Bloomberg for President?

[The Great Zaganza]

There are winnable voters that voted for Trump that could swing back to a Democratic candidate. These people aren't MAGA chuds.

I haven't seen any evidence of this.
Maybe former Trump voters will stay at home in 2020, but that will be because they are disenchanted with him.
I'd love to see some Trump to Sander defection, but as mentioned I haven't seen any so far.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I haven't seen any evidence of this.
Maybe former Trump voters will stay at home in 2020, but that will be because they are disenchanted with him.
I'd love to see some Trump to Sander defection, but as mentioned I haven't seen any so far.

I think it's premature at this point. Candidates won't start really targeting the general election audience until after the primary is settled.

 

[Donal]

Nobody wins people over by pointing out their idol has clay feet.

People who already want to get rid of Trump will love it, of course. But their votes are already secured. Spending millions to win their hearts would be redundant, and a waste of money.

The real question is, how excited do voters in swing states get, about a billionaire running a billion dollar dirt digging campaign on a candidate those voters already know is dirty.

We've established in the Yale group thread that 2016 voters had enough information to make an informed decision about voting for Donald Trump. Lecturing them about stuff they already assumed was true and already took into account is kinda patronizing, and could backfire.

Also, one percenters using vast wealth to go after political enemies is likely to turn off a lot of people.

Pretty much. If they are still voting Trump, they are either the rabid fan base with lots of guns and little smarts, or they are "sensible Republicans" who will fall in line and support whoever the party puts up.

The "undecided" voters aren't going to be swayed by more political mudslinging. Especially from a Jewish finance guy from New York who owns a media company. That plays right into a lot of the nasty things the Republicans have been saying.

And Bloomberg himself is not a great candidate. As mentioned above, progressive and black votes (of which there are a lot more of and greater overlap between than people realize) are not going to support him due to things like stop-and-frisk and the expanding income inequality divide while he was mayor.

Hard core establishments Dems won't back him because he ran as a Republican for mayor of New York, then switched to independent. They can't trust him.

At best, he can leverage a personal relationships with the big donors, but there are already a bunch of Dem candidates getting their money.

The moderate a right wing "centrists" won't back him because he is so loud about guns and the environment. And soda. They won't back him because it wouldn't be "strategic".

What exactly does he bring to the table? He was a Republican mayor of a city that is experiencing the fallout of his economic policies?

 

[Bob001]

Pretty much. If they are still voting Trump, they are either the rabid fan base with lots of guns and little smarts, or they are "sensible Republicans" who will fall in line and support whoever the party puts up.
.....

I dunno. They haven't actually voted yet, and won't for a long time. It's undisputed that a certain percentage of Trump voters had voted for Obama previously. It's not that they loved Trump (or Obama, either), but they voted for the disruptive, anti-establishment candidate. Now Trump is the establishment candidate. He has compiled a record of not doing much for the people he claimed he would help, and farmers, out-of-work factory workers, communities wrecked by opioids, etc. know it. And that's even if they're willing to accept Trump's stupidity, cruelty and general incompetence. The Trumpers might not vote for Bloomberg, but it wouldn't be a surprise at all if they shift back to a Democrat that they can live with.

And I wouldn't write Bloomberg off yet. He has proven that he is a skilled politician, his record of accomplishment goes way beyond stop-and-frisk and soda taxes, and he has unlimited resources.

 

[ArchSas]

It's not that they loved Trump (or Obama, either), but they voted for the disruptive, anti-establishment candidate. Now Trump is the establishment candidate. He has compiled a record of not doing much for the people he claimed he would help, and farmers, out-of-work factory workers, communities wrecked by opioids, etc. know it. And that's even if they're willing to accept Trump's stupidity, cruelty and general incompetence. The Trumpers might not vote for Bloomberg, but it wouldn't be a surprise at all if they shift back to a Democrat that they can live with.

Yep, this. I know a few former Trump fans that have recently expressed die-hard support for Andrew Yang. One of them singled out Trump's comments on gun control as the sole reason he'll refuse to vote for him in the future (hint to the Democratic party: make a bunch of smear ads with Trump openly saying he'd take guns without due process and turn it into an issue; it'll probably take away more of his support than focusing on the racism, sadly). On a wider scale, when Andrew Yang first started getting his name out there, he drew a lot of support from white nationalists who thought Trump had let them down, and who saw Yang as the only candidate who cared about poor white people. I also knew a couple of people that were Bernie Bros and ended up voting for Trump.

Are there Trump fanatics out there can't be swayed? Absolutely, hell, it's probably most of his base at his point. But a big part of his draw in the first place was the guise of being a destructive, anti-establishment candidate. People who supported that version of Trump can probably be swayed to vote for any candidate they see as sufficiently anti-establishment, be it Yang, Bernie, or whoever else. I don't think there's any way Bloomberg would appeal to those people, though.

 

[Donal]

I dunno. They haven't actually voted yet, and won't for a long time. It's undisputed that a certain percentage of Trump voters had voted for Obama previously. It's not that they loved Trump (or Obama, either), but they voted for the disruptive, anti-establishment candidate. Now Trump is the establishment candidate. He has compiled a record of not doing much for the people he claimed he would help, and farmers, out-of-work factory workers, communities wrecked by opioids, etc. know it. And that's even if they're willing to accept Trump's stupidity, cruelty and general incompetence. The Trumpers might not vote for Bloomberg, but it wouldn't be a surprise at all if they shift back to a Democrat that they can live with.

Some of those people were the ones I referred to as "independent" or "undecided". But, a lot of those folks also weren't looks for an "anti-establishment" candidate. They wanted someone who would tell them they were all right and it was other people who were wrong. They wanted a big strong man to protect them.

And I wouldn't write Bloomberg off yet. He has proven that he is a skilled politician, his record of accomplishment goes way beyond stop-and-frisk and soda taxes, and he has unlimited resources.

Sure, there was increased economic discrepancy, gentrification, publicly financed stadiums, what else can we sell him with?

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I don't think the negative effect of stop-and-frisk had on Bloomberg's reputation can be overstated.

It was a city sponsored campaign of police harassment, disproportionately targeting poor black and hispanic people and subjecting them to unprovoked violation of bodily autonomy. It was racist, unconstitutional, and largely ineffective.

It is a policy that Bloomberg has been unapologetic about for years, despite overwhelming data showing clear racial bias and ineffectiveness.

 

[Juniversal]

Just what we need another bland centrist center right Democrat to disappoint us once again. No thanks..

 

[JoeMorgue]

Okay seriously at the rate we're going every registered Democrat is going to announce their Presidency before the election and all just vote for themselves. Trumps going to win and second place is going to be every Democrat in the country tied with one vote.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Trying to win over Trump voters is a lost cause: if someone hasn't jumped the Trump ship by now, they would rather drown with him than admit that they have been conned.

Many of the have. What you don't want is some of them jumping back on board because they fear things like Medicare for all.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Just what we need another bland centrist center right Democrat to disappoint us once again. No thanks..

I agree but I'd rather have Bloomberg than Biden if those were the choices. Biden will be smeared, and like a lot of lies, if there is a thread of truth to it, the lie is easily accepted.

 

[mgidm86]

I haven't seen any evidence of this.
Maybe former Trump voters will stay at home in 2020, but that will be because they are disenchanted with him.
I'd love to see some Trump to Sander defection, but as mentioned I haven't seen any so far.

You really expect to see Trump voters, whether still supporting him or not, switching to Bernie? I can't imagine anything more unlikely.

 

[Brainster]

You really expect to see Trump voters, whether still supporting him or not, switching to Bernie? I can't imagine anything more unlikely.

In 2016, there wasn't a lot of difference between Bernie and Trump on the issue of trade and trade agreements; indeed this is why Trump did so well among blue-collar workers in the Rust Belt.

 

[mgidm86]

Many of the have. What you don't want is some of them jumping back on board because they fear things like Medicare for all.

This is why I hope Trump resigns and another Republican takes his place before the election. I think the Democrats are too far left to attract any conservative voters, or steal disheartened Trump supporters. That's Fantasy Island stuff there.

If a Republican is going to win, and they have a good chance, I'd rather it not be Trump. I don't see any Dem candidates that I like either. I may abstain. Pfft what's the difference I live in Cali, my vote goes Dem no matter who I actually vote for. Trump won a lot of districts here but all 55 votes went to Hillary. I hate that.

If these Trump voters don't have another Republican to vote for I doubt most will see anything attractive in any of the Dem candidates. They're too far left for them.

See my post above about Trump voters switching to Bernie. Not gonna happen.

 

[mgidm86]

In 2016, there wasn't a lot of difference between Bernie and Trump on the issue of trade and trade agreements; indeed this is why Trump did so well among blue-collar workers in the Rust Belt.

But do you expect many Trump supporters to switch to Bernie? I don't.

I'm not that conservative and I never really liked Trump, but I would never ever vote for Sanders or anyone like him, policy-wise. Not even to keep Trump out.

 

[Venom]

But do you expect many Trump supporters to switch to Bernie? I don't.

I'm not that conservative and I never really liked Trump, but I would never ever vote for Sanders or anyone like him, policy-wise. Not even to keep Trump out.

Who's anyone like him?

Where's the bar? If you watch mainstream news you might get the impression that everyone from Barack Obama to Elizabeth Warren is "just like" Bernie, the "radical leftist" Democrats.

 

[Bob001]

You really expect to see Trump voters, whether still supporting him or not, switching to Bernie? I can't imagine anything more unlikely.

Why not? A lot of Bernie voters switched to Trump. They both ran as anti-establishment outsiders. The difference now is that Sanders is still an outsider, but Trump is at the center of the establishment with a first-term record.

Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election.

https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/5458...voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds

Also,

Bernie Sanders supporters switched their allegiance to Donald Trump in large enough numbers last November to sway the election for the real estate billionaire, according to an analysis of voter data released Tuesday by the blog Political Wire.

https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-trump-2016-election-654320

 

[Bob001]

....
I'm not that conservative and I never really liked Trump, but I would never ever vote for Sanders or anyone like him, policy-wise. Not even to keep Trump out.

What does "conservative" even mean to you? Sanders is basically what used to be called a Hubert Humphrey Democrat. He only looks like he's on the left because the opposition has moved so far to the extreme right. Sanders key issues are universal health care, affordable college, fair taxes and worker rights. Nixon tried to pass a universal health insurance plan in 1973, but the Dems held out for single-payer and nobody got anything. College as recently as the '80s was cheap enough that kids could work their way through with summer jobs, and some public systems -- like California's -- were basically free. When Jimmy Carter left office, the top marginal tax rate was 70%. Reagan pushed it down as far as 28%, resulting in the massive income and wealth disparities that we face today. And Reagan's union-busting had as much to do as anything with the stagnation of wages for ordinary workers.

What specific Sanders positions do you find offensive?

 

[Juniversal]

Why not? A lot of Bernie voters switched to Trump. They both ran as anti-establishment outsiders. The difference now is that Sanders is still an outsider, but Trump is at the center of the establishment with a first-term record.

Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election.
https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/5458...voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds

Also,

https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-trump-2016-election-654320

I don't see your average Trump supporter switching to Bernie. Bernie is far more unconventional within the context of American politics. Trump is (on paper) a conservative, gun swinging, big talking, free market capitalist. He's a caricature of an American politician while many of his supports (or Americans in general) think socialism or anything adjacent to socialism is kryptonite.

 

[Donal]

Many of the have. What you don't want is some of them jumping back on board because they fear things like Medicare for all.

That is why you need a candidate who believes in Medicare for All and can explain it plainly. You also need the party itself to back it fully. Corporate friendly Republican-lite candidates using disingenuous Heritage Foundation terms like "choice" are just muddying things up.

And again, Bloomberg was never the Democratic mayor of New York. He's no friend to poor or minorities.