Does Putin think America is weak?

Puppycow said:
This is what the fuss is all about?

Gay, lesbian troops perform in drag at Kadena Air Base fundraiser

As a veteran myself, I don't mind a bit! Sounds like the troops there don't either. Sold-out show, more than twice what they anticipated. Only positive comments in the Stars & Stripes article. The negative comments mostly seem to be coming from old, right-wing civilians (some vets among them to be sure).

I wonder what sort of result you would get now from a poll of service members on the issue. I tried to find something from this year or last year, but my Google fu failed. Lots of polls of the general public, but none of service members on this issue. I guess once DADT was repealed, everyone sort of forgot about it and it was on to the marriage issue.
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Isn't there an musical with My Favorite Martian (Ray Walston) and others performing as women on a base in WWII. Bali Hai or something
 
Shouldn't this be in the "Right wing nuttery" thread? Ostensibly it's about whether Putin thinks America is weak but then goes on to quote some nutty statements from media personalities about LGBT parades in the military. This is YARWAT (Yet Another Right Wing Attack Thread) and and we already have a dedicated RWAT.

Having said that, to answer the supposed question of the thread: No. Putin isn't a fool but he knows that we aren't likely to push too hard over (The?) Ukraine. So he can score some political points back home without paying too high a price.
 
Puppycow said:
This is what the fuss is all about?

Gay, lesbian troops perform in drag at Kadena Air Base fundraiser

As a veteran myself, I don't mind a bit! Sounds like the troops there don't either. Sold-out show, more than twice what they anticipated. Only positive comments in the Stars & Stripes article. The negative comments mostly seem to be coming from old, right-wing civilians (some vets among them to be sure).

I wonder what sort of result you would get now from a poll of service members on the issue. I tried to find something from this year or last year, but my Google fu failed. Lots of polls of the general public, but none of service members on this issue. I guess once DADT was repealed, everyone sort of forgot about it and it was on to the marriage issue.
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With the anti-gay stuff going on in Russua, I would think gay US soldiers would have a greater motive to go in and kick arse.
 
xjx388 said:
Shouldn't this be in the "Right wing nuttery" thread? Ostensibly it's about whether Putin thinks America is weak but then goes on to quote some nutty statements from media personalities about LGBT parades in the military. This is YARWAT (Yet Another Right Wing Attack Thread) and and we already have a dedicated RWAT.

Having said that, to answer the supposed question of the thread: No. Putin isn't a fool but he knows that we aren't likely to push too hard over (The?) Ukraine. So he can score some political points back home without paying too high a price.
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Just because Travis volunteered to make a general right wing nuttery thread doesn't mean that's a forum rule. In fact, the easiest way to stop the flood of right wing nuttery threads is to reduce the amount of right wing nuttery.

We're heading for the Wingularity, so unfortunately you can only expect the thread count to rise until we hit Peak Wingnut.
 
I wonder if all the homosexuals in Crimea are pooping their pants right now
 
Has anyone stopped to ask the question: Why is it in the interest of the U.S. that Crimea, which is populated by 80% Russian people, and was part of Russia before it was signed over to the Ukraine Soviet Republic in 1954, continue to be part of the Ukraine, and not Russia, even though a majority of its population would prefer to be part of Russia?

This is a case where the U.S. clearly has no vital interest and should not interfere. It is like just like the Republicans position that anything Obama favors we must be against. Just substitute Putin for Obama.


IXP
 
Alferd_Packer said:
Ah, back when men were men and women were dames.
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330px-Dame_Edna_%286959716988%29.jpg
 
Getting back to the OP, I am not sure what is going on in the Crimea or the Ukraine is any indication that Putin thinks we are weak. I think he firmly believe that there is little we can do and little Europe will do to stop him. Unfortunately, he is right. We do not have a lot of options to exercise to strongly oppose him without getting involved in a war with Russia.
 
IXP said:
Has anyone stopped to ask the question: Why is it in the interest of the U.S. that Crimea, which is populated by 80% Russian people,
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49% EDIT: And that's those who are ethnically Russian, those that are Russian citizens is going to be much smaller.

and was part of Russia before it was signed over to the Ukraine Soviet Republic in 1954,
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So hasn't been part of Russia for more than a generation

continue to be part of the Ukraine, and not Russia, even though a majority of its population would prefer to be part of Russia?
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The 'unite with Russia' party got 4% of the vote. There is nowhere near even a sizable minority of people there that would prefer to be part of Russia and polls continue to show they wish to remain an autonomous part of the Ukraine.

This is a case where the U.S. clearly has no vital interest and should not interfere. It is like just like the Republicans position that anything Obama favors we must be against. Just substitute Putin for Obama.


IXP
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There is also the treaty that says we have to have an interest in it, apart from all the other aspects which you appear to be mistaken about. Then there is the principle of the thing as well. The US ties to the EU make it our business if nothing else too.
 
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IXP said:
Has anyone stopped to ask the question: Why is it in the interest of the U.S. that Crimea, which is populated by 80% Russian people, and was part of Russia before it was signed over to the Ukraine Soviet Republic in 1954, continue to be part of the Ukraine, and not Russia, even though a majority of its population would prefer to be part of Russia?

This is a case where the U.S. clearly has no vital interest and should not interfere. It is like just like the Republicans position that anything Obama favors we must be against. Just substitute Putin for Obama.


IXP
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So, borders and treaties are meaningless? We should just let Russia do whatever they want because we'd rather watch TV shows about Kim Kardashian's wedding ring?
 
A lot of experts on the Russia say that Putin is getting most of his information from the Russian Intelligence souces which have a very heavy Militant Russian Nationalist bias..in other words, Yes Men...and he is making decison based on really bad info. He might really think the US is weak.
Sad to see this thread descend into yet another Dem vs GOP spitting contests.
 
IXP said:
Has anyone stopped to ask the question: Why is it in the interest of the U.S. that Crimea, which is populated by 80% Russian people, and was part of Russia before it was signed over to the Ukraine Soviet Republic in 1954, continue to be part of the Ukraine, and not Russia, even though a majority of its population would prefer to be part of Russia?

This is a case where the U.S. clearly has no vital interest and should not interfere. It is like just like the Republicans position that anything Obama favors we must be against. Just substitute Putin for Obama.


IXP
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Ah, the Ron Paul viewpoint.

Just subsitute Czechoslovakia for Crimea,Germany for Russia,and the UK for the U.S. and you have a perfect statement for the Appeasers in Britian in 1938.
It amusing to see Ron Paul,who makes such a big thing about individual liberty, carrying the water for Putin.
 
Travis said:
And can anyone actually point to something Obama did that would have in any way made Putin think America is somehow a weakling that can be pushed around?
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The uprising in Libya. The uprising in Egypt. The attack in Benghazi. The uprising in Syria. The weakening of sanctions on Iran.

Those are four things that spring immediately to mind, as perhaps giving the impression that Obama's response to Russian aggression might be tepid, lethargic, and inconclusive. At best, as in Libya, he'll let Europe take the lead. If Putin thinks he can make a profitable deal with them, that effectively takes American power off the table. At worst, as in Syria, he'll let Russia take the lead. All very well when it's the fox coaching the watchdog, something else entirely when it's the fox guarding the henhouse!

Ironically, America's military is probably the strongest it's ever been. With the backing of its NATO allies, the US could make any incursion into the Ukraine too costly to be worth Putin's trouble. Of course, it would be very costly for the US as well, and when the nuclear arsenals are taken into consideration, it's highly unlikely that Obama would ever seriously consider using the US military to thwart Russian aggression in the Ukraine. Certainly Obama has never given any sign of being willing to do so. So yeah, that's gotta look pretty weak to a man who's willing to put boots on the ground to get what he wants.

What have been Obama's signature military endeavors? Drawing down Iraq. Drawing down Afghanistan. Drone strikes. Killing Bin Laden.

Is that what Putin should be afraid of? Obama's gonna send SEAL Team Six after him in his sleep? Obama's gonna crash his goddaughter's wedding with a laser-guided missile?

Even just looking at the events of the past few weeks, it should be obvious that however strong it may appear in some contexts, Putin is justified in thinking Obama's foreign policy is too weak to pose any serious risk to him in the Ukraine. Obama may have big guns in his arsenal, but only an idiot would think he's a big scary man with his finger on the trigger, ready to shoot.
 
dudalb said:
Ah, the Ron Paul viewpoint.

Just subsitute Czechoslovakia for Crimea,Germany for Russia,and the UK for the U.S. and you have a perfect statement for the Appeasers in Britian in 1938.
It amusing to see Ron Paul,who makes such a big thing about individual liberty, carrying the water for Putin.
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Has anyone stopped to ask the question: Why is it in the interest of the U.K. that Sudeten territory, which is populated by 54% German people, and was part of Austria/Germany before it was signed over to the Czechoslovakia in 1918, continue to be part of the Czechoslovakia , and not Germany, even though a majority of its population would prefer to be part of Germany?

This is a case where the U.K. clearly has no vital interest and should not interfere.


Wow dudalb, You're right.
 
As to the OP question, I don't think it's a case of Putin thinking the US is weak, but more a case of whether he understands that the West really has little interest in going to war with a strong military such as Russia over this sort of action.
 
Didn't America demonstrate its own weakness this millenium by embarking on two wars of choice with the result being a huge loss of blood, treasure and prestige?

Ironically, America's message of strength to the world after 9/11 did the exact opposite. Maybe don't throw your troops at every problem (especially ones that troops can't solve) - and then you won't look so weak.

All that aside, if the primary filter through which we analyze Russian actions is the extent to which American actions/inaction informs those Russian actions, our analysis will probably fall short of accurately describing Russian motivations, leaving many variables undercounted or not counted at all. This whole line of thinking is hopelessly lost in American navel-gazing and myopia.
 
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