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Dyslexia

Heh...same old Claus, not thinking the rules of skepticism apply to him. Guess some people just never change.

Better yet, let´s have an n=3 sample of Zep, Geni and Shanek. How long have they been driving, how many accidents have they caused, how many people have they killed and injured, how much property damage have they caused.

23 years including learning/permit years before getting my actual license, no accidents caused by me (2 caused by other drivers), no deaths, no injuries, total property damage a $20 mailbox plus my labor to put it back up. If we're including one's own property, then I also whacked off my passenger side-view mirror once; no cost to fix other than my own labor.
 
Heh...same old Claus, not thinking the rules of skepticism apply to him. Guess some people just never change.



23 years including learning/permit years before getting my actual license, no accidents caused by me (2 caused by other drivers), no deaths, no injuries, total property damage a $20 mailbox plus my labor to put it back up. If we're including one's own property, then I also whacked off my passenger side-view mirror once; no cost to fix other than my own labor.

I left out the trivial stuff on purpose. I mean, I´ve done $7500 of damage, so some scratches on the front bumber aren´t going to be any big deal in addition to that.
 
Check out the book, "Smart, But Feeling Dumb", by Dr. Harold Levinson -- who for years has been successfully treating dyslexia with the use of motion-sickness medications.

It works: I had a failing, disruptive grade schooler, who right before going into junior high school went to Dr. Levinson for evaluation and get a prescription for two kinds of motion sickness pills. The result: my son got into Drew University and graduated with a B+ average!
 
Your newest outpost? Get this straight, CrocBoy: You are a subject of the Danish Crown, not the other way around.

(Isn't that ultimately better than being a subject of Lizzie the Brit?)
I'm surprised you of all people continue to delude yourself so. Who has the bigger population, the bigger area, the bigger...well, you know. Actually, I'm one of those weirdo "republicans", who sees no reason why an Australian cannot be our head of state. Not some grand dame, gracious though she may be, from another country on the other side of the planet.



You can't find your way home from the local bar? That's not dyslexia.....
There isn't one here. Maybe a local bottle shop, but that's about it. I have to go into Parramatta to find a pub...


Hey, remember I said I would try to find that article on Dyslexia? Well, I found it: Dyslexia, Sally E. Shaywitz, Scientific American November 1996. Preview online

Very interesting read, that one.
 
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Better yet, let´s have an n=3 sample of Zep, Geni and Shanek. How long have they been driving, how many accidents have they caused, how many people have they killed and injured, how much property damage have they caused.

Then let´s take an n=3 control group of Claus... myself... and, say... Mycroft. Same questions.

Let´s start with my own data:
Not dyslexic, driving for 9 years now, 1 accident, no dead or injured people, ~$7,500 damage


Spit it out, gentlemen!

Dyslexic (to say the least)

Driving for, um, 35 years. Lots of highway, commuting, mountain, city, expressway, you-name-it driving. Put at least 100K miles on 5 cars in succession.

6 accidents. None attributable to me. Injuries, mild in one case only. Cost: 2 totalled cars, both older. Several repairs to cars.

N.B. In 4 of those 6 accidents, the car I was operating was not moving, and was, rather, stopped properly at a light/stop sign or parked. One of them was thanks to somebody entering a parking lot through the exit. In one of them, a drunk driver crashed a light and drove in front of me when I had a green light. In the other one, a very new driver left-turned through a red left turn light in front of me in a high-speed intersection.

I presume the "tree fell on car during storm" and "garage door mechanism broke" events do not count as automobile accidents? (Tree fell on car is obvious, the dent is still in the trunk of the targetmobile, and the garage door broke a spring and bashed up the top of the same car while I was backing out of the garage.)

The targetmobile has been hit 3 times while stopped, NOT COUNTING the tree and the garage door. There is a dent or a ding in every body panel (counting each of the 4 doors as a separate panel), but nothing serious. If I was superstitious I'd say it had bad karma. As it is, I think people just don't notice dark green cars sitting there perfectly obviously with lights, stop lights, etc, on, engine running, etc...
 
I can't get a grip on whether this is just a memorization problem, or something more interesting about abstract concepts. I know he has memorization issues; he didn't manage to memorize his multiplication facts after three years of trying. On the other hand, he has no trouble remembering, for example, where every object in the house is.

If it's like me, or my one offspring, it's simply a question of associating the right word with the right concept. Lead into the concept somehow and you may get the whole answer spilled at you.

It could, of course, be different. I can do multiplication, but I do it via various algebraic/arithmetic exploits wherein I can FIGURE OUT the answer, rather than "remember" it.

You might try teaching him to remember things by function, rather than name-tag, and to work on attaching the name tag to things via their function or characteristics.

Then again, he could have some different difficulty. I certainly can't tell from here, and I'm not an expert in anyone's issues with this beyond my own and my offspring's.
 
Yes! Me!

I can remember accurate "maps" of places in my head for years, after being there only once. Even in the USA! And I can navigate over most of Sydney (actually, Australia) without using a directory. And yet I still cannot accurately remember the names of the few streets in our little suburb... :blush:


I so understand, dude, I so understand.

I can draw you a map to get from here to there, no problem. Don't ask me the street names, don't ask me the left/right at each turn, but follow the arrows and the line and you'll get there, pronto and efficiently.
 
If it's like me, or my one offspring, it's simply a question of associating the right word with the right concept. Lead into the concept somehow and you may get the whole answer spilled at you.

It could, of course, be different. I can do multiplication, but I do it via various algebraic/arithmetic exploits wherein I can FIGURE OUT the answer, rather than "remember" it.

You might try teaching him to remember things by function, rather than name-tag, and to work on attaching the name tag to things via their function or characteristics.

Then again, he could have some different difficulty. I certainly can't tell from here, and I'm not an expert in anyone's issues with this beyond my own and my offspring's.
jj, see the Scientific American article I referenced for Claus? Can I recommend that you go to a library and find that issue, and photocopy the article. It has a very good explanation about the issue of word versus visual recognition for dyslexics - it's to do with a "Phonological model of dyslexia" hypothesis. And when was reading it, I found myself going "Yeah! That's SO me!" :)
 
Kind of...the funny thing is that she recently tested at 98% comprehension but only read 2 out of every 3 words on the test. No clue how she does it!

I do that, but very fast. I remember that when I had to read out loud (something I still hate doing) I'd replace all the missing words with synonyms. It caused huge problems when I had to take a typing test a few years back, I couldn't tell when I'd replaced a word with its synonym.

I think the way I just grab incomplete patterns and fill them rather than reading the letters is responsible for my poor spelling* as well, it's probably done wonders for my abstract reasoning though.

I am enjoying this thread, transposing left and right, reversing letters and numbers, placing errors etc. .

I did all that, and used to confuse yes and no when I talked, although I never had any problems with reading comprehension or maths.
*which has recently improved, over the last year, due to me posting on the internet.
 
Well, reading only 2/3 words but knowing the words in the middle by meaning is not that surprising. If your brain processes the words into MEANING instead of "spelling", that's what one would expect.

Yes, I do that a lot, too. Hence why I almost always say "quote paraphrased, meaning retained" when I quote anything from memory.
 
Better yet, let´s have an n=3 sample of Zep, Geni and Shanek. How long have they been driving, how many accidents have they caused, how many people have they killed and injured, how much property damage have they caused.

Then let´s take an n=3 control group of Claus... myself... and, say... Mycroft. Same questions.

Let´s start with my own data:
Not dyslexic, driving for 9 years now, 1 accident, no dead or injured people, ~$7,500 damage


Spit it out, gentlemen!

driving 3 years

0 accidents, no dead or injured people, 0 damage

But then I don't drive much and when I do I tend to stick to major roads.
 
I have trouble with the words left and right too. I tend to associate the word 'left' with the side of the road I drive on (I'm in the UK) so I get on okay at home, but when driving abroad I still drive safely but I give and take mirror-image directions if I don't pause and think it through carefully.

On the other hand, I think I acclimatise to driving on the wrong side much better than most people (especially if I'm on my motorbike as the vehicle itself is less 'handed' than a car). Friends and colleagues have told me that they find road junctions, and especially roundabouts, to 'feel peculiar' when they're driving abroad, but to me there is no difference.

I've only had one accident that was my fault in all my years of motoring, and that didn't involve any other vehicles: I was just driving too fast on a slippy road, skidded into a ditch and somersaulted the car. This had nothing to do with any left/right confusion.

I can read text upside down, sideways, mirror imaged, or upside down and mirror imaged, etc., almost as fast as I read regular text - though I've never found this to be a particularly useful skill.

I think the 'no left turn' sign in words is stupid, and is more dangerous for people who can't read, or for whom English is not their first language than it is for people like me who sometimes muddle the words 'left' and 'right'.

qb.php

:teacher:
 
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and some of us will just click the "quote" button to read it.
 
Interestingly, my reversal is only on output, I have quite some trouble reading mirror script, although I can generate it trivially by hand.
 
"I am fully aware of the shortcomings of directional clues that consist of only words, and not pictograms. The latter are far more efficient than the written words.

I have never understood the penchant for writing "WALK" and "STOP" at a crosswalk. Use icons, dimwits....
CFL"


Claus, that statement alone tells me that your brain and mine model the world rather differently. I find most icon type signs so useless, that I have walked into womens' toilets, run the wrong software, parked in the wrong place, boiled shirts which should have been dry cleaned, etc., for most of my life. Maybe it's the good readers who are a danger in traffic.
I can READ, for Ed's sake! I stopped using picture books when I was four!
(I can't type, but that's a different issue).

Yes, I can use stupid hyeroglyphic signs if I have to - in Arabic or Asian countries for instance, where I can't read the script, but I have to think about them. I'm picture blind, whatever the heck that's called. I don't know what I look like till I look in the mirror - and I forget again about two minutes later, unless I actually describe myself in words. I don't bother with an avatar, because I truly can't understand why anyone would. I would probably not recognise it.
On the other hand, I'm an excellent map reader, because I studied the subject till I was.

I learned to read so young I don't really recall doing it. I have memories, but I think they are from stories I was told much later. My first day in school, the teacher gave out reading books. She then went round the class several times doling out jotters, pencils etc. About orbit five, I gave her the reading book back, having finished it.
Whether my brain was hard wired better to cope with text than pictures, or whether it was trained that way by my early learning, I don't know. I do know I ended up unable to visualise and with no love of diagrams and pictures.
I wonder if people who happen to acquire pictorial or spatial ability early,- the artists and sportsmen- simply bias their brains that way and are thereafter considered dyslexic because they have selected a different neural bias?
 
I"m not sure. I know Yale, which is right now the leader in dyslexic studies, has found a very strong family factor. There just simply isn't a single type of "Dyslexic". Some can do numbers ok, some words better than numbers...but oddly the same "type" of dyslexia seems to run in families.
 
Claus, that statement alone tells me that your brain and mine model the world rather differently.

It's not how my brain models the world. I'm speaking from a general POV.

I find most icon type signs so useless, that I have walked into womens' toilets

I've done that, too. Hopefully, from different reasons... ;)

run the wrong software

I can't tell you. It is still a state secret.

parked in the wrong place

Never. But I have had my moments.

boiled shirts which should have been dry cleaned, etc.

Do not wash blue socks with white ones.

Maybe it's the good readers who are a danger in traffic.

No, it's not that. It's all about recognizing signs. Be they pictograms or words.

I can READ, for Ed's sake! I stopped using picture books when I was four!

I started reading before that.

(I can't type, but that's a different issue).

Use your tail. It helps me tremendously.

Yes, I can use stupid hyeroglyphic signs if I have to - in Arabic or Asian countries for instance, where I can't read the script, but I have to think about them. I'm picture blind, whatever the heck that's called.

No, you're not. Because if you were, you wouldn't be able to either read or write.

I don't know what I look like till I look in the mirror

I have my name pasted on the bathroom mirror. Just so I know who the face is, staring at me each morning....

and I forget again about two minutes later, unless I actually describe myself in words. I don't bother with an avatar, because I truly can't understand why anyone would.

Advertising, baby! :)

I would probably not recognise it.

Sure, you can. Don't you recognize the SkepticReport logo?

On the other hand, I'm an excellent map reader, because I studied the subject till I was.

In which case, you are certainly not "picture blind".

I learned to read so young I don't really recall doing it.

Me too.

I have memories, but I think they are from stories I was told much later. My first day in school, the teacher gave out reading books. She then went round the class several times doling out jotters, pencils etc. About orbit five, I gave her the reading book back, having finished it.

At 5 (Danish kids start school in the year they are 7), I took a sort of ability test, to see if I qualified for pre-school. It was all about pictures. I kept thinking "When do people start teaching me something? I already know how to read. Stupidos." I never got over that.

Whether my brain was hard wired better to cope with text than pictures, or whether it was trained that way by my early learning, I don't know. I do know I ended up unable to visualise and with no love of diagrams and pictures.

Don't tell me you don't surf for porn.

I wonder if people who happen to acquire pictorial or spatial ability early,- the artists and sportsmen- simply bias their brains that way and are thereafter considered dyslexic because they have selected a different neural bias?

I doubt that. The earliest imprinting occurs when we learn how to recognize our mother's face. It is so important that if we don't learn it, we will probably die.
 
I"m not sure. I know Yale, which is right now the leader in dyslexic studies, has found a very strong family factor. There just simply isn't a single type of "Dyslexic". Some can do numbers ok, some words better than numbers...but oddly the same "type" of dyslexia seems to run in families.

[Swedish accent ON]

I vent to Yale, too.

I yust got out yesterday.

[Swedish accent OFF]
 
"I am fully aware of the shortcomings of directional clues that consist of only words, and not pictograms. The latter are far more efficient than the written words.

I have never understood the penchant for writing "WALK" and "STOP" at a crosswalk. Use icons, dimwits....
CFL"


Claus, that statement alone tells me that your brain and mine model the world rather differently. I find most icon type signs so useless, that I have walked into womens' toilets, run the wrong software, parked in the wrong place, boiled shirts which should have been dry cleaned, etc., for most of my life. Maybe it's the good readers who are a danger in traffic.
I can READ, for Ed's sake! I stopped using picture books when I was four!
(I can't type, but that's a different issue).

Yes, I can use stupid hyeroglyphic signs if I have to - in Arabic or Asian countries for instance, where I can't read the script, but I have to think about them. I'm picture blind, whatever the heck that's called. I don't know what I look like till I look in the mirror - and I forget again about two minutes later, unless I actually describe myself in words. I don't bother with an avatar, because I truly can't understand why anyone would. I would probably not recognise it.
On the other hand, I'm an excellent map reader, because I studied the subject till I was.

I learned to read so young I don't really recall doing it. I have memories, but I think they are from stories I was told much later. My first day in school, the teacher gave out reading books. She then went round the class several times doling out jotters, pencils etc. About orbit five, I gave her the reading book back, having finished it.
Whether my brain was hard wired better to cope with text than pictures, or whether it was trained that way by my early learning, I don't know. I do know I ended up unable to visualise and with no love of diagrams and pictures.
I wonder if people who happen to acquire pictorial or spatial ability early,- the artists and sportsmen- simply bias their brains that way and are thereafter considered dyslexic because they have selected a different neural bias?


I'm with Soapy on this one, though I'm not quite so picutre blind. I think it's a matter of how we're wired, more than anything else. I can be very visual in some ways, but icons always seem horribly ambiguous. I want text. If there were a version of DOS that ran Windows programs from the command line, I'd use it. I have a similar problem with languages. I can't confidently say a word until I know how it is spelled.

I have a friend who is at least borderline dyslexic. He can't spell well, reads slowly and is very visual. We are both mechanical tinkerers, and have an almost insurmountable barrier in communication, because he can visualize entire structures in his head but when he describes them they make no sense to me until I have the terminology in terms of up, down, left, right, in and out . We go on and on, trying to communicate, and usually it ends with my saying something like, "Oh, you mean the frammis turns counterclockwise at right angles from the gazookus! Now I get it."
 

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