• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Challenge applications

DowserDon

Student
D
Joined
May 5, 2011
Messages
28
Why does your link to Challenge Applications show that the last person to challenge for the $1 million, applied on 22nd August 2009?
I am awaiting testing for my ability to dowse and I'd feel comforted to know that the $1 million is still available.
Thanks
DowserDon
 
I don't think anyone's maintaining that section anymore.
Have you applied for the challenge? Do you meet the requirements?
 
AIUI the JREF staff member who used to keep the challenge application subforum updated left and none of the current staff have the time/motivation to do so. Note that this forum and JREF are two seperate entities. There have certainly been applicants tested since August 2009.

Can I ask what self tests you have done of your dowsing ability? In particular, have you done any blind tests?
 
To add to what others have said...
JREF posts a copy of the financial statement showing that the money is available.

You say you are "awaiting testing." If you're willing to share, could you post your application or other information?
 
DowserDon said:
Why does your link to Challenge Applications show that the last person to challenge for the $1 million, applied on 22nd August 2009?
I am awaiting testing for my ability to dowse and I'd feel comforted to know that the $1 million is still available.
Thanks
DowserDon
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure James Randi has said that he's done testing dowsers. He's tested literally hundreds of them, and is tired of that particular self-delusion.
 
If that's official, is it noted on the Challenge page? Worth a write up.
 
DowserDon,

I don't know how long your application has been "in the hopper" at JREF, but you should know that JREF is not the only place offering a cash prize if you can prove your ability to dowse. I don't know where you live, but you might find one of these other organizations easier to get to and easier to work with locally. Their prizes are all less than a million dollars, but passing any one of these tests will get you some money and it would force the JREF to take you very seriously.

Here's a list of places you could try:

There's the Australian Skeptics' AU$100,000 Prize
http://www.skeptics.com.au/features/prize/
They also offer AU$20,000 as a "Spotter's Fee"

There's the IIG's US$50,000 Challenge in California, USA
They now have affiliates in Atlanta, GA and Washington, DC and are developing affiliates in Denver, CO, Calgary, Canada and probably other places as well.
http://www.iigwest.org/challenge.html
They also offer US$5,000 as a "Finder's Fee"

There's the North Texas Skeptic's US$12,000 Challenge in the USA
http://www.ntskeptics.org/challenge/challenge.htm

There's Prabir Ghosh's 2,000,000 Rupee Challenge in India
http://rationalistprabir.bravehost.com/

There's the Swedish 100,000SeK prize offered by Humanisterna
http://www.humanisterna.se/index.php...d=27&Itemid=49

The Tampa Bay Skeptics offers a US$1000 prize in Florida, USA
http://www.tampabayskeptics.org/challenges.html

In Canada there's the CAN$10,000 from the Quebec Skeptics
http://www.sceptiques.qc.ca/activites/defi

In the UK, the ASKE organization offers £14,000
http://www.aske-skeptics.org.uk/challenge_rules.htm

Tony Youens in the UK offers £5,000
http://www.tonyyouens.com/challenge.htm

In Finland, Skepsis offers 10,000 Euros
http://www.skepsis.fi/haaste/

The Fayetteville Freethinkers in Arkansas, USA offer a US$1000 prize
http://fayfreethinkers.com/

There's a 1,000,000 Yuan prize in China offered by Sima Nan. This is his blog: http://blog.sina.com.cn/simanan

The Belgian SKEPP organization offers a 10,500 Euro prize
http://www.skepp.be/prijzen/de-sisyphus-prijs/

If you find any broken links, or know of any tests not on this list, please notify me in this thread.

Good Luck,

Ward
 
I'm pretty confident that the prize will never be claimed. Unless someone finds a way to get around the protocol, which is highly unlikely.
 
maggot9779 said:
Unless someone finds a way to get around the protocol, which is highly unlikely.
Click to expand...
Right. The JREF very tightly guards against cheating, and doesn't let anyone deviate from the negotiated protocol. If someone could do what they claimed, they'd be able to do it even when following the protocol they helped design.

DowserDon,
As others have said, the JREF staff who used to maintain the log here (Kramer, Jeff Wagg, and RemieV) have moved on. AFAIK the challenge is still open and the money is still waiting to be won. This page http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html is the JREF's official $1M challenge page (I'm not affiliated with the JREF so anything I say is my own opinion, not the JREF's, and I may be wrong).

Banachek is the challenge administrator, and his contact page has an email address that you can use if you have any questions.
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/contact-the-jref/12-contacts/6-challenge-administrator.html

You wrote that you're "awaiting testing". How long has it been? Do you remember when you applied?

Pixel42 mentioned blind tests. I suggest that you do test your own abilities before applying lest you find out that you've be misleading yourself or can't perform in test conditions. People on the forum have helped work out informal self-tests before. If you tell us what you can do, perhaps we can help you devise a way to test yourself. A blind test would require help from a friend during the test.
 
As for practice, you need heaps. Failure to practice using the protocols agreed to leaves one looking rather foolish after the test.

connie sonne said:
Hi Steenkh, and thank you. About winning the challenge, people can think what they want to think, I actually don`t care,:).We`ll see.
Thank`s for your advice, but as I wrote before, I do not have to practice, and I don`t have problems at all, :). And GzuzKryzt, I do know, that the criticising here on the forum it`s not about me personal, but people come further, if it`s "friendly" criticising, :D!
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
This is what one person wrote before she was tested by JREF. After the test she made unsubstantiated accusations of cheating. If only she had practised until she could do what she claimed. Then she would not have failed the test. Google her name and the main results are that she failed.
 
rjh01 said:
As for practice, you need heaps. Failure to practice using the protocols agreed to leaves one looking rather foolish after the test.


This is what one person wrote before she was tested by JREF. After the test she made unsubstantiated accusations of cheating. If only she had practised until she could do what she claimed. Then she would not have failed the test. Google her name and the main results are that she failed.
Click to expand...
my bolding

One can develop psychic powers simply by practising???

Stop the presses!
 
Thank you all for your helpful replies, particularly Wardenclyffe. I didn't know there were so many prizes on offer.
Yes, my application has been received and registered by Banachek. I was merely wondering why my name was not listed under Challenge Applications and was worried by an earlier note that the Challenge was due to end in 2010. I understand that it is difficult to keep such information up to date.
I live in the UK and am awaiting assessment but have yet to agree a testing protocol. I have designed a suitable double blind test that is different from those previously used by Randi and others to test dowsers and am awaiting discussion on it. The appointed academic assessor is very busy.
When that has been agreed I will be willing to publish details.
To get to the States for a final assessment would be expensive and so a local test prize would be very useful. However would a small prize here invalidate my claim at JREF?
 
DowserDon,

Before I write anything, please realize that I do not represent the JREF in any way. That being said, I've followed this kind of stuff for years (as have many others around here) and have a pretty good idea about how things work. But the Million Dollar Challenge is evolving and its status is currently in flux, so as a recent applicant, you might know more than any regular poster here about what's going on with the Challenge.

You mentioned an "appointed academic assessor." Is this because you are being asked by the JREF to produce an affidavit from someone involved in academics? This used to be a requirement. It's been suggested in the past that this requirement might be going away. But it seems like maybe it's still in place. Is that what you were talking about or is it something else?

If you are struggling in that area, that's all the more reason to check out the ASKE or Tony Youens challenges. Passing either of those would pretty much guarantee that you would get all the media and academic attention you would need to qualify for the MDC.

As far as I can tell, winning a local prize would only enhance your standing with the JREF MDC as opposed to invalidating it.

Even if it were to disqualify you (and again, it shouldn't), winning the local prize would likely insure that you would have a very, very lucrative career for the rest of your life, especially if you dowse for things that people actually want, like water or gold. If you can only dowse for fingernail clippings, then winning the prizes is the best you can hope for.

Good luck,
Ward

P.S. When did you submit your application? You really are in a unique position to let us know your experience as an applicant with the prize being under new administration and (perhaps) new rules.
 
Far from invalidating it, winning one of the smaller prizes listed by wardencliffe would advance your JREF application considerably. I'm pretty sure JREF has said that such a win would be sufficient for them to waive the publicity and academic qualifications they usually require. You would have far greater credibility than any previous applicant, JREF would be very eager indeed to test you.

Is there any particular way in which you think the standard blinded test protocol is deficient? I'm curious as to why you think you need a different one.
 
My application was in May 2011. I did submit two affidavits from academically qualified people. Professor French was appointed to agree a testing protocol with me in September 2011. Although I have communicated with him by e-mail and despite promises to "get back to me before Christmas", I am still awaiting his comments on my suggestions. He is "extremely busy". I have contacted ASKE and Tony Youens and both replied quickly asking for details.
When an agreement has been reached on the testing protocol (or if no agreement is reached) I will post details. Until then I think it prudent to wait.
Thanks for your help.
DowserDon
 
Thanks DowserDon,

I'm glad the links worked. I think that might be the first time anyone's used them.

Ward

P.S. Who's Professor French?
 
Last edited:
DowserDon said:
My application was in May 2011. I did submit two affidavits from academically qualified people. Professor French was appointed to agree a testing protocol with me in September 2011. Although I have communicated with him by e-mail and despite promises to "get back to me before Christmas", I am still awaiting his comments on my suggestions. He is "extremely busy". I have contacted ASKE and Tony Youens and both replied quickly asking for details.
When an agreement has been reached on the testing protocol (or if no agreement is reached) I will post details. Until then I think it prudent to wait.
Thanks for your help.
DowserDon
Click to expand...

Can you at least tell us if your protocol involves going out to the field and dowsing an area that hasn't been dowsed and actually digging in the location you select?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom