a'la Adam and Eve...wouldn't we all share the same mitocondrial (sp?) DNA?

I recall (I think) that shared DNA across the human race has been traced back to "Lucy" in Africa (well before the biblical time frame...does anyone know?). IF A&E were sometime within the Six thousand years or so (given the fundies' time frame) shouldn't we have more shared DNA than currently exists....

I know I am missing some of the subtleties of DNA analysis...please help....
 
Paul C. Anagnostopoulos said:
Didn't some other humans pop up out of nowhere, too? Who did Cain and Abel marry?

~~ Paul
Click to expand...

I thought Abel was killed and had no offspring. *Checks book* Ah, I was right.

Cain must have met more than just a woman out there, or he could possibly be a megalomaniac:

Genesis 4:17
Cain lay with his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch.
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And hopefully there were someone else around for Seth to marry.

Genesis 4:25
Adam lay with his wife again, and she gave birth to a son and named him Seth, saying, "God has granted me another child in place of Abel, since Cain killed him."
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And if there was, maybe this lot didn't interbreed all that much.

Genesis 5
3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4 After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5 Altogether, Adam lived 930 years, and then he died.
6 When Seth had lived 105 years, he became the father [2] of Enosh. 7 And after he became the father of Enosh, Seth lived 807 years and had other sons and daughters. 8 Altogether, Seth lived 912 years, and then he died.

And on until Noah arrives as the ninth generation
Click to expand...

And this has to be true. No one would make up such accurate data for a mythical origin of their people.
 
arcticpenguin said:
Not necessarily.

If you're going to go with the Genesis story, you could probably also assume that Adam and Eve were genetically perfect, and that any genetic defects came later.
Click to expand...
"And folks, lets not forget who sinned first. Ladies, do you have to eat everything?" - Gallagher
 
jj said:

Second, there is some evidence that not-quite-inbreeding actually doesn't hurt a species and to some extent helps it.
Click to expand...
There's an article in the current Discover magazine on this. They say in most casers it should be OK for first cousins to marry.

Why this is being emphasized during the Bush presidency, I don't know.
 
Not having refreshed my memory on this, but isn't there the 'mitochondrial Eve' theory anyway, that we're all descended from the same woman tens or hundreds of thousands of years ago?

I guess you could also argue from the Biblical account that in fact there were descendents of Adam & Eve who were a bit degenerate, like Esau the hairy chap, but that it all came right in the end?

Maybe God intervened genetically - what a great Bloke :rolleyes:
 
Paul C. Anagnostopoulos said:
Didn't some other humans pop up out of nowhere, too? Who did Cain and Abel marry?

~~ Paul
Click to expand...

Interesting story behind this.

The Bible's Genesis is indeed a 'trimmed' version. The mythos around the time (Genesis is based on the stories used by all three of the major monotheistic religions) talked about Lilith, as well as other children.

Cain and Abel were twins - not to each other, but to sisters. To avoid inbreeding (haha), Adam paired them up with the other's sister.

In fact, on of the early pre-Islamic myths tells of Abel being killed by a rather jealous Cain because he got the ugly one.

Besides, why are we picking holes in Creationist logic? It's like finding the holes in a block of swiss cheese, and about as much fun...

Athon
 
Don't forget, if Adam, Eve, and Cain were the only people alive right after Cain killed his brother, than why is Cain worried that other people will see him and decide to kill him?
 
headscratcher4 said:
If we were all related, a'la Adam and Eve...wouldn't we all share the same mitocondrial (sp?) DNA?

I recall (I think) that shared DNA across the human race has been traced back to "Lucy" in Africa (well before the biblical time frame...does anyone know?). IF A&E were sometime within the Six thousand years or so (given the fundies' time frame) shouldn't we have more shared DNA than currently exists....

I know I am missing some of the subtleties of DNA analysis...please help....
Click to expand...

There's some evidence for a mitochondrial "Eve" that all humans are the genetic progeny of. There's still some debate. Here's an essy from Talk Origins
 
rwald said:
Don't forget, if Adam, Eve, and Cain were the only people alive right after Cain killed his brother, than why is Cain worried that other people will see him and decide to kill him?
Click to expand...

Because Cain was a raving paranoid?
 
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